Dangerous improper CFI Behavior

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From what I recall it was 17mph in the Hershey Bar wing models. My first flight was in a 140, and I owned a 180.
 
Cptwing said:
Yes that is easy to say but having already soloed with over 4k invested going to another school is going to cost me a lot. I currently fly P-28, every other school around here use C-152 and C-172, so I would have to go backwards quite a bit. As I said in original post there are many other incidents, one which almost resulted in a mid air collision, with in less that 100'. This guy is unsafe and a milkman.



Yes I have, (though in no way should I have had to) and as far as the cellphone I just got that deer in the headlight look, I tried to contact the school owner, and was told he would get back to me in a week or so?

There must be an official way to report things, through the FSDO? The FAA? I actually have GO Pro video of me doing touch and gos while he is texting on his phone. I will not post this for legal reasons.
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What was happening when you had the near mid air?
 
bflynn said:
Second, the max demonstrated crosswinds for a PA-28-161 is 17 kts...is it the same in a 140? I'd think it's lower because a lower hp engine means less ability to overcome crosswinds.
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Yeah, but above that you get to tell all your friends that you are a test pilot!
 
Thanks for the advice, just going to bite the bullet and go elsewhere.
EdFred: I respect your opinions and commentary, even when I do not agree with you.

Unfortunately there is LARRY and MOE or maybe one is CURLY, who provide nothing of any value to most of the posts they make, (not just on my threads). Just useless rant and condescending remarks.
mscard88: Grow up already, man get a life.
James331: Hope you get over your anger issues, and those pesky trespassers. If you really want help with that check this guy out.
https://www.drphil.com/
 
mscard88 said:
Isn’t this the second thread you’ve started whining about this CFI? Man, talk to him and tell him your complaints and expectations. We call that shet or get off the pot! If you’re unsatisfied change, whether it be CFI or flight school.

I suspect there’s another side to this story, always is from my experience.
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I’m suspecting the OP might be a little narcissistic, entitled and passive aggressive. Hope I never have to fly a four day with them...
 
luvflyin said:
What was happening when you had the near mid air?
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I was turning to crosswind (1st time ever) on a touch and go and a 172 climbed up underneath us. I saw him coming, and said something at which time he reacted. Looking back seems he should have been looking as well? The 172 was clearly in the wrong verified by ATC, but that is not the point.

The recent mid-air in the everglades involved a CFI on a check-ride with a DPE, the other a student and a CFI. A lot of experience there and look what happened.
 
I asked one simple question and as usual the peanut gallery had to turn it into a sh.. show.
 
Fearless Tower said:
If you are asking if this is an FAA matter, No, it isn’t.

This is a consumer matter. You are the customer and the employee is taking advantage of you. Like having to deal with any other problem employee in business, you can take your issues to the employee then management and if that doesn’t work, you vote with your feet.

Switching airplanes during flight training might cost you a couple extra hours, but it might be worth it.
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Switching airplanes gives you more experience, starting you on the road to a variety of aircraft. If you're serious about this,for a living, moving to another docile trainer aint no big deal, and good practice in the long run. I've only got the private but am checked out (meaning I can rent when my plane is down) in a cherokee/warrior/archer (I consider them all the same), a Cessna 172, working on the Cessna 182, 3 different lightnsports. When I was still working on the private it was common to switch between the cherokee and 172 because I never knew which would be available.
 
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Cptwing said:
Going to set up an appointment with another school, C-172.



How quickly they come out of the shadows on this forum, I hardly think I am whining. I just wanted to know if their was an official reporting system, that's all. It seems hard to believe that their is not and the FAA would not find it disturbing at the least that a CFI, technically the PIC on a dual training flight would play on his phone during touch and gos with a student flying the plane. Really you think that is whining? Its a safety issue and a big one.
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Look,at it this way - he's confident enough in your abilities to to fly the airplane.

Or, looking at it another way....as I want to tell my computer science students ( but not allowed ) "Have you considered changing majors? Something other than CS?"
 
Cptwing said:
A recent incident that I felt was a safety violation was having me do touch and go's in 20 Knot crosswinds, the plane is certified for 17.
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So when you get into real life and encounter an unexpected 20 knot crosswind at a destination, what are you going to do? Stay in the air? Nature doesn't go by our rules. The more you can experience in a training environment, the better.
 
Ben2k9 said:
This. Being a PIC means having to be assertive when it comes to your safety, time, and wallet.
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H*ll, I fired an instrument instructor because he got PO'd that I did a tailwind landing. Only 7 knots tails, 8000"ft runway, and tower approved it. He got mad because I ignored him when he kept saying Go,Around and I reminded him " I'm PIC, & I own the airplane"
 
murphey said:
H*ll, I fired an instrument instructor because he got PO'd that I did a tailwind landing. Only 7 knots tails, 8000"ft runway, and tower approved it. He got mad because I ignored him when he kept saying Go,Around and I reminded him " I'm PIC, & I own the airplane"
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In his defense if you botched the tailwind landing the FAA is going to bust his chops for it.
 
Cptwing said:
I was turning to crosswind (1st time ever) on a touch and go and a 172 climbed up underneath us. I saw him coming, and said something at which time he reacted. Looking back seems he should have been looking as well? The 172 was clearly in the wrong verified by ATC, but that is not the point.

The recent mid-air in the everglades involved a CFI on a check-ride with a DPE, the other a student and a CFI. A lot of experience there and look what happened.
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Cptwing said:
I asked one simple question and as usual the peanut gallery had to turn it into a sh.. show.
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Well you have to understand that you're getting real world advice from people who have ALOT more experience than you do and understand what's actually an inherent risk and what isn't. What seems 'dangerous' to a rookie and what really is dangerous are two different things. Are you under the impression that if you were flying with a different CFI than you wouldn't have experienced this 'near mid-air' ?
 
I had a CFI fly under power-lines with me once, (they were tall power-lines to his credit). I think I still flew with him afterwards, but I do recall trying to move on as quickly as I could after that.
 
I would consider myself a failure if I got a student though training without them landing in crosswinds over 20 knots. If they're lucky they get to experience it before solo. I've done it in a high wing LSA, certainly a Cherokee can handle it. Now, if we're blowing one thing out of proportion, what is the chance we're blowing the other things out of proportion?

If you just don't like your instructor, just get a new one. Wanting to report him to the FAA for things that are not illegal or because you think he's overcharging just makes you sound childish.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
I’m suspecting the OP might be a little narcissistic, entitled and passive aggressive. Hope I never have to fly a four day with them...
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I wish I could add to this, mentioning someone else (not on this board) but I'd get banned.

sigh....
 
EdFred said:
In his defense if you botched the tailwind landing the FAA is going to bust his chops for it.
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True, but when conditions are favorable, I like to practice. My limit is 8-9 kts. As mentioned before, many runways in the west are one way...no option to change runways due to weather. I'd also mention he's the first CFI that ever complained. Other CFIs over the years wanted to try after we landed, too.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Well... to put a finer point on my post. I’m not saying I’m correct just that I have suspicions. I wish you could post your comment.
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To be honest, I'm not sure I could go 4 days traveling with my closest friend, either. We're have very different personalities that are probably not compatible for long trips.
 
murphey said:
True, but when conditions are favorable, I like to practice. My limit is 8-9 kts. As mentioned before, many runways in the west are one way...no option to change runways due to weather. I'd also mention he's the first CFI that ever complained. Other CFIs over the years wanted to try after we landed, too.
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Not to mention, when shooting an approach to a runway your choices are often to land straight-in with a tailwind, doing a CTL, or going missed. I know which one I'd choose, as long as the tailwind was modest.
 
I'm on the phone while instructing all the time. The damn thing has all of my charts! It's also where I keep all of my notes about this lesson and all of your previous lessons - which I often update and refer to. These notes are critical to both ensure we cover everything we should cover so that I don't forget something stupid that kills you..plus it helps me gather my thoughts for debriefing after the flight.

Personally, you're a student, I think you should be paying a hell of a lot less attention to your instructors cell phone and a hell of a lot more attention to flying the airplane and looking out the window. If a student asked me when I was doing on my phone I would ask them why they're not looking outside the airplane. You're not going to have him there much longer. Get used to it.

The phone also runs my music, and if someone says they don't want me listening to music while teaching them, they're going to be very disappointed with the result.

The reason the owner hasn't returned your call is because the owner feels that you're being ridiculous. You may not like that ... but he's making a business decision where he clearly isn't interested in making any changes with the instructor and is most interested in losing you as a customer. You can certainly go find another flight school, though there's no guarantee it won't be worse, and it's likely that instructor will touch his phone sometimes too. They all do.

Additionally....I intentionally act distracted like I'm paying absolutely zero attention with students from time to time. It's critical to ensuring that they can fly without you and they can fly if someone is messing around with **** next to them that's unrelated. I've had students look over in IMC on a ILS before towards the end of their instrument to see me playing angry birds on the iPhone (i hate iPhone games, purely a training trick). However they have to realize that sometimes they are on their own and an instructor that is laxing up helps them build confidence.

Good chance if you goto the FAA to complain about this (especially if you give them a ****ing video!) you're going to have a HELL of a time finding a local instructor willing to get into an airplane with you. If you were my student and you even told me you were thinking about that..I would never get in an airplane with you again..nor would you ever receive an endorsement from me again. In my region, all of the active instructors communicate regularly through group text messages. If a student is being crazy and is about to go mess up another instructors life - warnings are texted - and generally that student never gets a returned call from any of the instructors within 100 miles.

I, as an instructor, have a hell of a lot more situational awareness than you do. I know what's happening, I know what you did, I know what you're about to do, I know where our airplane is, I know where all the other airplanes are, I know the airspeed based on the sound of the wind, I know the RPM based on the sound of the engine, I know how many gallons are in each of your tanks, I know whether you're on top of your game today or slow. I know all of that while appearing like I'm not paying attention.

You'd have to analyze the flight on YouTube over and over to even begin to develop the situational awareness your instructor has in realtime. You really don't have the experience to be so critical.
 
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Is there a way to report dangerous improper CFI behavior.
Cptwing said:
I asked one simple question and as usual the peanut gallery had to turn it into a sh.. show.
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Next time just ask the question.

“Is there a way to report dangerous improper CFI behavior.” Leave the rest of it out. Don’t answer any questions about ‘why.’ Or say please PM me if you have the answer. Then you won’t have to return to the thread and get pizzed off
 
I'm hesitant to say that there aren't bad CFI's out there... my first CFI failed to notice a flap failure during our 2nd or 3rd flight's run-up. I had to tell him they weren't working, he snapped out of his aloof out the window state, toggled the switch himself, saw nothing was happening and cancelled the flight. We could've still flown without flaps but the fact that he didn't even notice or follow me on the checklist so early into training was pretty shocking.
 
Cptwing said:
Going to set up an appointment with another school, C-172.



How quickly they come out of the shadows on this forum, I hardly think I am whining. I just wanted to know if their was an official reporting system, that's all. It seems hard to believe that their is not and the FAA would not find it disturbing at the least that a CFI, technically the PIC on a dual training flight would play on his phone during touch and gos with a student flying the plane. Really you think that is whining? Its a safety issue and a big one.
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You should probably change message boards.

Yours,
Shemp
 
Salty said:
You have a tiny bit of a controlling personality, eh?

You found a CFI that can work with you, probably should keep him.
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This was my advice stated nicely. I can state it more bluntly if it wasn't clear enough.
 
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Man up and say something to him or move on. Why on earth would you take time and energy out of your day and everyone's day. What's next? Take him to court because you're not happy? What do you think is going to happen? You call FSDO, they call him, and everything will be right? Let me guess. You're mid-20s?

FFS, move on. Sorry your poor feelings are hurt and you don't want to spend money to move somewhere else. And if you're hesitant about spending money in this situation to move on, I'd rethink your path in aviation. Stuff just gets more expensive from here.
 
.
 
jesse said:
.....The phone also runs my music, and if someone says they don't want me listening to music while teaching them, they're going to be very disappointed with the result......
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That reminds me of my IR training. I did almost all of the NDB work, except the Approaches of course, over the KSON Radio Beacon. My instructor liked to listen Hillbilly music as he put it. He was and he sounded it. I thought I was taking lessons from Festus. Damn I miss that guy. Yeah, it was a long time ago when ADF was the only source of music in the plane.

 
luvflyin said:
That reminds me of my IR training. I did almost all of the NDB work, except the Approaches of course, over the KSON Radio Beacon. My instructor liked to listen Hillbilly music as he put it. He was and he sounded it. I thought I was taking lessons from Festus. Damn I miss that guy. Yeah, it was a long time ago when ADF was the only source of music in the plane.

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You could have brought a portable 8 track player. (If you were training in a 4 seater)
 
If you’re going to “report him”, you’ll probably be looking for another instructor anyway. Might as well move on now regardless.
 
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