A rant about dishwasher shopping....

cowman

cowman

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I'm soon to be buying a dishwasher so I hopped on some of the home improvement sites to look.

The big advertising point seems to be how quiet they are. The next advertising point seems to be styling- I guess hiding the controls is the "in" thing right now. What I don't see a lot of advertised is how well large items...like say crock pots or large skillets fit in. Nor do I see a lot about how well it actually cleans or how solidly built it is.

Basically if dishwasher A had a plaid finish with giant knobs and sounded like a chainsaw but would literally fit anything you'd cook on easily and clean it perfectly every time and dishwasher B was totally silent and had the most elegant finish/controls but felt a little flimsy, hard to fit dishes in, and didn't always get them clean I want dishwasher A.

Is it all about style and quiet now? Why are we hiding the buttons? I'm proud of the fact that I live in a time and have the means to afford technological conveniences. I see commercials now about hiding wires to your TV and neighborhoods throwing a fit cause some company wants to put up a cell tower nearby. Do you hate civilization and technology? What's going on here... am I just a freak or does anyone else feel this way?

Also why is every product/appliance made out of flimsy plastic now? Not just plastic but flimsy plastic... the cheapest it could possibly be made without falling apart under it's own weight. I want to buy a quality product.... does anyone even sell them anymore?
 
I love my dishwasher, cleans everything great, dries too. She's also a great cook.:D
 
The best two dishwashers for the home I have found are Bosch and Miele with Electrolux coming in close behind. Agree with the idea they should do what they are designed to do first and everything else next.
 
This is where reading through a whole bunch of customer reviews can be useful, to try to spot the weak performers.
 
FWIW, when the dishwasher in the old house died, we put in a Bosch. We liked it well enough that when we built the new house we put in a Bosch even thought the rest of the kitchen appliances are another brand.

Quiet, cleans well. And yes, if you have an open floorplan house, quiet is a requirement, no one wants to hear a chainsaw dishwasher when the big game is on.
 
I've been reading reviews... so far it's not helping. The typical pattern is about 1,000 5-star reviews that say THIS DISHWASHER IS AMAZING IT CHANGED MY LIFE WOW BEST THING EVER

then about 100 1 star reviews that say it's a big piece of junk that doesn't get anything clean, or dry(almost all of them say they don't dry) and that it breaks often.

I've never had or even seen a Bosh appliance at anyone's house that I can remember but I know they're a good name in the auto parts world... hmm.. will have to take a look.

Bill Jennings said:
no one wants to hear a chainsaw dishwasher when the big game is on.
Click to expand...

It's ok, I have a loud stereo hooked up to the TV. :yesnod:

But really noise doesn't bother us a lot. My wife and I are both the sort of people who need to turn a fan on to sleep. Sometimes I can hear our dishwasher in the kitchen while I'm going to sleep, it doesn't bother me.... pretty much any consistent sound like a motor or humming I can sleep through. Stuff like people talking, stuff banging around, the dog chewing on something, etc that isn't a constant noise will keep me up all night even if barely audible though. Go figure.
 
Old place had a Bosch. New place does not. I miss the Bosch. I have also heard good things about Miele.
 
It's all about styling, and little about performance. Performance costs money. Styling doesn't.
 
I would recommend Bosch, quiet very, quiet. You will find yourself opening the door while it's running, not realizing it's running! I have to look at the red light that shines on the floor to make sure it's finished before I open the door! Not cheap, but neither are BOSE headsets. :D
 
We went with Bosch. It's pretty adjustable and it's very quiet. Which, given that the kitchen is open toward our normal TV viewing seats is important to us.

Two caveats:
1) Bosch (and many others now) don't have a heating element to dry the dishes. They heat the rinse cycle very hot to warm the dishes and then let the dishes evaporate the water. Which means no more keeping plastics in the top rack (plus) but plastics (lower thermal mass) do not dry.
2) Choice of detergent is critical to clean dishes. The dealer should be able to tell you which kind (because I don't remember) but it makes a huge difference.

John
 
We also have a Bosch, I'd buy another one. Every thing fits and it works, quietly.
 
Hated the Fischer and Paykel dish drawers. Love the Meile dishwasher that replaced them. The best part is it props the door partially open after the cycle is complete so dishes don't mildew in the day(s) that pass before I unload the dishwasher.
 
I've got microwave/fridge/dishwasher from Frigidaire and have no complaints. It's the Gallery Premier series, but it really just gives it the matte finish and brushed nickel handles. The only caveat I'd add about the dishwasher is to take along your largest plates and make sure that it will fit in the racks without interference with the dish-washing mechanisms. We have a set of plates that are a bit larger than most and I can't fit them in the racks on the dishwasher as they interfere with the spray bar under the top rack. Not a big deal as we just hand-wash them on the rare occasion we use them, but something to think about. I'm also not sold on stainless-steel vs the composite materials they use.

It's never left a dish dirty, but I also don't usually put dishes in there that haven't been soaked/rinsed if heavy deposits were on there.
 
Our GE is going on 15years now, no problems other than rusted racks in some areas.

Will probably upgrade before it breaks down. It's kind of funny - dishwashers get much better over the years. The first one we ever had was low end, and very loud. Next one was so much more quiet we never thought it could get better. Then the one we have now blew that one away in the quiet category. I can't wait to 'not hear' the next one.
 
I feel your pain. We just bought a $1,300 Samsung.

Recently government regulations required dishwashers to be "energy star compliant". Among other things, that means they can't have the heater element to dry your dishes. So you have to use a "rinse aid" to make the water slide off. I guess it is like a chemical water softener, but I already have a water softener and I still need the rinse aid.

And without the additional rinse aid, and a really good liquid detergent, they don't clean worth a crap either because they use less water.

And none of them that I found are convenient to load. You can load hundreds of plates in ours, but it isn't worth a crap for bowls (big or small).

And I hate those hidden controls. Not to mention that the "Done" signal goes out after about 5 minutes. This is a pain because my wife loads it and when I see the green light I know the stuff is done and I put it away. At least it used to work that way.

And that plastic REALLY IS FLIMSY. I had the guy out here today replacing a couple of plastic parts.

And this was a $1,300 dishwasher!
 
The undisputed best home dishwasher is the Hobart LXI/LXe series under-counter unit. How about 190 degree rinse, 30 loads an hour (no misprint one every 2 min), commercial racks so you can put a large stock pot in there no problem. I have two of the older LXiH models I bought as demo units and of every appliance I have these and a Wolf commercial range are my favorites. Never had to repair either of them. On/off/wash are the only controls. Loud and super powerful, just the way it should be.

http://www.webstaurantstore.com/hob...R2Gn9EMcC3OnXo3mNFZDxaBnwVIaMIFyggaApfJ8P8HAQ
 
Alexb2000 said:
The undisputed best home dishwasher is the Hobart LXI/LXe series under-counter unit. How about 190 degree rinse, 30 loads an hour (no misprint one every 2 min), commercial racks so you can put a large stock pot in there no problem. I have two of the older LXiH models I bought as demo units and of every appliance I have these and a Wolf commercial range are my favorites. Never had to repair either of them. On/off/wash are the only controls. Loud and super powerful, just the way it should be.

http://www.webstaurantstore.com/hob...R2Gn9EMcC3OnXo3mNFZDxaBnwVIaMIFyggaApfJ8P8HAQ
Click to expand...


I'm sure you're right. But... $6,341.72? :hairraise:

Rich
 
For a reasonably priced and quiet unit, I also recommend Bosch. We've had ours for 11 years, coming from a GE which would clean the dishes but was quite loud. The Miele dishwasher was very, very quiet, but was almost twice the price of the Bosch when we bought.

Our Bosch unit is Energy Star compliant, and as others have noted, it does not have a heated dry cycle. It also does not have a food grinder, but we haven't experienced an issue with that (just periodically rinse out the steel filter screens.)

With the Bosch unit, detergent selection does matter. We had poor luck with loose powder. The liquid/gel stuff works the best, but you need to pair it with liquid rinse agent. For the past few years, we've used Electrasol (since rebranded as Finish) Powerball Tabs and no separate rinse agent, with great success.


JKG
 
Never had a Bosch, but our LG, I have to listen sometimes to see if it's running....

LG washer and dryer ... best we've ever had. Quiet. Quick.

Not too much dough either...
 
JOhnH said:
I feel your pain. We just bought a $1,300 Samsung.

Recently government regulations required dishwashers to be "energy star compliant". Among other things, that means they can't have the heater element to dry your dishes. So you have to use a "rinse aid" to make the water slide off. I guess it is like a chemical water softener, but I already have a water softener and I still need the rinse aid.

And without the additional rinse aid, and a really good liquid detergent, they don't clean worth a crap either because they use less water.

And none of them that I found are convenient to load. You can load hundreds of plates in ours, but it isn't worth a crap for bowls (big or small).

And I hate those hidden controls. Not to mention that the "Done" signal goes out after about 5 minutes. This is a pain because my wife loads it and when I see the green light I know the stuff is done and I put it away. At least it used to work that way.

And that plastic REALLY IS FLIMSY. I had the guy out here today replacing a couple of plastic parts.

And this was a $1,300 dishwasher!
Click to expand...

Yeah that's what what worries me. There's the $350-$400 dishwashers at the home improvement store that will certainly let me put some dishes in and it will spray soapy water all over them, then rinse it off. Everything on them is probably flimsy plastic that's likely to break and who knows about the internals...

Then you go look at the $600-$800 price range models. They also will spray soapy water all over the dishes, then rinse them... and also are made of flimsy plastic that looks like it will break and again who knows about the internals.

Then you get into these $1,000+ units that are often just as flimsy feeling... at best they're just OK not too solid, and again they are just going to spray soapy water on the dishes and rinse it off... and you hope you've got good internals but who really knows?

It's irritating. For a 2-4 fold price difference I want to see something... steel doors that feel solid, something that tells me I've got a more powerful pump spraying the soapy water harder, a hole I can stick my privates in and have them washed.... you know, something tangible. :mad2:
 
We purchased a high end Kitchen Aid a few years ago. The feature set was right (it had a built in grinder), and was advertised as being very quiet. In addition, it has hidden controls.

We don't like it. After a couple of years, it has become MUCH noisier. Also, it is hard to open and close the door without accidentally activating one of the hidden controls.

Would not buy again...
 
cowman said:
Basically if dishwasher A had a plaid finish with giant knobs and sounded like a chainsaw but would literally fit anything you'd cook on easily and clean it perfectly every time and dishwasher B was totally silent and had the most elegant finish/controls but felt a little flimsy, hard to fit dishes in, and didn't always get them clean I want dishwasher A.
Click to expand...


We have dishwasher A. If I had a time machine, instead of using it to control the world, I'd be content to use it to shop for appliances made out of metal.
 
txflyer said:
Never had a Bosch, but our LG, I have to listen sometimes to see if it's running....

LG washer and dryer ... best we've ever had. Quiet. Quick.

Not too much dough either...
Click to expand...
Caution! Danger, Will Robinson!

We purchased 20 LG brand 240 volt HVAC units for the hotel. They came with a 5 year warranty.

Then, they started breaking, and LG started fixing them under warranty. First the heat would fail, then the touch controls. Without changing anything or lowering the price, LG quietly dropped their warranty to ONE year and they will no longer repair them when they break after that.

33 months is their average lifespan. We have switched to buying Frigidaire, and I will never own another LG product. Their appliances are junk.
 
I'm not spending more than $250 on a dishwasher because no one other than me in my house has the energy to put the dishes in it and turn it on.

When I was a kid I'd have killed for a powered dishwasher. Kids and wives today are so lazy.
 
Well, you are all missing the most important consideration--it has to fit in the space you have.

My old Whirlpool broke last year and I nearly had to chisel it out. The wooden flooring was laid several years after the DW was installed and they didn't allow enough clearance to pull it out. Raising the counter was not feasible. Somehow I managed, but it was so tight and I couldn't find any smaller model to replace it, so I decided to overhaul it myself and hacksawed a section out of the frame so I could more easily slide it back into position. Good for another 30 years (I hope).

dtuuri
 
Which kinda of works into one of my pet peeves. They typically fasten with screws to the underside of the counter, which is particle board. I'd like to take a 2x4 upside the head of the guy who thought that was a good idea.
 
Another vote for Bosch. I am super happy with the one I got three years ago. Make sure you get one with a stainless steel tub inside.
 
Interesting post. My wife and I were looking to replace our loud GE. It cleans well, but you can't hear yourself think. It seems the nice European and Korean models don't use a heating element and use a filter instead of a grinder. They also use less water so they are energy efficient and quiet, but no longer prioritize cleaning and drying. If I wanted to clean filters and hand dry dishes I wouldn't need a dishwasher. The Whirlpool brands have those features, but I have had brand new Whirlpool appliances fail on me. For now, our search is on hold.
 
I love our dishwasher. It's a cheap Hotpoint, but it cleans the dishes just fine, and if it breaks I call Marc (our landlord) and within two days he either has it fixed or replaced. No charge.

I love renting. Owned houses for many years. I'm happy to be a renter at this point.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Caution! Danger, Will Robinson!

We purchased 20 LG brand 240 volt HVAC units for the hotel. They came with a 5 year warranty.

Then, they started breaking, and LG started fixing them under warranty. First the heat would fail, then the touch controls. Without changing anything or lowering the price, LG quietly dropped their warranty to ONE year and they will no longer repair them when they break after that.

33 months is their average lifespan. We have switched to buying Frigidaire, and I will never own another LG product. Their appliances are junk.
Click to expand...




Hmmmm, I guess life ain't so good with LG HVAC units .... :dunno:
 
Some of the low noise operation is because they removed the grinders. That's part of the tradeoff.
 
RJM62 said:
I'm sure you're right. But... $6,341.72? :hairraise:

Rich
Click to expand...

The "real" price is a lot less, but you're right they are pricey. I just got tired of having people over for dinner or the holidays, then after a long night of entertaining we were left with a HUGE pile of dishes that we had to hand wash because no dishwasher could keep up. With the Hobart the dishes are done before they get out of the driveway….. priceless.
 
Alexb2000 said:
The "real" price is a lot less, but you're right they are pricey. I just got tired of having people over for dinner or the holidays, then after a long night of entertaining we were left with a HUGE pile of dishes that we had to hand wash because no dishwasher could keep up. With the Hobart the dishes are done before they get out of the driveway….. priceless.
Click to expand...

Ah, okay. I was gonna say, I could hire someone to wash the dishes for that kind of money.

Rich
 
Consumer Reports. If you've got a public library, they've got it. Just look in the index of the latest issue to identify the back issue with a test of dishwashers.

Basically a dishwasher does nothing more than move water around. It's not rocket science.
 
Usually end up with Miele dishwashers on the boat. I don't load the machines, but I know we usually have some big pots and pans onboard. The machines typically last 4-5 years in 18 person duty.
 
txflyer said:
Hmmmm, I guess life ain't so good with LG HVAC units .... :dunno:
Click to expand...

I have not gotten good service from most LG products, 2 years on the typical laundry rig. The steam/all in one does a great job while it works, but it f it's a busy machine it's starting to fall apart after a year, and by 2 years old they aren't really worth keeping together. For a bachelor though, one would probably serve you a decade or so.
 
Flying Viking said:
Another vote for Bosch. I am super happy with the one I got three years ago. Make sure you get one with a stainless steel tub inside.
Click to expand...

Bosch you have to be careful about models, some have problems with cheap plastic components cracking and leaking.:(
 
Henning said:
I have not gotten good service from most LG products, 2 years on the typical laundry rig. The steam/all in one does a great job while it works, but it f it's a busy machine it's starting to fall apart after a year, and by 2 years old they aren't really worth keeping together. For a bachelor though, one would probably serve you a decade or so.
Click to expand...
I used to love LG electronics. :(

I learned a valuable lesson with their HVAC units: Just because a company knows how to make smartphones does not necessarily mean that they know how to make heavy duty appliances.
 
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