Thinking about a T-6

Ed Haywood

Ed Haywood

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Big Ed
I've just about talked my buddy into going in on a T-6 with me.

Timeline is next 12-24 months. Will depend on my progress in achieving aerobatic goals, since I would probably need to sell my Decathlon.

I have just about an ideal maintenance situation. My partner is an A&P/IA who has plenty of experience with radial engine warbirds and a well equipped facility.

Goal would be to get into formation flight and participate in NATA clinics, which might eventually become a gateway drug to higher performance warbirds.

One big hole in my skillset: I am not IFR rated. I'm thinking I should plan on knocking that out before pulling the trigger.

Thoughts on T-6 ownership from those with experience?
 
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Oh ya. Go for it. I can’t think of a single downside. Got one picked out yet? Shoot pics as soon as ya can!!!
















Oh ya, I maybe sorta kinda don’t have any experience along these lines… just sayin. But never mind that! Woo hoo!!
 
If you can swing the fuel consumption without it dissuading usage of the plane...

I've not been in one but know the wife of a guy who had one. Their daughter was getting married and he took the groom for a flight the day before the wedding. Low level aerobatics over water beside the beach. They went into the water and both perished. Be careful.
 
What a coincidence; I've been thinking about a Decathalon ;)
 
This’ll be interesting. Maybe do a T-6 checkout course instead of the instrument rating because I can’t see doing a whole lot of IMC in one, even if it’s equipped appropriately but that’s just me.
 
Ed: Would suggest spending some time here and joining the organization if you think you are serious about moving to a T-6.

flynata.org

Home - NATA

NATA is an non-profit 501(c)(3) corporation dedicated to the preservation, restoration, and safe operation of North American Aviation trainers through the education of its members and the public.
flynata.org flynata.org
 
TCABM said:
This’ll be interesting. Maybe do a T-6 checkout course instead of the instrument rating because I can’t see doing a whole lot of IMC in one, even if it’s equipped appropriately but that’s just me.
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That was my thought, only reason I can think to do the instrument rating just to fly the T-6 would for insurance requirement/cost.

Brian
 
brcase said:
That was my thought, only reason I can think to do the instrument rating just to fly the T-6 would for insurance requirement/cost.

Brian
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That was my logic.

Craig said:
Ed: Would suggest spending some time here and joining the organization if you think you are serious about moving to a T-6.

flynata.org

Home - NATA

NATA is an non-profit 501(c)(3) corporation dedicated to the preservation, restoration, and safe operation of North American Aviation trainers through the education of its members and the public.
flynata.org flynata.org
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Yep, that is a key part of the plan. Getting into their formation clinics is a big factor in my interest in a T-6.

Also planning on getting involved with SkyRanch in South Carolina. They have a fly in planned for late Sept that I'll probably go to, just to make connections.

www.flyingmag.com

Building the New American Dream SkyRanch

Thom Richard, owner of American Dream SkyRanch (18SC) in Ninety Six, South Carolina, plans to host airshows and other aviation events at what he hopes will become an aviation epicenter in The Carolinas.
www.flyingmag.com www.flyingmag.com
 
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Did a flight in one years ago in Kissimmee Florida,was great. Go for it
 
I’m not sure insurance cares about instrument for a t-6. I think lots of tail wheel and retract time will be more important. As well as time in type, which is harder to get.
 
FORANE said:
I've not been in one but know the wife of a guy who had one. Their daughter was getting married and he took the groom for a flight the day before the wedding. Low level aerobatics over water beside the beach. They went into the water and both perished. Be careful.
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I talked to a guy flying one at SnF a few years ago. I asked him what I needed to know. He took me around to the side of the aircraft. Stenciled on the side of the fuselage over the top of the handhold in 6 inch block letters was this: "Do Not Stall."
 
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Salty said:
I’m not sure insurance cares about instrument for a t-6. I think lots of tail wheel and retract time will be more important. As well as time in type, which is harder to get.
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Yeah, agreed. I've got plenty of TW time, but retract is a different story.

My would-be partner collects vintage aircraft. He owns a Twin Beech, a C-47, and a Grumman Widgeon, among others. We also have a BT-13 Vultee on the field. So I've got some opportunities to get stick time in other aircraft, retracts included. I haven't discussed insurance with him, but I can probably get added to his policy, rather than starting from scratch.

After the first year, time in type won't be a problem, because I plan to fly the heck out of it.
 
Ed Haywood said:
I talked to a guy flying one at SnF a few years ago. I asked him what I needed to know. He took me around to the side of the aircraft. Stenciled on the side of the fuselage over the top of the handhold in 6 inch block letters was this: "Do Not Stall."
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I've got a whopping ~1.5 in an SNJ doing pretty much nothing but stalls or maneuvers that resulted in stalls/departures under a variety of conditions and I wholeheartedly agree with that sentiment.

Nauga,
rolling over and playing dead
 
Fella at my field had a beautiful AT6 for many years. Finally sold it and the new owner promptly ground looped it on his first landing.
 
Ed Haywood said:
Yeah, agreed. I've got plenty of TW time, but retract is a different story.

My would-be partner collects vintage aircraft. He owns a Twin Beech, a C-47, and a Grumman Widgeon, among others. We also have a BT-13 Vultee on the field. So I've got some opportunities to get stick time in other aircraft, retracts included. I haven't discussed insurance with him, but I can probably get added to his policy, rather than starting from scratch.

After the first year, time in type won't be a problem, because I plan to fly the heck out of it.
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Either way, that sounds like a great person to form a partnership with!
 
Been up in couple of SNJ / T-6s and had a blast. Thought about buying a T-6 or a T-34 but the operating costs are outside my budget. Well, I really don’t have a specific budget but the fuel bill for the T-6 alone would be depressing.

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Velocity173 said:
Been up in couple of SNJ / T-6s and had a blast. Thought about buying a T-6 or a T-34 but the operating costs are outside my budget. Well, I really don’t have a specific budget but the fuel bill for the T-6 alone would be depressing.

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Operating costs on a T-34 wouldn't be any worse than a Bonanza. But, the real sucky part of the T-34 is it's not experimental.

I realized that when I was looking at T-34 and Stearman. In both cases, you're saddled with the type cert.
 
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Velocity173 said:
Thought about buying a T-6 or a T-34 but the operating costs are outside my budget. Well, I really don’t have a specific budget but the fuel bill for the T-6 alone would be depressing.
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Fuel cost will be higher, but total cost of ownership should be manageable. Fuel burn in cruise is 32 GPH, but I burn 20 GPH doing acro in the Decathlon. Partner is an IA, so maintenance cost will be parts only, and he owns the hangar. Hopefully I can piggyback on his insurance too. Sale of the Decathlon should cover my half of purchase, more or less.
 
I've been flying T-6's for about 10 years now. I'm the Standardization Officer for NATA and a formation checkpilot; also in the process of buying a T-6.

Tailwheel experience will help with insurance, it is definitely in the complex/high performance/retract category so a lot of time in other things that swing gear, have moving props, etc will help with insurance as well.

I H I G H L Y recommend getting type training from someone who does it for a living. Thom Richards with Warbird Adventures, Lara Stants at Warbird Training Center or Stallion 51 are all great east coast choices. The T-6 doesn't fly like any other airplane and it'll bite you if you let it. But, it's a heap of fun and a great community to be a part of. PM me anytime with T-6 or NATA questions.

T6.jpg
 
i'm in the process of buying one right now, they are a great airplane. first off, stalls are not a big issue. accelerated stalls are. spins are also if not handled properly. a good type checkout is a must. but don't worry, the insurance company will require it from a approved instructor.

maintenance is not to bad on them, parts are available, and they really are a simple aircraft.

you will need a larger hanger, they do not fit in a normal T-hanger as they have a 42 foot wingspan.

they are not a practical airplane in the sense that you are not going to use it for a cross country platform they get roughly 5 miles to the gallon, and thats just the oil burn. just kidding, but they will use more oil than your lycoming ever thought of. an oil change is 10 gallons of oil.

I was quoted 8k a year for insurance, thats for 250k hull with an ATP, 14000 hrs, and about 400 tailwheel time. i am roughly figuring 500 hr operating costs. its expensive, but flying down the beach at 1000ft with the canopy slid back, making lots of noise is priceless.
 
unsafervguy said:
i'm in the process of buying one right now, they are a great airplane. first off, stalls are not a big issue. accelerated stalls are. spins are also if not handled properly. a good type checkout is a must. but don't worry, the insurance company will require it from a approved instructor.

maintenance is not to bad on them, parts are available, and they really are a simple aircraft.

you will need a larger hanger, they do not fit in a normal T-hanger as they have a 42 foot wingspan.

they are not a practical airplane in the sense that you are not going to use it for a cross country platform they get roughly 5 miles to the gallon, and thats just the oil burn. just kidding, but they will use more oil than your lycoming ever thought of. an oil change is 10 gallons of oil.

I was quoted 8k a year for insurance, thats for 250k hull with an ATP, 14000 hrs, and about 400 tailwheel time. i am roughly figuring 500 hr operating costs. its expensive, but flying down the beach at 1000ft with the canopy slid back, making lots of noise is priceless.
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Where in SW Florida are you? We are at FD77, between Tampa and Sarasota.
 
EvilEagle said:
I've been flying T-6's for about 10 years now. I'm the Standardization Officer for NATA and a formation checkpilot; also in the process of buying a T-6.

Tailwheel experience will help with insurance, it is definitely in the complex/high performance/retract category so a lot of time in other things that swing gear, have moving props, etc will help with insurance as well.

I H I G H L Y recommend getting type training from someone who does it for a living. Thom Richards with Warbird Adventures, Lara Stants at Warbird Training Center or Stallion 51 are all great east coast choices. The T-6 doesn't fly like any other airplane and it'll bite you if you let it. But, it's a heap of fun and a great community to be a part of. PM me anytime with T-6 or NATA questions.
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Great insight, thanks!

Getting involved in NATA is a big part of my motivation. Really digging the opportunity to do your formation clinics.

I'm thinking of going to a fly-in that Thom Richards is hosting in late Sept. Will be a good opportunity to make connections and learn about type training.
 
Not what you are looking at right now, but if the T-6 plans don't come to fruition, take a look at the Yak-52. Not as much power, but still a fun bird to be upside-down in.
 
mandm said:
And I’ve been thinking about a Lance
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Haha... I'm thinking "in addition to", not "instead of".

Been looking at Senecas too, though :biggrin:
 
Jim K said:
Haha... I'm thinking "in addition to", not "instead of".

Been looking at Senecas too, though :biggrin:
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I’m looking at Comanches and then forming a second partnership.
 
TCABM said:
I’m looking at Comanches and then forming a second partnership.
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I'm thinking a decathalon would be an awesome second airplane to share with 3 or 4 other people. It'd certainly be a lot more fun than the 172 I (very occasionally) fly.
 
Jim K said:
I'm thinking a decathalon would be an awesome second airplane to share with 3 or 4 other people. It'd certainly be a lot more fun than the 172 I (very occasionally) fly.
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I certainly enjoy mine. Though I'm not sure how I would feel about 3 or 4 other people pulling G's. I fuss over mine pretty hard. :)

Taildraggers can have issues in group environments. Eventually one guy lets his skills lapse and ground loops it.

I have a couple goals remaining to achieve in my Decathlon. Biggest one is competing in the national aerobatic championship. I could do that next month, but I haven't competed enough locally this year to put in a credible effort. Another is exploring the West. I just bought a place in Colorado, so am hoping to use it next summer as a base for trips to Wyoming, Idaho, Utah, etc. After that, and IAC nationals next fall, I'll probably get serious about the T-6.

I had always planned on next step being a Pitts or Extra, and moving up to IAC categories above Sportsman. But that appeals to me less and less as I get older. I wouldn't mind trying my hand at Intermediate just for the unknown, but I watch the harder negative stuff in Advanced and think nope.

A few weeks ago I read an article about regret. The author suggested asking yourself "if I died right now, what would I most regret having not done." First thought in my mind was flying warbirds. So here I am.
 
Try and fail… but don’t fail to try.

Tools, with zero regrets!
 
Ed Haywood said:
Great insight, thanks!

Getting involved in NATA is a big part of my motivation. Really digging the opportunity to do your formation clinics.

I'm thinking of going to a fly-in that Thom Richards is hosting in late Sept. Will be a good opportunity to make connections and learn about type training.
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That fly in will be more networking (over a beer) than flying or learning about transition training. It’s an acro-meet first and foremost. Join NATA and show up to some clinics for some GIB flights if you think that’s where you’ll end up anyway. SnF and Osh are obviously great places to meet the warbird crowd.

C’mon in, as long as you have thick skin and absolutely HATE having extra money… warbirds is the place to be!
 
EvilEagle said:
That fly in will be more networking (over a beer) than flying or learning about transition training. It’s an acro-meet first and foremost.
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I'm an acro guy with a Decathlon, so a good crowd for me. Get some tips from Koontz.
EvilEagle said:
Join NATA and show up to some clinics for some GIB flights if you think that’s where you’ll end up anyway.
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Will do. Where is the closest clinic? I seem to recall seeing one in Ocala FL once upon a time.
EvilEagle said:
SnF and Osh are obviously great places to meet the warbird crowd.
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On it. My buddy has a C-45 and C-47. He plans to have the C-45 in flying order for Oshkosh next year, so we'll take it up and camp in the Warbird area.

I live 15 minutes from SnF, so I go to the showevery year, but don't participate in camper activities. How does one meet the Warbird crowd there, other than ambushing at their planes?
 
Ed Haywood said:
I'm an acro guy with a Decathlon, so a good crowd for me. Get some tips from Koontz.


Will do. Where is the closest clinic? I seem to recall seeing one in Ocala FL once upon a time.

On it. My buddy has a C-45 and C-47. He plans to have the C-45 in flying order for Oshkosh next year, so we'll take it up and camp in the Warbird area.

I live 15 minutes from SnF, so I go to the showevery year, but don't participate in camper activities. How does one meet the Warbird crowd there, other than ambushing at their planes?
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They camp right in the middle behind where the mustangs are parked. Big buses mostly.
 
Ed Haywood said:
I've just about talked my buddy into going in on a T-6 with me.

Timeline is next 12-24 months. Will depend on my progress in achieving aerobatic goals, since I would probably need to sell my Decathlon.

I have just about an ideal maintenance situation. My partner is an A&P/IA who has plenty of experience with radial engine warbirds and a well equipped facility.

Goal would be to get into formation flight and participate in NATA clinics, which might eventually become a gateway drug to higher performance warbirds.

One big hole in my skillset: I am not IFR rated. I'm thinking I should plan on knocking that out before pulling the trigger.

Thoughts on T-6 ownership from those with experience?
Click to expand...
Beware....once you get one, it is hard to get rid of it.....

I bought mine 6 years ago with the intention of building a couple hundred hours and then selling it. But the more I fly it, the more I love it. Have over 300 hours now in mine.

I don't think lacking an IR rating is a factor. While there are some T6s out there that are IFR capable, it has never been worth the expense to me. I have flown mine twice round trip Norfolk to San Diego, once to Phoenix and back and several times back and forth to Fort Worth. Ive used mine for work travel. The cost of installing a GPS and making it IFR legal never seemed worth it - I decided it was cheaper to by a last minute airline ticket if forecast wasn't going to cooperate and it is much more fun to fly VFR anyway.

Main thing you'll want is at least 100 hours of tailwheel time - seems to be a magic number for insurance lately. If you don't already have much time in a T6, I think it may be worth it do do a 5-10 hour T6 course down in Florida as EvilEagle suggested. The T6 is a fun airplane that will kill you in a heartbeat if you get complacent.

I had accumulated about 10 hours in T6s before I bought mine and only needed a CFI checkout, but I also had several friends and mentors who either owned T6s or had hundreds of hours in them. I still have had more moments in the T6 where the airplane scared the crap out of me than any other I've flown. It lulls you into a false sense of comfort.

Parts are still plentiful but getting more expensive, but since COVID the same can be said for almost every airplane type.

Sounds like you have an ideal relationship maintenance wise - but make sure you can get a hangar big enough. You don't want to leave it outside.

Biggest challenge right now is finding a good one for sale. T6s are always in high demand.

Happy to answer any specific questions you have either here or PM.
 
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