Not a helicopter pilot but I agree with most of what this guy says.
He sure likes to hear himself talk.
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Not a helicopter pilot but I agree with most of what this guy says.
For most people the news about the VFR only cert does mean something. Per your own words above, it means the pilot was either busting the regs, or using 'poor technique' (stumbling into IMC). It also implies that he probably didn't have much experience in actual IMC, since IFR flying wasn't required by his job (for the past 10 years).
C.
but they'll never actually know what was going on in the pilot's head or the full chain of events..
I'm curious what you think it means that the operator was VFR Only certificated. I'm also curious what regs you think he was busting?
He sure likes to hear himself talk.
Ugh, you're going to make me look this up? Okay, if he 'intentionally' flew into IMC (even at the end), then he would be in violation of 14 CFR 91.155 (VFR weather minimums). And 'flying too damn fast for the conditions' is pretty much the definition of CFR 14 91.13 (careless and reckless operation).
As for the VFR Only Cert - I'm pretty sure it means the company wasn't permitted to operate revenue flights IFR.
C.
Okay, if he 'intentionally' flew into IMC (even at the end), then he would be in violation of 14 CFR 91.155 (VFR weather minimums).
And 'flying too damn fast for the conditions' is pretty much the definition of CFR 14 91.13 (careless and reckless operation).
As for the VFR Only Cert - I'm pretty sure it means the company wasn't permitted to operate revenue flights IFR.
I don't even know what you're trying to argue anymore. They say in the video that the helicopter crashed at 1085 feet. You do realize the hills around the crash, ahead in the direction they were pointed, rise to 1600+ very quickly, right? And they also say they were descending at 2000 fpm? At this point, I have to assume you are trying to appear ignorant for fun(?)Happy to keep playing. See 10:30 here:
Additional discussion at 17:28.
Happy to keep playing. See 10:30 here:
Additional discussion at 17:28.
Sigh. Even the once-respected Flying magazine ...Bryant’s Helicopter Almost Cleared the Hill Says NTSB
https://www.flyingmag.com/story/new...atement/?utm_source=internal&utm_medium=email
...And to me, "almost clearing the hill" by any amount doesn't have much relevance in a 2,000 fpm descent.
...and one year later it will be something profound like "pilot's failure to maintain adequate clearance from terrain"
Lots of baloney here. The PIC made a rapid ascent, and then a rapid descent into the ground. No investigation will ever reveal why he did those things. The NTSB will make some sort of ruling no more based on reality than Star Wars, since they can't seem to say they don't know why he did what he did.
Well, they will in this case given the deaths of famous people involved. Such is not universally the case in NTSB investigations, sadly.I've not ever been left with impression the investigators at the NTSB didn't try to do the best they could with whatever they had to work with.
No, they aren't. In fact, they're typically never experts on anything (including journalism). What they are expected to do is be able to RESEARCH and write an objective story. It's the ones that are lazy or not savvy enough to know where to do the research that write most of the drivel in the media. This has even been supplanted of late by those who don't do any research at all and just write what they "innately" know to be true.Journalists are expected to be experts on everything,
This ^^^^. And add in the fact that many include their "analysis" in the reporting and you've got the sorry state we're in today.No, they aren't. In fact, they're typically never experts on anything (including journalism). What they are expected to do is be able to RESEARCH and write an objective story. It's the ones that are lazy or not savvy enough to know where to do the research that write most of the drivel in the media. This has even been supplanted of late by those who don't do any research at all and just write what they "innately" know to be true.
News organizations make their money based on readership, number of people watching, and clicks. I think this explains a lot.All this talk about journalism and headlines is why I am only following this story from this site. Journalists are expected to be experts on everything, one day it’s murder,the next bank fraud, the next a helicopter crash... I guarantee if you asked a single reporter in the pool of people asking the NTSB questions to explain what SVFR actually is the reporter would fumble the definition just as if we here on a pilot message board we’re asked to define some police procedure being used to investigate a bank fraud situation. It’s not really the media’s fault they are ignorant— they can’t be experts in everything and unless you have comparable knowledge to us pilots you really don’t have any business reporting on this( or more accurately creating a narrative, not actually reporting.) What is 100% the media’s fault is perpetuating false and dishonest narratives just to sell copies( like the headline of almost clearing a mountain when the helicopter turned towards higher terrain and was in an apparent descent.) The most honest way to report that is “Helicopter crashes into mountain” but that’s far less eye catching these days then selling this idea that this crash almost did not happen.
Stick to facts and thinking for oneself and this entire news media industry may just have to change their “glorification” approach to every single report.
To be nitpicky, they make their money from advertising. How much a sponsor/advertiser is willing to pay is generally based on readership, number of people watching and clicks, but can be enhanced with detailed demographic data of the folks reading/watching. So the journalist not only wants maximum eyeballs, but maximum eyeballs within the target demographic of the advertiser. It's also why online tracking is so deeply ingrained in the experience. The broad interest about a tragedy involving Kobe appeals to advertisers in a bunch of demographics, where a story about Tom Brady's contract will appeal more to those that are sports fans.News organizations make their money based on readership, number of people watching, and clicks. I think this explains a lot.
Not a helicopter pilot but I agree with most of what this guy says.
100% correct. The element of this discussion that I struggle with is sentiment that the media is to be blamed for this. No one blames the fast food industry for selling gigantic fountain sugar drinks. No one blames the television industry for turning out crap tv shows. The thought of wanting a news media industry that is for-profit and yet does not give the people the product they want seems ridiculous to me. You can't have it both ways. If you want the news industry to be a free-enterprise for-profit undertaking then don't complain when they produce crap if crap is what sells.What is 100% the media’s fault is perpetuating false and dishonest narratives just to sell copies( like the headline of almost clearing a mountain when the helicopter turned towards higher terrain and was in an apparent descent.) The most honest way to report that is “Helicopter crashes into mountain” but that’s far less eye catching these days then selling this idea that this crash almost did not happen.
100% correct. The element of this discussion that I struggle with is sentiment that the media is to be blamed for this. No one blames the fast food industry for selling gigantic fountain sugar drinks. No one blames the television industry for turning out crap tv shows. The thought of wanting a news media industry that is for-profit and yet does not give the people the product they want seems ridiculous to me. You can't have it both ways. If you want the news industry to be a free-enterprise for-profit undertaking then don't complain when they produce crap if crap is what sells.
Do you know if those Cop helipads have Approaches? If so do they share them with you guys? Just curious, not thinking it has anything to do with this.
I don't think head-banging stupidity is particularly entertaining... maybe that's just me, though.I think the public has much different expectations when viewing TMZ vs CNN although these days I personally put them both in the “ purely entertainment and non factual based junk drawer”
No, they don't. If they did, CNN would either use different headlines or go out of business. Which is to say there have in the course of history been news agencies that did exactly what those complaining about this are longing for. Those news agencies don't exist anymore for a reason. They either learned to write headlines that sold or they got out the business.I think the public has much different expectations when viewing TMZ vs CNN
Do you know if those Cop helipads have Approaches? If so do they share them with you guys? Just curious, not thinking it has anything to do with this.
The LEO helicopter operations are VFR only. It’s expensive to develop IFR approach procedures and expensive to maintain them.
The LEO helicopter operations are VFR only. It’s expensive to develop IFR approach procedures and expensive to maintain them.
I mean.. it's a PoA shtick, like hating certain composite planes, but the media is generally very poor at their job. Focusing just an aviation, the thing I posted above of them focusing on his grieving wife are classless and shallow, and headlines like these are completely misleading and do nothing but dramatize what actually happened and push a certain narrativeI’m just so tired of these brainless anti-media tirades
I would also add: show the "other side" of every event, no matter how ridiculous the "other side" is. You can be watching a news report about NASA, and then for the "other side" they interview a flat earth idiot.**The media has a consistent and focused goal (since it's controlled by a handful of people with vested political and financial interests) to always assure three things happen, in any news coverage
-instill generalized fear in the public, because a scared populace is more amenable to change
-paint "the rich" as evil
-portray aviation as inherently dangerous
I mean.. it's a PoA shtick, like hating certain composite planes, but the media is generally very poor at their job. Focusing just an aviation, the thing I posted above of them focusing on his grieving wife are classless and shallow, and headlines like these are completely misleading and do nothing but dramatize what actually happened and push a certain narrative
View attachment 82424
^no, he wasn't. Nobody "clears" you to fly based on weather, at least not in the sense that this headline is suggesting happens
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^no really, totally out of context, they were not warned of an impending terrain strike, as this headline suggests
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^can we define "poor visibility" - the New York Post (less reputable in my opinion) correctly stated this as "instruments only" flight.. and no, it is not normally "so simple" to navigate in Southern California, at all
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^missing? that makes it seem like its required equipment that the operator was careless to install. TAWS is not required
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^no, they really don't. In some applications the time savings for "the wealthy elite" (what even is that?) makes sense.. but I've don't see "the rich" flying their choppers to The Penthouse at Mastro's for steak, and then hanging out outside hailing down other helicopters
**The media has a consistent and focused goal (since it's controlled by a handful of people with vested political and financial interests) to always assure three things happen, in any news coverage
-instill generalized fear in the public, because a scared populace is more amenable to change
-paint "the rich" as evil
-portray aviation as inherently dangerous
Nope. Merely that what CNN said was accurate. And I don't quite believe they were in a dive when they hit, but time will tell. If you look a the link above (the picture wouldn't insert for whatever reason), you'll see what I mean. I tend to think they were (mostly) out of the dive and paralleling the hill when they hit it. In that same briefing, the NTSB said he was in a descending left turn.