Pinecone
En-Route
T-37 and T-38 did not have VHF radios when I flew them.
Can USAF assist ATC?
- Thread starter midwestpa24
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T-37 and T-38 did not have VHF radios when I flew them.
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Velocity173
Yeah some of the “old school” A model stuff lacked VHF radios. Obviously the T-37 is retired and it’s my understanding the T-38C was upgraded with VHF.
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Velocity173
Thread kinda reminds me of work these days. We have certain hospital’s flight ops personnel that sometimes think they’re controllers. They’ll clear you for take off / land when really they have no authority to do so. Or, they try and give a radar type of traffic call using Sky Trac. With a 30 sec refresh rate, by the time they start the transmission the aircraft’s already gone by us. They issue instructions but in reality, it’s nothing more than an advisory service.
It’s about appropriate ratings and equipment. ATC radar is designed for a certain purpose while tactical radar another purpose. There are required checks for ATC radar alignment and periodic FAA flight checks to ensure it meets specific criteria. There’s a myriad of airspace policies, waivers, LOAs, etc that an E-3 controller would never have memorized. Controllers obviously have to go to a specific school to get an ATC rating (7220-1). Even that doesn’t allow the controller to work aircraft without an endorsement on the back for that particular facility and particular position (GCA, TRACON, ARTCC,etc). That takes months, sometimes years to get.
So yeah, there’s monitoring a tactical picture and then there’s controlling traffic. Two completely different things. Not trying to say they’re wanna be ATC either. AWACS and ground based tactical controllers serve a critical role in combat. Plenty of examples where AWACS relayed an important piece which provided critical SA to the pilot that they wouldn’t have known. Also, a lack of information provided can lead to disaster (Black Hawk shootdown).
It’s about appropriate ratings and equipment. ATC radar is designed for a certain purpose while tactical radar another purpose. There are required checks for ATC radar alignment and periodic FAA flight checks to ensure it meets specific criteria. There’s a myriad of airspace policies, waivers, LOAs, etc that an E-3 controller would never have memorized. Controllers obviously have to go to a specific school to get an ATC rating (7220-1). Even that doesn’t allow the controller to work aircraft without an endorsement on the back for that particular facility and particular position (GCA, TRACON, ARTCC,etc). That takes months, sometimes years to get.
So yeah, there’s monitoring a tactical picture and then there’s controlling traffic. Two completely different things. Not trying to say they’re wanna be ATC either. AWACS and ground based tactical controllers serve a critical role in combat. Plenty of examples where AWACS relayed an important piece which provided critical SA to the pilot that they wouldn’t have known. Also, a lack of information provided can lead to disaster (Black Hawk shootdown).
Last edited:
Timbeck2
Final Approach
Where and when did you fly the A-10?
Pinecone
En-Route
MD ANG early to mid 80s
Timbeck2
Final Approach
Was going to say that if you flew out of DM in the last 28 years or so, we've probably talked to each other.
Timbeck2
Final Approach
Mark Kaiser
Filing Flight Plan
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Taelius
I know of a few times where the AF assisted pilots with air-traffic issues. It’s usually never done, but there’s been times it’s happened.