You don't know what you don't know.

brien23

brien23

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Brien
Listings of twin engine aircraft with high time engines close to TBO or well over that and old avionics seem to be the normal now. Is the lure of a cheap twin and the chance to get some low price twin time overpower the reality of the condition, or pilots have no idea of what they are buying into. At what point do those trying to sell those planes realize they may be the bottom of the fool chain or is the greater fool hope still alive. It's not what you know it's the cost of what "You don't know what you don't know".
 
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brien23 said:
Listings of twin engine aircraft with high time engines close to TBO or well over that and old avionics seem to be the normal now. Is the lure of a cheap twin and the chance to get some low price twin time overpower the reality of the condition, or pilots have no idea of what they are buying into.
Click to expand...
Option 3 - compare to the price of a comparably performing single. At $500K for a used Cirrus SR22T with everything 7-10 years old, you can buy a $200K twin and put in a lot of upgrades. Depending on the as-bought state of the plane, you may end up with something that is more "current", if you have the patience to deal with the upfitting process.

From looking at the current market, it sure seems like a lot of planes are being sold off by people retiring out of ownership. From the outside it looks like they just want/need to get out of a plane that they know well and have been using for many years without any thought of needing to upgrade, and running the engines gently to avoid the cost of overhaul or replacement. Pricing reflects these realities...but you a buyer needs to go in realistically planning to make those repairs/upgrades.

Here's an example of a Twin Comanche for sale:

www.controller.com

1964 PIPER TWIN COMANCHE For Sale in Conroe, Texas

1964 PIPER TWIN COMANCHE For Sale in Conroe, Texas at Controller.com. 1964 Piper Twin Commanche located in Conroe, Texas. Annual done in April 2024.
www.controller.com www.controller.com

Annual is current, so theoretically flyable today.

Don't like the time on one engine? Fine - do an overhaul. Don't like the avionics? Put in a new glass cockpit. All in, you still have paid less than a used SR22, and now you have all new avionics and one new engine.

This is just my observation, from the perspective of a "new guy" doing early research towards a likely purchase next year.
 
I’m thinking that twins will keep our singles running longer. Every twin that stops flying is two more engine cores for the used single market.

Unless you already have 200 hours of multi, buying a twin is utterly impractical. The cost of getting 200 hours of multi is almost as much as the acquisition cost of the twin.
 
Salty said:
The cost of getting 200 hours of multi is almost as much as the acquisition cost of the twin.
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How do you calculate that?

Even at $300/hour for a Seminole, [https://www.fivebravoaviation.com/aircraft-rental] that's only $60K. That is covering 100% of your flying while you're doing it, too.

Doing the math, if you buy a $200K twin than needs $200K of upgrades and add in $60K for twin rental while you build time, you're at less than $500K. That's still lower than the price of a good used SR22T or Malibu with whatever work they would need. Heck, go ahead and buy the twin, carry liability only while it's being re-fitted, and rent either until it's complete or you have 200 hours.

Actually, nevermind. You're right. Keep telling everyone that these twins are a terrible deal, and that they should be priced even lower. :stirpot:
 
Plenty of people get insured with a wet multi. Going to be a healthy dual time requirement, though.
 
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