Princesspilot206
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Princesspilot
Please explain why the fire chief of Lake Lure did what he did...
Pilot threatened with arrest for helping NC victims of Hurricane Helene...excuse me?
- Thread starter Princesspilot206
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Please explain why the fire chief of Lake Lure did what he did...
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Snorting his way across the USA
On the surface, it sounds like the fire chief is a real douche waffle. But, often times there is more to the story.
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SoonerAviator
No good deed goes unpunished. Perfect example of "We're from the gov't and we're here to help"
I've got great stories from the evacuation of Children's Hospital, N.O., in the aftermath of Katrina. My good friend, in charge of the operation on the hospital side, said FEMA was a total incompetent clown show.
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Llewtrah
If one’s going-in assumption is the government is incompetent (at any level and in any “color” state/region, by the way), that’s what one will see.
Similarly, if one’s going-in assumption is that all PoA members are douche-nozzles, that’s also what one will see.
We should be careful with assumptions of all types.
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SoonerAviator
Sometimes the shoe fits.
Exactly what I heard too, so for the news today at the gym to say the NC governor is applauding that the federal government is doing a great job, I highly doubt that.
Bias Note: I used to be a federal government employee.
danhagan
En-Route
My nephew does guide trips and hunting and has several boats and flat boats in south Texas. After the Houston hurricane a few years ago, they traveled at their own expense with equipment to assist. They were bringing out more people than FEMA ... a local LEO told them to stop. My nephew could hear someone screaming for help from a roof top, but they were told they'd be arrested if they went in again
Daleandee
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Dale Andee
Occam's razor
Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
We are getting one side of the story.
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Llewtrah
That
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Llewtrah
I wonder if the red circle you can see on his tablet around 1:09 is a TFR he was supposed to stay out of. If so, I’d hope most pilots on here would have a different take on this…
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SoonerAviator
They are looking at the area for the news story after-the-fact. TFR may not have been in place at the time of his efforts.
Lindberg
Final Approach
He said that he wouldn't have but for the TFR that went up 20 minutes after their conversation.
Tools
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Tools
I have a slight (read HUGE) problem with authority… and still woulda.
But ABSOLUTELY do not fault the guy. And for ANY reason he chooses. I don’t wish the problems I’ve had being the way I am on anyone. Ha!
But ABSOLUTELY do not fault the guy. And for ANY reason he chooses. I don’t wish the problems I’ve had being the way I am on anyone. Ha!
Katrina was almost 20 years ago, so I wouldn't make assumptions based on that
wanttaja
En-Route
Friend of mine lives at the extreme western tip of North Carolina, the hurricane passed by just 30 miles from him (fortunately, he was on the "clean" side where the winds were less...also his home in Tampa came through as well).
He says a major part of the problem is that the local infrastructure just wasn't in place to handle major events like this. He says it'll be weeks before the death toll is truly known.
Ron Wanttaja
He says a major part of the problem is that the local infrastructure just wasn't in place to handle major events like this. He says it'll be weeks before the death toll is truly known.
Ron Wanttaja
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Llewtrah
I’d be curious how many on-scene commanders dealing with a helicopter pilot they’ve never met and about whom they have no idea of their actual qualifications, including actual helicopter rescue training, would have handled this differently for a non-emergency situation.
The pilot landing with a rescued person was beyond his control and warranted an atta-boy for the pilot. But then the chief gained accountability, and not of his choosing. Had he approved the flight and something tragic happened, it sure seems like his decision would have put himself and his department/community on the hook legally.
First Reaponders have a very tough job, especially leaders in highly complex situations. I’m not at all comfortable generically trashing them as “government employees” when we don’t have the details and when we don’t understand the risks they need to manage. His decision seemed very reasonable to me. The one “fault” may to not have put up a TFR sooner, apparently (from what’s described).
Yeah, OK - the guy’s kid was back there. Did the kid really need to be on the adventure at all? I don’t think so, personally.
The pilot landing with a rescued person was beyond his control and warranted an atta-boy for the pilot. But then the chief gained accountability, and not of his choosing. Had he approved the flight and something tragic happened, it sure seems like his decision would have put himself and his department/community on the hook legally.
First Reaponders have a very tough job, especially leaders in highly complex situations. I’m not at all comfortable generically trashing them as “government employees” when we don’t have the details and when we don’t understand the risks they need to manage. His decision seemed very reasonable to me. The one “fault” may to not have put up a TFR sooner, apparently (from what’s described).
Yeah, OK - the guy’s kid was back there. Did the kid really need to be on the adventure at all? I don’t think so, personally.
idahoflier
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idahoflier
Well, yeah, not a surprising outcome. His mistake was trying to coordinate with authorities instead of just rescuing a few people and calling it a day...
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Flymy47
When you are operating a helicopter around people who have never been around them, having a second set of experienced eyes and hands makes a difference keeping people away from the dangerous spinning things.
Youtube celebrity Cleetus McFarland had his wife riding shotgun in his Hughes 500 clearing the tail rotor into some tricky confined areas.
There are organized operations. There are calls out at the airports here in central here for the supplies needed and pilots moving from those collection points to the places needed. There's a far cry from loading up your plane with stuff you "think" are needed and flying to some place you "think" will need them rather than asking those working on the problem how you can help.
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SoonerAviator
Not to mention having a second set of eyes to look for obstructions in an unfamiliar area, as well as looking for people in distress. I don't see a thing wrong with it.
Oh, yeah….FEMA is soooo much better now!
Lindberg
Final Approach
After Harvey, I loaded up my plane with supplies and headed down to a small town near the Gulf that was cut off by flooding. They were grateful.
I have to wonder if you actually listened to the guys story and watched the video. If you did, you weren’t paying very good attention, and / or you don’t understand helicopter operations.
It’s clear the son was a useful, perhaps necessary, crew member for that particular mission.
This is one reason people die waiting for rescue. Too many people sit around assuming somebody else (the government) has it covered.
I don’t recall the hurricane name, but I flew 500 pounds of bottled water into Louisiana to some very grateful people that were still cut off days after the storm hit. It was an organized effort, but was NOT a government effort.
I have zero respect for any organized rescue effort that spends time and effort to refuse help from volunteers. In what world would you be organizing a rescue effort and be handed a helicopter out of the blue and tell them to go away?
Unless I see evidence that the heli pilot was intentionally disruptive, I’m siding with him.
Unless I see evidence that the heli pilot was intentionally disruptive, I’m siding with him.
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Llewtrah
You’re trying to rationalize the one side we can hear.
Again, I have lots of respect for first responders and don’t think it’s sensible to trash them without the facts.
Again, I have lots of respect for first responders and don’t think it’s sensible to trash them without the facts.
Leadership is tasked with delegating tasks especially in an emergency situation. Given the story did not name the leadership could be one issue as well. (Unverified story?)
It’s very draconian to say, I’ll have you arrested when the moral compass appears to be in the right place. You could say 1) nothing, 2) I’m not in a position right now to discuss this further, and let the guy be. But to signal to LEO during an emergency is a waste of critical resources.
Yes, I’d also like to hear the other side of the story as well. The pilot was not arrested in the end, so it’s unlikely we will hear about this again.
mark.staggs
Pre-takeoff checklist
No idea on this guy. I tend to think he was being helpful and give him the benefit of the doubt.
There's an organization (https://www.operation-airdrop.com/hurricane-helene) that's been up and going since Saturday shuttling and staging supplies with fixed and rotor wing and directing where the goods and help need to go. I'm not sure if he was involved with them or on his own, but it probably would've helped had he been (if he wasn't). From what I've seen in the media and second hand this seems like a well organized civilian response, given the circumstances.
There's an organization (https://www.operation-airdrop.com/hurricane-helene) that's been up and going since Saturday shuttling and staging supplies with fixed and rotor wing and directing where the goods and help need to go. I'm not sure if he was involved with them or on his own, but it probably would've helped had he been (if he wasn't). From what I've seen in the media and second hand this seems like a well organized civilian response, given the circumstances.
"Wouldn't make assumptions" means exactly that. Wouldn't assume it's better, wouldn't assume it's worse, wouldn't assume it's the same.Oh, yeah….FEMA is soooo much better now!
Whats so terrible about wanting current information?
sansoneservices
Pre-takeoff checklist
Agreed percent
Jay Urish
Pre-takeoff checklist
I really want to hear the other side. I know there is more to this story. Or it could just be a fathead control freak fire chief...
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The Little Arrow That Could
IMHO: nothing wrong about wanting current information to make an informed judgment.
But I can respect the skepticism behind expecting much from FEMA. It's deserved criticism founded on repeated shortcomings in their delivery of assistance, from Katrina to Irma/Maria, to COVID, to...
In fact, a good chunk of their wikipedia page is dedicated specifically to covering poor results, CYA actions and scandals.
And just plainly speaking, when lives are on the line and time is of the essence, most don't have a lot of respect for the ungreased gears of bureaucracy slowly beginning to turn in order to respond.
And throughout the years they've repeatedly been upstaged by more nimble aid providers, both government and private. And given that disaster response is their sole business, it's understandable that people would expect better responses.
That said, I still won't preemptively judge FEMA's response until we have a post mortem (not written by them) about how effective they were this time around.
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