ALPA specifically says stay away from any sort of CBD product. This really doesn’t complicate anything. The FAA is pretty clear. Don’t smoke pot if you want to fly professionally.
Drug test
- Thread starter ChrisCC
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Morgan3820
Ejection Handle Pulled
Legal doesn’t make the action a good idea. It speaks to personal judgement. +1 for random drug testing.
Canada doesn't allow pilots to smoke without restriction. There's a hard 28 day from toke-to-throttle
Bullpoop. There may be some laws still on the books in some states, but Loving v. Virginia in 1967 declared such unconstitutional, invalidating them.
Two wrongs do not make a right. A pilot that shows up with a BAC at the wrong time, or gets any sort of alcohol citation, they will have serious hoops to jump through. If they drink enough to show tolerance, the only way (if it is even possible), is to show complete abstinence as well.
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Craigd31
Pre-Flight
Yeah, stay away from alcohol, cigarettes, CBD, THC, everything! Oh, wait, EtoH is ok as long as you don't have too much in your system when you fly....
Morgan3820
Ejection Handle Pulled
Wrong. Yes I noticed your sarcasm but again he comes back to personal judgment. The rule say eight hours bottle throttle but that doesn’t mean you can fly hungover.
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
The OP has a Class 1 and is working on a commercial.
"Applicant History - Item 18. Medical History n. Substance dependence; or failed a drug test ever; or substance abuse or use of illegal substance in the last 2 years"
Seems pretty straightforward that a "yes" will be required if the test is failed, or if another medical is sought within the next 2 years.
Another question is: What's worse for a career pilot, reporting a failed test or reporting the smoking?
"Applicant History - Item 18. Medical History n. Substance dependence; or failed a drug test ever; or substance abuse or use of illegal substance in the last 2 years"
Seems pretty straightforward that a "yes" will be required if the test is failed, or if another medical is sought within the next 2 years.
Another question is: What's worse for a career pilot, reporting a failed test or reporting the smoking?
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Is this rationalization or justification?
p1l0t
Line Up and Wait
Key word "DOT" does the OP* work in transportation?
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Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
edit: But another point, the OP asked if there was a way FAA would find out about a failed test some way other than self-reporting on the medical. The implication that some on this board have taken is the OP is considering lying on the medical.
Juliet Hotel
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If you go on pilot forum and say your on a pro flying track and then ask about ramifications of a failed drug test for weed, you're going to get judged. I'm not saying that's right or wrong but it is what it is. Complaining about it ain't gonna make it stop.
As for your question, I don't believe there is any direct reporting between OSHA and the FAA on these matters. However if you pee dirty for anyone anywhere, there will be a paper trail that the FAA will likely be able to find should they be given a reason to look for it. Which means if you do pee dirty, you'll either have to fess up and go through the hoops to get back the good graces of the FAA or you can lie on your app. And since the question reads 'failed drug test ever...' you'll have to lie on every medical app for the rest of your life. Its up to you to decide if you'll sleep well at night knowing your ability to pay your mortgage depends on the FAA never finding out you've been lying on every medical application for your entire career.
Best advice has already been given. Quit your job before they test you, take a couple weeks off and/or find a job that won't need to test you. Do whatever flight training you can with the medical you already have and wait two years before applying for another. Oh and don't smoke any more weed obviously. Good luck.
Groundpounder
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But if you want to fly professionally someday, stop smoking pot, like right now.
Yeah, and Stan didn't think there was any connection between Social Security and the FAA, but that was an incorrect assumption.
Juliet Hotel
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So are you saying that OSHA will in fact transmit failed drug testing results to the FAA without being asked? How would they even know the employee had an FAA medical? Does OSHA track that info? For that matter, when does OSHA get involved with drug test results at all? I can understand OSHA requiring an employer to perform drug testing on certain employees under certain circumstances, but I've never heard of the employer being required to submit those results to OSHA.
No, what I am saying is that somebody might decide that it would fit some government safety function to reconcile these databases and you'll get caught for lying on your FAA medical when they find you have indeed had a dirty test under an OSHA-based program.
PaulS
Touchdown! Greaser!
You need to make a decision, professional pilot or pot. Time to grow up, it's an adult decision and the resulting consequences of the decisions you make are yours and only yours. Another adult thing.
Craigd31
Pre-Flight
Agree 100%. As long as it's been >8 hours, most people fly (and drive) better with a BAC of < 0.03999999%.
Craigd31
Pre-Flight
Well, if people on this forum are going to render judgement onto other posters....then I think all alcohol, tobacco, and non prescription narcotics and even some herbal products should be outlawed....but those darn lobbyists have such a strong influence. Oh how I yearn for the National Prohibition (Volstead) Act of yesteryear
This is the way things work. Don’t smoke pot if you want to fly professionally. There are plenty of jobs that allow you to toke if you like. Professional flying isn’t one of them.
Craigd31
Pre-Flight
Or, not dissimilar to alcohol, don't smoke cannabis within a time frame that could make you positive on a possible drug test requested by your aviation (or other) employer...until they change the rules.
Sure you can do that and lie on your medical. You do you.
Juliet Hotel
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Juliet Hotel
People render judgement onto other people everywhere.
3393RP
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3393RP
You're behind the times. The US Supreme Court ruled laws banning interracial marriage were unconstitutional in 1967.
Kenny Phillips
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If something that can alter your judgement and reaction time is in your bloodstream, one shouldn't fly until it's gone.
PaulS
Touchdown! Greaser!
p1l0t
Line Up and Wait
Hahaha
Because they don't give a fuh..
Seriously though OP I get tested like 3 times a year it seems you will have to quit until it's made federally legal in the year 2075.
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dtuuri
Final Approach
I would prefer a limitation on your pilot's license: Valid only for flights within (say) Colorado.
It's times like this I wish I had listened to what my mother told me.
That is very funny. If we are being humorous, why not add "Must maintain 10 miles separation from all air traffic that originated outside of Colorodo". The rest of us that are compliant with federal standards would need protection when flying in (say) Colorodo airspace. I am obviously being comedic.
p1l0t
Line Up and Wait
Are you obviously comedic? If it was actually funny you wouldn't have to laugh at your own jokes in front of your own audience. Although now that I get it, several minutes later, it is kind of humours in a sad kind of state of current affairs. Do we really need 5 mi and 1k ft? My grandfather would be turning in his grave.
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Smokers exhibit compromised performance in the cockpit, especially in a nonpressurized aircraft. This is even in the FAA pilot's handbook of aeronautical knowledge. Those who consume more than one drink per day have a significantly higher risk of a very long list of diseases, including suicide and other serious conditions. Yet, someone who never smokes or drinks, but has pot occasionally is seen as a dangerous person. This is all about social stigma. It is not backed by medical evidence. But you have to follow the law no matter how stupid it is. I hope some day alcohol and cigarettes will become illegal too. I don't consume any of these materials, so it is a moot point, but I can't help notice the twisted thinking behind all of it.
He pretty much got the answer to his question to go along with his beating so perhaps it sunk in.
p1l0t
Line Up and Wait
Wait so he isn't even going to tell us whether he quit his job or took the test (and the results)!? How lame.
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Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
quitter!
bbchien
Touchdown! Greaser!
there is a question in which you have to declare. Lie, and you’re Nicholas Beyer, a Delta Pilot who was convicted today in Federal Court of the Felony: falsification of the record.
Then you won’t be employable even at WalMart.
Fiveslide
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I drove a commercial truck years ago. This one company had me in a particularly crappy Mac R model. Everyday, I wrote down a long list of things that needed to be fixed. One was the windshield defroster. One morning, the sun was just right, the temp and moisture in the air just right, the windshield fogged up and I couldn't see anything. I hit another Truck in the parking lot on company property.
The supervisor told me what he thought of me, I told him what I thought of him, he told me if I wanted to keep my job I had to take a drug screen, cancel a vacation I had planned a few weeks later and drive a truck that had a cracked frame while mine was being fixed.
I took the drug test because I was afraid what affect refusing would have, I was clean. As soon as I left that doctor's office, I called up the boss again and went into more detail about this guy's shortcomings as a leader and being a decent human.
I probably would have handled that differently if I knew I wouldn't pass the drug screen. I was probably the only person driving for that company that was clean.
The supervisor told me what he thought of me, I told him what I thought of him, he told me if I wanted to keep my job I had to take a drug screen, cancel a vacation I had planned a few weeks later and drive a truck that had a cracked frame while mine was being fixed.
I took the drug test because I was afraid what affect refusing would have, I was clean. As soon as I left that doctor's office, I called up the boss again and went into more detail about this guy's shortcomings as a leader and being a decent human.
I probably would have handled that differently if I knew I wouldn't pass the drug screen. I was probably the only person driving for that company that was clean.
My all-time favorite SCOTUS case.
Just a guess, but my bet is much sooner than that. States which have legalized are raking in tax dollars so fast even red states are jumping on the bandwagon.
That, of course, doesn't answer the FAA issue. Canada has gone full legal but has a 28-day "toke to yoke" requirement.
If only for the names of the parties. "Loving" is a great name for a case about marriage. And the appellee was the state of Virginia. Kind of makes their "Virginia is for Lovers" slogan a bit ironic.
The groundwork for this decision was laid down a few years earlier in another anti-miscegenation case McLaughlin v. Florida (not as catchy of a title). The decision on that one left a few doors open as to whether there was some statutory purpose for such a law (which they held was not found in Florida's case). Loving slammed the door on even that notion.
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