Which audio panel to buy?

jd21476

jd21476

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jd21476
I have a ‘59 Piper Comanche with a GNC 355, G5 HSI and GTX330ES. My audio panel is old and I am going to install a new one. I know most of the cost is on the install but which panel should I get?

I want it to be a 4 place system and I have been looking at the Garmin 345.
 
jd21476 said:
I have a ‘59 Piper Comanche with a GNC 355, G5 HSI and GTX330ES. My audio panel is old and I am going to install a new one. I know most of the cost is on the install but which panel should I get?

I want it to be a 4 place system and I have been looking at the Garmin 345.
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That would be my choice since you already have Garmin in your panel.
I have one and love it. Sounds great, stereo, play back, bluetooth, etc.
 
PS Engineering also makes great audio panels. I put their 8000BT in my plane in 2013 and it has been awesome. It’s worth at least comparing to other audio panels on your list. Everything else in my radio stack is Garmin except this… if that tells you anything. At the time this was installed, it was much better than the Garmin audio panel but I can’t say how much the PS and the Garmin have changed or improved over the last eight years. Do your homework. Best of luck with whatever you go with.

https://www.ps-engineering.com/
 
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I have a Garmin GMA 340, which I didn't know sucks, but I like it just fine. It was cost effective too.

Based on my experience with it, I suspect I would like a GMA 345 just fine too and wouldn't hesitate to install one.

PS Engineering is good too.

I also use passive David Clark H10-13.4 headsets, so I guess consider the source.
 
I have the Garmin 345 and the 3D audio is fantastic, phone calls are clear and people I talk to on the phone can not tell that I am talking to them while flying.
 
flyingron said:
PS Engineering. Garmin panels suck.
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:yeahthat:

Gary Ward said:
\[GMA345] would be my choice since you already have Garmin in your panel.
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Except for the GMA350c, there's nothing about an audio panel that talks to anything else except via plain old audio signals. In other words, already having Garmin in your panel makes no difference at all.

jd21476 said:
which panel should I get?
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PMA450b. The price difference between that and lesser panels are a couple tanks of gas (and getting fewer the way gas prices are trending these days).
 
Walboy said:
I have a Garmin GMA 340, which I didn't know sucks, but I like it just fine. It was cost-effective too.

Based on my experience with it, I suspect I would like a GMA 345 just fine too and wouldn't hesitate to install one.

PS Engineering is good too.

I also use passive David Clark H10-13.4 headsets, so I guess consider the source.
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Dear Walyboy, before you purchase the GMA345, there are a couple of questions you should ask you dealer before you make your decision. They should tell you that the GMA345 doesn't have music distribution but only music selection that everyone will hear. Why is that important? If you want to hear Foreflight alerts, EVERYONE will hear Foreflight alerts unless you are in Isolate or Crew mode. Our audio panels have music distribution. The PMA450B has abundant modes of music distribution while the PMA8000G has music distribution modes that will probably suit most of your needs.

Additionally, the GMA345 only allows one Bluetooth device while our PMA8000G and PMA450B allows for 2 Bluetooth devices. The PMA450B has unprecedented music distribution, music muting, and music volume for the pilot, copilot, and the 4 passengers are treated as a group. No other audio panel has this capability.

The GMA345 comes with a laminated card so you know how to access the 10 "secret clubhouse handshakes". Our audio panels are intuitive with no need for a cheat sheet.

Don't get me wrong about GARMIN, they are an AMAZING avionics manufacturer and have provided more innovations in avionics than just about any other company. It's just that we have been laser-focused for 37 years on providing the best value and capable audio panels. It is our only business.
 
Another happy PS Engineering user. When we put it in and compared to other products it won hands down.
 
Ad me to the list of very happy PS Engineering users
 
Ive had a PMA 450, a 450A and now a 450B. Setting aside the argument about which one is functionally better, the service side and availability of talking directly to the man who designs them when you call is worth a lot. I’ve called probably 5-6 times over the past few years and Mark has always answered my questions regardless of how trivial it is or even when it was me not reading the manual.

I had the option of dropping the PMA when installing my G3X and I told the shop absolutely not. The PMA stays.
 
We have two PS Engineering Panels (8000BT versions) and are very happy with them.

I fried one of them when a lose wire contacted a hot bus and they fixed it for a very reasonable cost in a very short downtime with no dealer visit/avionics shop visit required. It was a brand new panel and I fessed up what happened to it and they did a great job.
 
I have a PAC24 which was a slide in replacement for an old king audio panel. I'm very pleased with it.

However what I was most impressed with was the never ending replies to all my questions by the guy who I believe runs the company.

Not at one point did he think I was wasting his time and with all the questions and the lack of commitment to actually purchase his equipment he could of easily come to that conclusion.
 
ChucktheTruck said:
Are the PMA8000G and PMA450B both plug and play with the Garmin 340 like the 345?
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I'm sure Mark will be along shortly, but yes with the caveat that the PMA's has some capabilities that the Garmin's do not. Those may need some additional wiring to enable if you want that additional capability.
 
ChucktheTruck said:
Are the PMA8000G and PMA450B both plug and play with the Garmin 340 like the 345?
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Yes, 100%
If you want the additional functionality of flightmate(R), that would require wiring by an avionics shop.
 
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My Garmin GNA-340 has been trouble-free, but if I were buying now, I would probably spring for a PS Engineering unit. Lots of features have become available in audio panels since the 340 came out. But either Garmin or PS Engineering units should be very reliable. The old "audio panels" like the Narco CP-126 were really more like switches and not fully compatible with modern avionics. I got the GMA-340 so I could integrate and isolate audio properly with a GNS-430W and some other more modern avionics. You might be able to get a deal on a used GMA-340 or an older PS Engineering unit, depending on how important it is to have the latest and greatest features.
 
chemgeek said:
My Garmin GNA-340 has been trouble-free, but if I were buying now, I would probably spring for a PS Engineering unit. Lots of features have become available in audio panels since the 340 came out. But either Garmin or PS Engineering units should be very reliable. The old "audio panels" like the Narco CP-126 were really more like switches and not fully compatible with modern avionics. I got the GMA-340 so I could integrate and isolate audio properly with a GNS-430W and some other more modern avionics. You might be able to get a deal on a used GMA-340 or an older PS Engineering unit, depending on how important it is to have the latest and greatest features.
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The 450 series is a direct slide in replacement for your 340. Ball is in your court…:popcorn:
 
mscheuer said:
Yes, 100%
If you want the additional functionality of flightmate(R), that would require wiring by an avionics shop.
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Are you coming to sun n fun?
 
I have a PS BT in my Sundowner (I don't remember if it is a 4000BT or a 6000BT), and a PS 450b is going in my Cessna. The 450b has a way of sending COM1 in at a slightly higher volume than COM2, or whatever way you select it. So you can monitor Approach while you are getting ATIS. I haven't tried it yet, but it has been well-reviewed. I like the BT in the Sundowner. Everything else on the Cessna and Sundowner is Garmin.
 
If you want to save a *smidge* of money and stick with Garmin, I have the GMA342, which is the 345 but without bluetooth. I like it.
 
Unit74 said:
The 450 series is a direct slide in replacement for your 340. Ball is in your court…:popcorn:
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But my GMA-340 is still working for now...and it serves me well for what it needs to do. But in general I like the convenience of slide in replacements when the time comes. My GNS-430 is going to turn in to a pumpkin (that is, an Avidyne IFD-440) someday when it is no longer supported and/or is unfixable.
 
chemgeek said:
But my GMA-340 is still working for now...and it serves me well for what it needs to do. But in general I like the convenience of slide in replacements when the time comes. My GNS-430 is going to turn in to a pumpkin (that is, an Avidyne IFD-440) someday when it is no longer supported and/or is unfixable.
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Mine was too. And the 450 when I traded that for the 450A. And the 450A when I traded on the 450B.

Hey Mark….. do I hear a 450C that will talk to ATC for me and brew a cup of coffee yet?
 
As a CFI that flies a lot of different airplanes and audio panels I generally find the all seem work quite well. Built in intercom's are nice if you don't already have a good intercom but haven't really found much advantage to the built in ones over a good stand alone intercom. The one feature I have seen that I really liked was the last call play back. I don't recall which one had that feature, but it was really cool to push the button and have it repeat the last radio call received. I believe it was one of the PS engineering panels with that feature but could just have easily been a Garmin.
So pretty much what features do you want and which one has it?
The typical features.
Built in intercom.
Built in Marker Beacon
Built in Audio/Music (input or USB)
Audio playback feature.

Others that actually own them can comment on features I missed, or perhaps point out some of the ones that have annoying "features"


Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
LesGawlik said:
The 450b has a way of sending COM1 in at a slightly higher volume than COM2, or whatever way you select it. So you can monitor Approach while you are getting ATIS. I haven't tried it yet, but it has been well-reviewed.
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Actually, that's HRTF (aka "Head Related Transfer Function" aka "3D audio" aka "Intelliaudio"). COM1/COM2/copilot/passenger sound like they're coming from different spots in the airplane. You'll need a stereo headset to take advantage of it.

 
brcase said:
The one feature I have seen that I really liked was the last call play back.
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One feature I would add to the "must have" list is auto squelch. Every time I step into a new airplane I have to fumble with the manual squelch control until it works OK. And when it works OK on the ground, it probably needs to be readjusted when we fly (because of the increased noise level). The best squelch control is the one that is invisible to the pilots.

- Martin
 
Martin Pauly said:
One feature I would add to the "must have" list is auto squelch. Every time I step into a new airplane I have to fumble with the manual squelch control until it works OK. And when it works OK on the ground, it probably needs to be readjusted when we fly (because of the increased noise level). The best squelch control is the one that is invisible to the pilots.

- Martin
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Good point, really an intercom function, but pertinent if the Audio panel has an intercom built in.
Question? do any intercoms/Audio Panels actually have an "Auto" Squelch?
I have only seen/noticed two styles Fixed Squelch (I.e. set internally) or of course the typical Manual Squelch. Actually I don't recall ever seeing a standalone intercom or audio panel that didn't have a manual squelch. I have seen some fixed squelch intercoms built into radios.
if you always fly with the same or good quality headsets a fixed squelch is fine.
But most trainers I fly in we change headsets every hour and many microphones seems to require a slightly different squelch settings.
Having individual squelches for each headset can be helpful to tune out that noisy headset without making it chop everyone else conversation.

One of my more common tasks when checking people out in new airplanes is figuring out how to set the internal squelch settings properly, usually on radios or radio with built in intercoms.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
brcase said:
Good point, really an intercom function, but pertinent if the Audio panel has an intercom built in.
Question? do any intercoms/Audio Panels actually have an "Auto" Squelch?
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Yes. PS Engineering calls it "IntelliVox". The Garmin 350 series audio panels also have automatic squelch.

- Martin
 
I replaced my 340 with the 350c. Love the panel and works flawlessly. Great buy and no regrets. Everything else is my panel is Garmin too.

I rented a well equipped 172 with the PS engineer panel. It would not stay connected to my BT and the connection was terrible. I was not impressed and that was my only experience with PS engineering. I have no idea what model it was.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Salty said:
But is Mark?
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I was, just left a few hours ago, what a great show! And of course without the help from Greg and Lucas, it would have been bedlam!

Now, for Fracpilot, anytime when any of our BT audio panels don’t work perfect with the Bluetooth function, simply reset the Bluetooth using the simple instructions in the pilot guide for that particular audio panel..

Being a rented aircraft, once an 8th Bluetooth device is paired, it automatically deletes randomly one of the 8 to make room for the newest paired.

I’m sorry you had problems, fortunately for us, our designs have been using Bluetooth since 2006 and with 10 of thousands in the field, actual failures of our Bluetooth is extremely rare.
 
Unit74 said:
Sounds like a rhetorical question. PSE is ALWAYS there.
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This marked our 37th year as an exhibitor and truthfully, it is just as exciting talking with our customers and potential new customers as it was years ago.
 
So I just put a deposit down at an avionics shop to order a PS Engineering 450b for me. As long as it is not back ordered then it should get installed soon.
 
I have a Garmin panel. It sucks. It's the second one. The first one left me AOG because I was based in the class B and couldn't deal with nordo. Garmin has no quick turnaround service, but they were happy to ship me a new one overnight if I bought it. I'd think long and hard before putting another Garmin anything in my plane.
 
So today after I had landed and exited the runway, I was taxiing to parking when I heard someone key up their mic:

"Direct to Columbia"
(a few seconds later, another key up) "Columbia Airport"
(a few more seconds later) "Columbia (pause) Well it worked yester..."

Don't be that guy*. Don't buy a GMA350c. :rolleyes::)

(*) Apparently that guy was trying to use the voice recognition feature and pressed the wrong button.
 
We put the PMA8000G in our plane last year, love it. And yes, other than the audio panel, our stack odd all Garmin.
 
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