Can we yank and bank a Beechcraft ?

Trapper John said:
I think that if this guy was a "cowboy pilot" type, he wouldn't have lived to own his Bo for 20 years. He would have crashed long ago.
Click to expand...

Maybe he has some new "friends" being a bad influence? ;)

Point taken though. Something's wrong with the story, unless it was just a moment of sheer panic.

Maybe 20 years ago, pre-TFRs and airspace paranoia, he wouldn't have yanked so hard, and asked for forgiveness. Sigh.
 
Trapper John said:
I think that if this guy was a "cowboy pilot" type, he wouldn't have lived to own his Bo for 20 years. He would have crashed long ago.
Click to expand...
Nah, contrary to popular belief, some people like that can survive for a long time and they don't always die in an airplane. Sometimes it's of natural causes.
 
Last edited:
So, like, the guy is head down, playing with the radios. Probably leaning over to get them in range of his bifocals. Probably leaning on the yoke at the same time. That sends a slipery aircraft off into a nose down right hand spiral. Finally wakes up and (nearly) pulls the tail off.

I don't think I'll blame the Bo.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
I recall the T-34 had some incidents with wings falling off when over-stressed that resulted in an AD.

Low weight, high speed, rapid movement of the controls. Yeah, I can see that overstressing the plane.
Click to expand...

Only the "A" model, the B never had a problem, but got caught in the AD as well, "A"s were acro rated the B was not.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
I agree that the wing failures appeared to be due to repeated overstressing outside of their limits. However, when I saw the AD fix (the cable that connects the wings) and talked to the creators about it, they indicated that the same cable with different lengths could be used on the Bonanza, Baron, and I think others, due to overall similarity.
Click to expand...

The cable mod is a very controversial issue, I don't know if it ever became a fix for the AD, the last I knew the STRAP was the only fix. (I'm too lazy to look it up)

And remember the wings on the subject's aircraft were not harmed, just the fuselage.

I'm wondering if the skin material (Mag sheet) is the problem. It does work harden quicker than 2400 series Al-sheet
 
"head up and locked" is my new favorite saying this week. Bravo. :D

I cruise in the yellow arc in my V-tail frequently. I am always aware that if I need to make a move, it better be damn gradual. One of my first responses to a "situation" is to pull off the power. I think this is a "slippery airplane" thing, not endemic to the Bonanza.

If I have any idea that I'll be saying "hey watch this" to my passengers, I park it well under Va, which is a 40mph difference, and usually 6-10" MP.

The plane takes less time to decelerate by pulling the throttle knob out, versus just ripping the wings or tail off with an impromptu high-speed maneuver -- but the latter is not very stylish. :rolleyes2:
 
taters said:
So 190MPH(+) is more than 165Kts on the Airspeed Indicator.....far...far above Va and it sounds like he was light which compounds this situation. I also dont buy the G meter thing if he was at a 75 degree bank. Yes stuff will pop at that stress level...but likely not on the wing, usually the tail will go first.

You have to watch your A$$ in a V-tail in those situations they will slide right thru Vne...my student damn near did it in his V-35B during unusual attitude practice yesterday.
Click to expand...


Most (all?) airplanes give you a lot of clues with a dramatic speed change. Is there something different about a Bo vs a Mooney, Comanche, or the RV I fly? I've done a lot of aerobatics in my RV and haven't even sniffed at Vne.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
So, like, the guy is head down, playing with the radios. Probably leaning over to get them in range of his bifocals. Probably leaning on the yoke at the same time. That sends a slipery aircraft off into a nose down right hand spiral. Finally wakes up and (nearly) pulls the tail off.

I don't think I'll blame the Bo.
Click to expand...

You can do that all day long in a C-210 and never hurt it.
 
schmookeeg said:
"head up and locked" is my new favorite saying this week.
Click to expand...

The term is cranialrectitus, medical examiners look for scat in the ears to prove it.

In some chronic cases the person is known to have scat for brains.
 
Tom-D said:
You can do that all day long in a C-210 and never hurt it.
Click to expand...

Even a 210 can be hurt if you try hard enough. Of course, the 210 is also slower than the 55 Bonanza.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Guy flies through a t-storm and you blame the controller???
Click to expand...

The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this ACC as follows:
The pilot's failure to obtain updated en route weather information, which resulted in his continued instrument flight into a widespread area of severe convective activity, and the air traffic controller's failure to provide adverse weather avoidance assistance, as required by Federal Aviation Administration directives, both of which led to the airplane's encounter with a severe thunderstorm and subsequent loss of control.

http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief.aspx?ev_id=20060501X00494&key=1
 
Trapper John said:
The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this ACC as follows:
The pilot's failure to obtain updated en route weather information, which resulted in his continued instrument flight into a widespread area of severe convective activity, and the air traffic controller's failure to provide adverse weather avoidance assistance, as required by Federal Aviation Administration directives, both of which led to the airplane's encounter with a severe thunderstorm and subsequent loss of control.

http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief.aspx?ev_id=20060501X00494&key=1
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, but I learned very early in my pilot training and know enough about meteorology and radar limitations that I do not rely on ATC to keep me out of t-storms.
 
If it were one of us "non-famous" people, that line about the controller not providing weather wouldn't have even been in that NTSB report.

Politics. FAA's stance for all the rest of us is that if you want weather, contact FlightWatch. Controllers do weather on a time-available, best-effort basis.

"Best effort" apparently is a higher standard when it's a famous aviator on board, because we've all seen the cases where similar circumstances existed, and the controller's butt was covered with "not our primary job" in the same report.
 
denverpilot said:
If it were one of us "non-famous" people, that line about the controller not providing weather wouldn't have even been in that NTSB report.

Politics. FAA's stance for all the rest of us is that if you want weather, contact FlightWatch. Controllers do weather on a time-available, best-effort basis.

"Best effort" apparently is a higher standard when it's a famous aviator on board, because we've all seen the cases where similar circumstances existed, and the controller's butt was covered with "not our primary job" in the same report.
Click to expand...
My thoughts exactly.
 
Has any Controller asked any pilot to yank and bank his aircraft hard enough to harm it?

would you if they did?

Pushing on, into a thunder storm has never been a good idea, wasn't that time, nor will it be the next time.
 
Tom-D said:
During the pull-up, he heard three or four "thumps" in rapid succession.
Click to expand...

Almost seems like an accelerated stall.

You'd think this guy was about to run into the side of the cliff the way he reacted. I'm not overly aggressive with my 35, but I have no fear of wings falling off or bending anything.
 
rainsux said:
I've seen similar damage in a Bo that had a similar flight/spiral profile.
Click to expand...

A few years back there was a 35 here at OKH, he left to go east. over lake Chelan he noticed that he could not hold altitude. or heading as usual. he reduced speed and power and descended into the pattern at Lake Chelan and on short final he had a very difficult porpoise to contend with, but landed to find the whole rivet seam just rear of the cabin had cracked all the way around the fuselage and allowed the whole tail section to drag the ground on roll out.

he said it was wobbling in flight but completely failed on landing.

The insurance company totaled the aircraft.
 
Tom-D said:
A few years back there was a 35 here at OKH, he left to go east. over lake Chelan he noticed that he could not hold altitude. or heading as usual.....
Click to expand...

Strange, from what I hear that place is too small for a 150 to land. :ihih: Bet he had a malfunctioning ASI!
 
Push
Power
Rudder
Roll
Climb

Unload the aircraft. Job 1!
Power - he was diving, probably needed to reduce power
Rudder - assume flat on the floor, no factor here
Roll - bring 'er level
Climb - bring on the G's, up to normal limits. Normal cat pos G limits are pretty high from a human perspective. I can feel my cheeks pulling back at 3.8.

This guy was on his way to a death spiral. Should have taken an unusual attitude recovery course.
 
I flew a Beechcraft in IMC for a hour tonight. Somehow I managed not to pull it apart. Must have been luck.
 
jesse said:
I flew a Beechcraft in IMC for a hour tonight. Somehow I managed not to pull it apart. Must have been luck.
Click to expand...

I got bored flying the 310 in IMC last night so I covered up the AI and HSI to have fun doing some partial panel stuff. The plane is still in one piece.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
I got bored flying the 310 in IMC last night so I covered up the AI and HSI to have fun doing some partial panel stuff. The plane is still in one piece.
Click to expand...
Did you report the instrument failures and divert to the nearest grass strip?
 
Ted DuPuis said:
I got bored flying the 310 in IMC last night so I covered up the AI and HSI to have fun doing some partial panel stuff. The plane is still in one piece.
Click to expand...

I may or may not have done the same thing in IMC the day before.
 
gismo said:
Did you report the instrument failures and divert to the nearest grass strip?
Click to expand...

No, although I did fly over Gaston's this past weekend. Perhaps I should have diverted then!

The AI and HSI have a seperate dimmer from the rest of the panel lights (actually, there are a total of 5 dimmers on the 310 to cover all the various lights on the panel). Kept on flying like that until it got closer to needing to shoot the ILS down to a bit above mins to get home. It was good practice. The other nice thing about doing this on the 310 is that it has backup instruments on the right side, so I could always look over to them if I got disoriented.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
I got bored flying the 310 in IMC last night so I covered up the AI and HSI to have fun doing some partial panel stuff. The plane is still in one piece.
Click to expand...

Before you rendered the instruments inoperative, did you comply with 91.213 and log it properly as required by 91.417 ?
 
Tom-D said:
Before you rendered the instruments inoperative, did you comply with 91.213 and log it properly as required by 91.417 ?
Click to expand...

Just as much as any instructor does during instrument training.
 
How did this restricted airspace "sneak up" on him? Jeez....
 
Ted and Jesse are hilarious....PoA humor, gotta love it....gotta keep up with the threads to get it (LOL)
 
Jaybird180 said:
Ted and Jesse are hilarious....PoA humor, gotta love it....gotta keep up with the threads to get it (LOL)
Click to expand...

Perhaps you can enlighten me?
 
unless you guys did it unintentionally, I thought it was thread creep from the thread about the pilot that took off with a new CFI with INOP AI. was still funny to me.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top