SOS Balloon device. Thoughts?

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popPilot

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Pop Pilot
Came across this emergency device, find it very interesting, what do you guys think?
 
That's pretty cool. Would be really handy in forested areas.
 
popPilot said:
Came across this emergency device, find it very interesting, what do you guys think?
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Back when cell phones were not tjst good, coverage and technogy-wise, my mountain hike emergency kit contained the following items, among other things:

Handheld GPS receiver, so we always knew where we were. Batteries lasted more than 24 hours in that thing (continous use, we never kept it on continuously).
Handheld radio, that one was capable to receive/transmit in the VFH/UHF bands as well as the VHF AM band. The idea was to be able to relay our position to a passing airliner and ask them to notify rescue services.
Strobe light/mirror.

Today your phone will give you GPS position, as well as a modest strobe light capability and you can use it as a decent mirror if needed. Make sure to bring a power bank with you, maybe one with a solar panel.
That and an aviation band handheld radio will get you out of trouble faster than almost anything else.
 
Dave Theisen said:
I thought thread was about this SOS balloon. :)
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Dang. Beat me too it!

Years ago we're driving down the highway returning to the field after dinner in town. Margy says, "Look at the harvest moon." I pointed out that wasn't the moon, it was the beer tent.
 
AV8R_87 said:
Today your phone will give you GPS position, as well as a modest strobe light capability and you can use it as a decent mirror if needed. Make sure to bring a power bank with you, maybe one with a solar panel.
That and an aviation band handheld radio will get you out of trouble faster than almost anything else.
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And it assumes that you are capable of using it all once you have crashed. People are often incapacitated and are stuck in the airplane with two broken legs or a broken back or are unconscious. This is why the ELT was invented: it will activate (it's supposed to activate) and will transmit the distress signal even if you are dead. Newer ELTS are a lot more reliable than the earlier 121.5 models, and a lot more reliable than expecting a pilot or passenger to find and operate emergency equipment.

In the forest, the airplane can go down and the trees close back over it. No balloon is going to find its way out, and even a ten-foot balloon would be hard to spot if it got altitude. The two-foot balloon in that video is just about invisible from a searcher's point of view, and the wind would whip it around and puncture it on the trees.

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Dan Thomas said:
The two-foot balloon in that video is just about invisible from a searcher's point of view, and the wind would whip it around and puncture it on the trees.
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Nothing that can't be fixed with bigger balls:
balls.jpg
 
Dan Thomas said:
And it assumes that you are capable of using it all once you have crashed. People are often incapacitated and are stuck in the airplane with two broken legs or a broken back or are unconscious. This is why the ELT was invented: it will activate (it's supposed to activate) and will transmit the distress signal even if you are dead. Newer ELTS are a lot more reliable than the earlier 121.5 models, and a lot more reliable than expecting a pilot or passenger to find and operate emergency equipment.

In the forest, the airplane can go down and the trees close back over it. No balloon is going to find its way out, and even a ten-foot balloon would be hard to spot if it got altitude. The two-foot balloon in that video is just about invisible from a searcher's point of view, and the wind would whip it around and puncture it on the trees.
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This is why I'm fan of a PLB (which you'd activate prior to touchdown) to compliment an ELT. I have an ACR one that I keep on my boat, but grab and put in my pocket anytime I fly somewhere remote which is rare. Even then I'm IFR 99% of the time so talking to ATC who should have a pretty good idea of my location if something were to happen.
 
I should mention, once again, that in my home province of BC there are many airplanes that have gone missing and have never been found. Last I heard it was around 100 aircraft. Occasionally someone stumbles across one, or the search for a new crash spots an airplane that's been missing for decades. BC is all forests and mountains and water, all really good at hiding crashed airplanes.

A white airplane in winter, or a green or brown one in summer, is going to be really hard for the searchers to spot. The best bet, even though it's not perfect, is a 406 ELT, mounted exactly as per the installation manual, and maintained and tested annually. But I have found nice new 406s just screwed to the old skin-mounted 121.5 ELT base, where it will promptly be torn off in a crash or the vibrations of the crash will prevent the G-switches from firing. The manuals warn of that, yet mechanics continue to waste the owner's money with a cheap and dirty installation.
 
tsts4 said:
This is why I'm fan of a PLB (which you'd activate prior to touchdown) to compliment an ELT. I have an ACR one that I keep on my boat, but grab and put in my pocket anytime I fly somewhere remote which is rare. Even then I'm IFR 99% of the time so talking to ATC who should have a pretty good idea of my location if something were to happen.
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You can fire a 406 before crashing, too. A remote switch in the panel is part of the mandatory installation stuff. But neither that or your ACR will work if the VFR pilot flies into IMC and the cloud has granite in it, as is so often the case in mountainous country.

In so much of this world there is no radar coverage or ATC communication, especially in areas where airplanes disappear easily. No cell service either. The Spot or Spidertracks stuff is a better bet than a handheld PLB, IMHO.
 
Dan Thomas said:
But neither that or your ACR will work if the VFR pilot flies into IMC and the cloud has granite in it,
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Never quite heard it put that way. Humorous, unless you're the one finding the granite ... :eek:
 
Dan Thomas said:
And it assumes that you are capable of using it all once you have crashed.
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Same as the balloon. A life jacket or mylar blanket will have the same limitations. And there have been enough cases wjere the ELT didn't operate as intended, for various reasons.
I guess the idea is that it pays off to have a plan B, if practical.

Daleandee said:
Never quite heard it put that way.
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Early in my training I was taught that the most dangerous cloud type was the cumulogranite.
 
Dan Thomas said:
And it assumes that you are capable of using it all once you have crashed. People are often incapacitated and are stuck in the airplane with two broken legs or a broken back or are unconscious. This is why the ELT was invented: it will activate (it's supposed to activate) and will transmit the distress signal even if you are dead. Newer ELTS are a lot more reliable than the earlier 121.5 models, and a lot more reliable than expecting a pilot or passenger to find and operate emergency equipment.

In the forest, the airplane can go down and the trees close back over it. No balloon is going to find its way out, and even a ten-foot balloon would be hard to spot if it got altitude. The two-foot balloon in that video is just about invisible from a searcher's point of view, and the wind would whip it around and puncture it on the trees.

View attachment 136050
View attachment 136051
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How many people have been saved by an ELT (that wouldn't have been saved without it)?
 
Dan Thomas said:
The Spot or Spidertracks stuff is a better bet than a handheld PLB, IMHO.
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Or InReach, which is, like spidertracks, on Iridium. I would never trust spot for SAR.

Now, that said, all those solutions have a common issue: Subscriptions

PLBs are great because they don't require a subscription.
 
Had a Bonanza crash at our airport a few years ago in fog. Within ONE MINUTE the Air Force called to say there was an ELT signal on the airport property. The guy had a fractured pelvis and ribs, but managed to call 911. They were looking for him about a quarter mile away. Airport employees didn't find him at first, because he crashed short of the runway outside the fence, and it was foggy. What impressed me was the short time period from the ELT signal and the phone call.
 
Salty said:
How many people have been saved by an ELT (that wouldn't have been saved without it)?
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I can't find any hard numbers there. Some numbers for 2023, from https://www.noaa.gov/news-release/noaa-satellites-helped-save-350-lives-in-2023

It also says that 98% of alarms are false. It doesn't say how many of those are blamed on 406s.

Of the 350 U.S. rescues last year, 255 people were pulled from the water, 44 were saved from aviation incidents and 51 were rescued on land, where PLBs were used. The record one-year total for SARSAT rescues in the U.S. stands at 421 in 2019.


Outside of that, the discussion gets philosophical. I remember reading an article maybe 15 years ago about annual ELT maintenance. The author admitted that ELTs have many failure modes including sinking, destruction by fire, being scattered across a rock face along with the rest of the airplane and its occupants, or having its antenna torn of or buried in the dirt. But, he said, suppose you make a fairly successful forced landing in the trees, but are hidden by them. Your ELT was not maintained and didn't work and no amount of fooling with it will wake it up because its battery is shot or has leaked and corroded everything inside. You see SAR aircraft flying around looking for you. They make a couple of passes a few miles apart. You try to signal with your emergency mirror. You try to start a smoky fire real quick. Nothing works. You realize, once the airplanes stop coming around, that you have sold your life for the price of an annual ELT test and inspection.

That might be true in only a few percent of cases, but it sure mattered to the people it applied to.
 
The newest generation of iPhone has built-in satellite messaging capability, I think Android devices are starting to roll it out too. That seems hard to beat for emergency communication- something you and your passengers all likely have in your pockets.
 
Dan Thomas said:
I remember reading an article maybe 15 years ago about annual ELT maintenance. The author admitted that ELTs have many failure modes including sinking, destruction by fire, being scattered across a rock face along with the rest of the airplane and its occupants, or having its antenna torn of or buried in the dirt. But, he said, suppose you make a fairly successful forced landing in the trees, but are hidden by them. Your ELT was not maintained and didn't work and no amount of fooling with it will wake it up because its battery is shot or has leaked and corroded everything inside. You see SAR aircraft flying around looking for you. They make a couple of passes a few miles apart. You try to signal with your emergency mirror. You try to start a smoky fire real quick. Nothing works. You realize, once the airplanes stop coming around, that you have sold your life for the price of an annual ELT test and inspection.
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From what I understand, SAR can and does triangulate/home on your cellphone signal nowadays, so that 15 year old quote is a bit dated.

That said, I am a belt & suspenders type of person. And also a big fan of not violating FAR's, which require that the ELT be inspected and maintained.
 
popPilot said:
Came across this emergency device, find it very interesting, what do you guys think?
Click to expand...
I think 45 meters (148 feet) isn't near enough string for the Cascade Mountains. Many of those trees are over 200 feet (61 meters) tall.
 
Survival equipment could include a brightly colored tarp that can be spread out in whatever clearing might be available. Or on accessible trees. Orange or yellow or maybe a bright blue. Something that contrasts with the surrounding vegetation, and bigger than the wings or whatever. Canadian regs outline the stuff this way:

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