Charter plane down in Colombia, Brazilian soccer team on board

CBSN spouting off about an electrical failure - which I find a little difficult to believe on a four engine aircraft.
 
Some talk of simply running out of fuel? Long flight for plane, no fire at crash site? Just early scuttlebutt.
 
The flight was a few miles further than the published range of that plane. And the published data is for a brand new plane, so the fuel angle looks like a possibility.
 
Hope it's not fuel exhaustion,such a waste of life. May they Rest In Peace.
 
One survivor has passed away according to the news.

Also reported in the news was that a flight attendant was heard to say the plane was out of fuel. All pure speculation at this point.

Terrible tragedy.
 
I don't get these pilots who like to play cowboy with people's lives. And I don't doubt that this kind of crap goes on in the US airlines as well, maybe to a lesser extent due to FAA oversight.
 
is sad news. My condolences to their family and fans.

One article said that last month that plane was used to fly the Argentina National team to play Brazil. This plane is used for some very special clients so it is not just some cowboy outfit. Fuel exhaustion looks more likely the cause. Maybe they were expecting a nice tailwind?
 
When you look at the range figures think still air and max weight. Winds and weight can produce an actual range that is significantly different from the published generic number.
 
Larry in TN said:
When you look at the range figures think still air and max weight. Winds and weight can produce an actual range that is significantly different from the published generic number.
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Range in miles can vary hugely from published due to winds. Time aloft usually will not, and can be roughly calculated by dividing range by cruise fuel burn. Reality will be shorter due to climb fuel, which is more pronounced in jets than in our little pistons; low altitude cruise while waiting for climb clearance also eats significantly into their range.

This is such a sad event! To have it come from fuel exhaustion would make it much worse . . .
 
4-engine 90 seater? Rather unconventional given today's economics.
 
Sounds like they were using an Airbus, but cabotage issues didn't allow them to take the Airbus on this leg, so they scrambled to find an alternate aircraft.
 
Acrodustertoo said:
Football teams have mucho dinero. Besides, we all know four engines are better.
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Soccer teams from small towns in S. America don't have "mucho dinero." I prefer our football, but this small town team had just hit the bigtime. The tournament they were going to was to be their launch into money and fame for their town, now all gone . . .
 
hindsight2020 said:
4-engine 90 seater? Rather unconventional given today's economics.
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My airline, ASA, operated 5 of them carrying Delta passengers around in the 80s, along with Air Wisconsin. Well, we didn't actually carry Air Wisconsin, I meant they operated a fleet of these British buggers too.

ASA BAE-146-200.jpg BAE-146-200.jpg
 
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mscard88 said:
My airline, ASA, operated 5 of them carrying Delta passengers around in the 80s, along with Air Wisconsin. Well, we didn't actually carry Air Wisconsin, I meant they operated a fleet of these British buggers.
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From what I saw this weekend, they seem to have found a new life as air tankers with the Forest Service.
 
Fearless Tower said:
From what I saw this weekend, they seem to have found a new life as air tankers with the Forest Service.
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Yeah saw some awhile back out west doing the air tanker gig, along with 747 and maybe DC10 or MD 11 I think.
 
Art VanDelay said:
CBSN spouting off about an electrical failure - which I find a little difficult to believe on a four engine aircraft.
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Might be more believable if they used the word "power failure" in the context of a 4 engine flame out..A flight attendant survivor mentioned running out of fuel and there was no post crash fire.... Peculiar that there was no chatter leading up to this event if it WAS fuel related...

On a side note, does that bird have a RAT?
 
No. There are generators on #1 and #4 and the APU.
 
So... ummm.. the captain... was also part owner in this charter/recent startup airline... Starting to wonder what the implications were for flight planning and fuel reserves with a plane flying a max range profile...

They only took two laps around a holding pattern before being cleared for approach then falling out..
 
News reporting that pilot told ATC they had run out of fuel.
 
Fatal accidents that result from a pilot trying to push limits or from poor planning are perhaps the hardest to understand or accept.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Fatal accidents that result from a pilot trying to push limits or from poor planning are perhaps the hardest to understand or accept.
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I'd say they're pretty easy to understand, but hard to accept.

Not that it's a critical distinction, I guess...
 
All the years I flew at an airline and the numerous diverts over those years, some as a result of holding and others because of weather, I never was questioned by the company about my decisions. For that I am grateful, but even if they had chastised me I would have still stuck with my decision. I always believed once you had a plan for a diversion, especially for a potential low fuel situation, you stick with it. Often times ATC would come back that I could proceed inbound, direct, or something of that nature, after we (myself & the FO) had made our decision to divert, and we still diverted. Don't push fuel reserves or yourself.
 
orange said:
And I don't doubt that this kind of crap goes on in the US airlines as well, maybe to a lesser extent due to FAA oversight.
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It's not about FAA oversight - there's simply not a culture in this country where airline pilots fear being punished for making the conservative decision. As mscard88 said, we do what we feel we need to do to ensure a safe outcome, and we're able to do so without worry about punitive action. Unfortunately that might not be the case in other areas of the world.
 
kayoh190 said:
It's not about FAA oversight - there's simply not a culture in this country where airline pilots fear being punished for making the conservative decision. As mscard88 said, we do what we feel we need to do to ensure a safe outcome, and we're able to do so without worry about punitive action. Unfortunately that might not be the case in other areas of the world.
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Unless you work for Allegiant....
 
Fearless Tower said:
Unless you work for Allegiant....
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Hahaha - fair point. But I'd bet that every pilot over there would have no problem putting on some extra gas, or making the divert if it got a little tight. Well, unless you're the VP of Flight Ops. :) :)
 
kayoh190 said:
Hahaha - fair point. But I'd bet that every pilot over there would have no problem putting on some extra gas, or making the divert if it got a little tight. Well, unless you're the VP of Flight Ops. :) :)
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The PIC on this one was an owner of the company...
 
weilke said:
They never made much economical sense. Very good on short strips, very quiet.
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I always liked the way they looked, with the four turbofans and wing anhedral it appeared to be a squat little performer that would be fun to fly. But I never had the chance to ride in one.
 
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