United CEO says it's passenger's fault regarding seat pitch

[Cap'n Jack]

Seems like most of us (at least those posting here) pretty much have terrible experiences with UA due to a cornucopia of reasons. Wondering if anyone would actually care to sing their praises, or have any positive stories to share? I have positive stories to share from JBU and DAL (more than just one for each too!) but can't say that for AA or UAL

I actually find the people I'm in contact with at UAL to be nice. Even if they don't have the authority (or whatever you want to call it) to help me, they have been nice about it. I likewise stay polite to them- they are just doing their job and I know that they have limits to what they can do. Maybe that's why they get a supervisor with the authority to help me.

 

[jordane93]

I actually find the people I'm in contact with at UAL to be nice. Even if they don't have the authority (or whatever you want to call it) to help me, they have been nice about it. I likewise stay polite to them- they are just doing their job and I know that they have limits to what they can do. Maybe that's why they get a supervisor with the authority to help me.

You're better than most people. People think if they scream louder at our gate agents and customer service reps, they'll get their way.

 

[iflyforfun]

Seems like most of us (at least those posting here) pretty much have terrible experiences with UA due to a cornucopia of reasons. Wondering if anyone would actually care to sing their praises, or have any positive stories to share? I have positive stories to share from JBU and DAL (more than just one for each too!) but can't say that for AA or UAL

I'm not sure I'd sing their praises, but you know what you get with United. I fly United very regularly (Premier 1K) and while they are not great, they get me where I'm going safely. Once you have status, Premium Economy is free, so I almost never fly economy and much of my flying in long-haul in business. I think I'm paid as much for my willingness to accept a brutal travel schedule as I am for the work I do, but lounge access, Economy Plus / Business and boarding first makes a great deal of difference. One thing I accept with United is that I fly at their convenience. If you are docile and understand that the flight attendants in general barely tolerate your presence, you get good service. Get demanding or ugly and you will get **** service. I don't have a problem being polite to (not stupid) people, so it really isn't much of an issue for me and it turns out many United people are good people, they just have a ****ty attitude working for a crappy management team.

And what's up with that 2-4-2 seating in United business class, with 4 seats in the middle?

8 across sleeping nose-to-nose with the big dude next to me did not seem worth the multi thousand $$ price premium over 9 across in economy.

And half the seats are rear facing.

Perfect example of the idiocy of United management. I flew this configuration ONCE. I called the 1K line and told them "never again ... $7k for a middle seat, are you out of your mind". Their immediate answer was "Sir, we're in the process of rolling out the Polar blah, blah, blah". There much touted new Polar experience should get them up to about average for the current airline industry but doesn't appear to be anything special. I live by Seat Guru and only fly United international Biz class on the former Continental planes which have the vastly superior 1-2-1 configuration on the Asia long-hauls. I believe even the moron senior management team at United knows the 2-4-2 is losing them business. I would love to see the inside machinations of the United senior management team ... seems they exist to **** off their employees and customers. Can you IMAGINE the meeting where someone proposed 2-4-2 seating for business class and it actually got approved! Do these frigging morons never actually fly?

All of this said, economy plus or its equivalent is available on many/most airlines except the super cheap. People bitching about seat pitch just need to pay a few $s more and they won't have a problem. If you want cheap with no leg room and no checked bags, its an option. No one MAKES you take it. If you want a bit more leg room, if you want "free" snacks and want to take a bag, pay for it and its yours. Everyone wants the cheapest ticket and then ******* about it ... just stupid. I take personal trips on Cebu Pacific and Air Asia on occasion. Hate the airlines but don't ***** about it ... they give me exactly what I want when I take them ... a super cheap but safe flight to my holiday destination.

 

[Sundancer]

If it's a public company it's required to be disclosed, even if one is not a stockholder. When researching a company for investment potential buyers of the company's stock may want to know that/

Understood - I meant it's up to the company to determine CEO compensation, and while anyone can have an opinion on the $$$, their opinions aren't relevant.

 

[Gerhardt]

I don't really care about legroom or reclining seats. I just want the cheapest fare.

Someone mentioned going to a funeral in a suit and how everyone else was dressed casually on the flight. I don't mind that everyone is wearing tshirts and shorts...on the flight. The last few funerals I've gone to there were people THERE in tshirts. That, I mind.

 

[Larry in TN]

Thanks, so that makes some sense, and makes sense why "early bird checkin" would be desired. But, is there also no reward for loyalty?

Southwest's FF program has two levels of status; A-List and A-List Preferred. Both put you near the front of the line for boarding order--Biz Select fare-payers are at the front. You can also earn a Companion Pass which allows you to bring a companion along on your flights for free.

It really becomes frustrating when traveling with friends and family, as having a row of seats for each of us is not always possible.

Actually, with a reasonably early boarding pass it is often easier to get good seats, or seats together, on a SWA flight than as a no-status flyer on an airline that assigns seats. You have to understand their system, and there is no guarantee, but you aren't faced with picking from seat maps with nothing but middle seats available as you often are as a no-status flyer on other airlines.

And how about the UAL flagged regional jets operated under "United Express"? I know they are separate airlines, but from a customer point-of-view, they are all United Airlines. A lot of these planes still don't have wifi

All of the 70/76 seat Express airplanes have wifi and PDE streaming. None of the 50-seat, or smaller, airplanes have it.

 

[Rcmutz]

I got into a price war once running my first business. Customer visits were up, but sales were flat. Went back to being 25% more expensive but still with the best customer experience. Lost customers, made tons of money. I don't know the vagaries of the business but it's possible the airline industry could solve a lot of problems if they raised prices substantially. Lower pax loads means either tons less fuel or tons more cargo go on every flight. I'd love to see an industry-wide shift to raise coach prices by $100-150/seat.

This what airline deregulation brought us in the late 1970's. When the government regulated the price, airlines had to compete on service. With deregulation, competition is based on price. Deregulation also brought us a consolidation of the industry, which resulted in less competition and more pressure to compete on price versus service. Add to this the fact that in the US we committed to airplane, and let our rail system go to hell, drove the masses who want cheap fares to the airlines. But as you point out the airlines control the business model, and they can change it. Although with all the revenue streams they have created, thanks in come cases to the government, I doubt we see much change anytime soon. But I am like you, I generally pay the extra $50-75 per leg, at least for the long ones, to get the extra leg room.

 

[Tantalum]

I generally pay the extra $50-75 per leg

Same here... so maybe in a sense we do still have a choice, you get your "economy" seats in the *economy* cabin, and if you are willing to pay the extra $50 (which in the grand scheme of things is not much) then you have that choice. You get some more legroom and on DAL you get some more free snacks and drinks

**Makes me wonder, if those upgrades start selling out more and more, then will the airlines increase the cost of the upgrade seats, or put more upgrade seats on the plane? Or both?

 

[Rcmutz]

I dunno, but I'm not saying these were first-class seats fitted into economy, but they were significantly better than any of the other Econ seats I've sat in over the years. Not to mention the legroom and free satellite TV as well. As I said in a prior post, I believe that the new aircraft entering airline service have upgrades such as these, so we'll likely see it more and more. I can't imagine how much better first class could have been IMO.

Don't get to excited. You may have been on a plane that was configured for international flight or for conus to Hawaii, and they needed to move the plane to another location or it was a substitute for a AOG plane.

Btw- the dividing walls between first class, and coach on the smaller planes like the 737 you were on can be moved.

 

[MIFlyer]

I often wonder what the breakpoint is. How much extra do they make by the extra seats they can squeeze in.
Also, not that much bit it would make the plane slightly lighter (passengers and their baggage, times say 10-12) etc.

Because while I can't or won't pay the huge extra amount for business class, I definitely would choose a ticket that was somewhat (100,150 bucks) more expensive if I knew it meant legroom and comfort. I can't believe I'm the only one.

On flights longer than a few hours, I really do wonder what the difference in price would be to make up for their lost seats if they took a row or even two out. That price, spread among x amount of passengers, seems like it ought to be doable. And an honest ad campaign ("for x dollars more, you will have y amount more room over our competitors when you fly, so when you get to your destination, you'll feel a lot better!") ought to win them a lot more folks.

The majority of folk may only choose the cheapest (until they get tired of being conned, finding out there are lots of add on costs, and the price isn't the real price) but I suspect there is still a large enough market that would pay a little more for comfort. But currently we can't "vote with our wallet" because it isn't an option.

Oh wait, there is one carrier in the US that offers more room isn't their?

i'm in the same boat. I can't justify a grand more for a first class ticket, and work won't pay for it, but I could swing an extra $100, even if I pay out of personal funds.

also, WTF with width. I spend the whole flight holding my shoulders in, which is just fantastic. i'm not that big and heavy, but have broad shoulders that I can't really do anything about except stay in a fetal position. I need an airplane of my own...

 

[MIFlyer]

if you want some reasonable comfort - you can pay for it via the seats with extra legroom.

Delta even gives you free drinks.

United is currently the worst at lying to passengers about delays and uncomfortable seats -

Delta is currently best -= AA is in the middle.

Alaska is kinda good in a class all its own because it lacks an extensive network -

Then you have the 'other' airlines - and I rank them such:

JetBlue
Southwest
then tied for last and worst

Alleigant
Frontier
Spirit
Suncountry
and whomever may not have been mentioned.

ALL of the Regionals suck because of seat width, lack of reliable dispatch and no consequence if they are not on time -

too bad AirTran is gone. i found them to be extra horrible.

Example, after sleeping in the ATL airport for 16 hours while they slowly delayed our flight an hour at a time, they finally "fixed" the plane. so we depart (16 hours after scheduled), fly about 30 minutes. Captain comes on "OK folks, so the problem that maintenance thought they fixed is still acting up, so we need to return to Atlanta). I'm like, can we please land ANYWHERE but ATL (this was as a huge conference in ATL was ending and 16,000 people are trying to leave town. Please, land somewhere else where I MIGHT be able to get another flight). Nope, back to ATL for another 8 hours.

in fairness, i did get a free ticket on AirTran for that, which would have been sweet, except I would never schedule them again.

Also, not sure why Delta gets ranked so high, I've never had a delta flight that wasn't cancelled or delayed by 3-4 hours, honestly.

Alaska does pretty well, except they have a small network. I've had good luck on United and Lufthansa and Hawaiian.

Funniest thing on Alaska flight as we're making third attempt to land at PAPG "OK folks, if this one doesn't work we've got to head back to Juneau for more fuel and we'll try to get you to Petersburg tomorrow."

 

[RyanB]

Don't get to excited. You may have been on a plane that was configured for international flight or for conus to Hawaii, and they needed to move the plane to another location or it was a substitute for a AOG plane.

All of Delta's 737-900ER's have the same configuration. If it happened only once, than I might think it was a coincidence. Think again.

 

[hindsight2020]

i'm in the same boat. I can't justify a grand more for a first class ticket, and work won't pay for it, but I could swing an extra $100, even if I pay out of personal funds.

also, WTF with width. I spend the whole flight holding my shoulders in, which is just fantastic. i'm not that big and heavy, but have broad shoulders that I can't really do anything about except stay in a fetal position. I need an airplane of my own...

Yup. That's my issue with airline travel as well. Frankly, that's the bigger issue for me, not seat pitch. The width is just terrible. The only way I can get some relief is to travel with family whenever I can just so I can use personal proxemics to alleviate the contortion. 5 hours of contortion does a real job on ya.

 

[wsuffa]

IOW SWA isn't the best airline to be a frequent flier member of.

Depends on what's important to you. For you it may not be, for others it may be.

No other airline that I know of has what Southwest has in their Companion Pass.

Southwest does not assess some fees to any one (reserved seat fees, first checked bag fee, change fees) that other airlines either don't waive or only waive for status frequent flyers.

If international travel or upgrades are important, then Southwest is probably not the airline for you. But note, with respect to upgrades, that the other airlines are becoming more and more stingy... to the point where unless you're a super-uber-top-tier flyer that's spending many, many $$$ in the prior rolling 12 months you won't get upgraded with any regularity. Some even try to sell the upgrades rather than provide them to frequent flyers. In my way of thinking, if you have to sit in economy anyway, you'd be better off on Southwest with a bit more legroom and some cabin service.

 

[Stewartb]

I fly a lot. I'm 6-2 @220# so not huge but not small. The comfort level of a standard coach seat in a 737-900 is far and away better than in an old MD-80. I choose my airline and my itinerary with the aircraft in mind.

 

[SkyDog58]

Just got back to the US from China. This was my sixth trip to Asia which I know is not a lot compared to some others on here. We flew United and it was the worst trip ever for a variety of reasons that I won't enumerate in their entirety except to say that the seats were uncomfortable and the FAs a bit surly. The choice of carriers was left to the wife who happens to be too much of a bargain shopper at times. oh well, at least we made it back in one piece.

 

[Larry in TN]

also, WTF with width.

Seat width on narrow-bodies hasn't changed. The narrow-body Boeings have always been six-across in Economy and the fuselage width has remained the same. The Airbus narrow-bodies are slightly wider, due to the wider fuselage, which adds about 1/2-inch to each seat's width over the Boeings. The newer E-Jet series RJs from Embraer are four-across and have wider seats than any of the older mainline jets. The new Bombardier C-Series RJs will be even wider with it's five-across layout that gives extra width to the single middle-seat in each row.

Widebody aircraft have always had slightly more width, and pitch, than the narrow-bodies due to their long-haul missions. Exceptions are for wide-bodies configured for high-density short-haul flying which often have an extra seat in each row. I don't think widebodies, though, are what people here are complaining about.

 

[deonb]

also, WTF with width. I spend the whole flight holding my shoulders in, which is just fantastic. i'm not that big and heavy, but have broad shoulders that I can't really do anything about except stay in a fetal position.

Ditto. I'm now resigned to always buy 3 seats between my wife and me. And then having to fight with the FA's on every flight because they want to use the empty seat for their overbooking shenanigans.

 

[MIFlyer]

Seat width on narrow-bodies hasn't changed. The narrow-body Boeings have always been six-across in Economy and the fuselage width has remained the same. The Airbus narrow-bodies are slightly wider, due to the wider fuselage, which adds about 1/2-inch to each seat's width over the Boeings. The newer E-Jet series RJs from Embraer are four-across and have wider seats than any of the older mainline jets. The new Bombardier C-Series RJs will be even wider with it's five-across layout that gives extra width to the single middle-seat in each row.

Widebody aircraft have always had slightly more width, and pitch, than the narrow-bodies due to their long-haul missions. Exceptions are for wide-bodies configured for high-density short-haul flying which often have an extra seat in each row. I don't think widebodies, though, are what people here are complaining about.

informative, thank you. 90% of my flights are domestic, usually 737s, A320's if I can't avoid them (i'm in Boeing's town, so we try to support the home team). I've been on some MD80
s and a couple of RJ's, but only one 747.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Never claimed to be proud of anything. Just saying I don't care or pay attention to my group. What's disgusting is that airlines are apparently now charging people to board before others... but I guess people are willing to pay for that kind of thing, so whatever.

<SNIP>!

My experience with UAL is that people with status (1K, premier), 1st class, or have the UAL credit card (with the fee) can board first. Delta was the same but without the credit card people (the few times I flew on them). Maybe some airlines charge for early boarding, but these two haven't recently.

 

[Larry in TN]

Maybe some airlines charge for early boarding, but these two {DAL & UAL} haven't recently.

Delta sells it as Priority Boarding:

PRIORITY BOARDING
Once you experience the advantages of early boarding, you'll want it every time. Secure the best overhead bins for your carry-on bags and have time left over to get settled comfortably. Add Priority Boarding to an upcoming flight now.​

United as Premiere Access:

Purchase Premier Access to speed up your airport experience.

Premier Access® lets you enjoy the convenience of dedicated airport check-in lines, exclusive security lanes at select airports and priority boarding, so you can get to the gate, your seat, and the overhead bin sooner.

Prices, starting at $15, are segment-based and subject to change. Premier Access is subject to availability. Premier Access purchases do not include priority baggage handling.​

Southwest as EarlyBird Checkin:

EarlyBird Check-In is a low-cost option giving you the convenience of automatic check-in before our traditional 24-hour check-in. You’ll have the benefit of an earlier boarding position. As an EarlyBird Check-In Customer, you will have a better opportunity to select your preferred available seat and have earlier access to overhead bin storage for your carryon luggage.
​

I haven't check but I would think that most US airlines have similar add-on products. At these three airlines, passengers with status board before those who bought these add-on products but before those with neither.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Delta sells it as Priority Boarding:

PRIORITY BOARDING
Once you experience the advantages of early boarding, you'll want it every time. Secure the best overhead bins for your carry-on bags and have time left over to get settled comfortably. Add Priority Boarding to an upcoming flight now.​

United as Premiere Access:

Purchase Premier Access to speed up your airport experience.

Premier Access® lets you enjoy the convenience of dedicated airport check-in lines, exclusive security lanes at select airports and priority boarding, so you can get to the gate, your seat, and the overhead bin sooner.

Prices, starting at $15, are segment-based and subject to change. Premier Access is subject to availability. Premier Access purchases do not include priority baggage handling.​

Southwest as EarlyBird Checkin:

EarlyBird Check-In is a low-cost option giving you the convenience of automatic check-in before our traditional 24-hour check-in. You’ll have the benefit of an earlier boarding position. As an EarlyBird Check-In Customer, you will have a better opportunity to select your preferred available seat and have earlier access to overhead bin storage for your carryon luggage.
​

I haven't check but I would think that most US airlines have similar add-on products. At these three airlines, passengers with status board before those who bought these add-on products but before those with neither.

Thanks for the update. I don't recall them trying to sell it to me recently. An upgrade to economy plus in the UAL app, yes, but not early boarding. My boarding pass is usually (not always) after whatever groups gets the special boarding, but in "general boarding"

 

[Goofy]

Well, American is getting generous...by a whole inch....!

American says it can be a leader in changing people’s perceptions about air travel.

“It is clear that today, airline customers feel increasingly frustrated by their experiences and less valued when they fly. We can be leaders in helping to turn around that perception,” states the memo.

The airline will return to 30-inch-pitch seats in the 737 MAX.

 

[JOhnH]

First, great companies don't make a crappy product just because they can't figure out a better way to compete in the market. Good companies don't blame their customers for their own lousy product. United needs to decide what customers they want to focus on and make the experience exceptional for those customers; attempting to compete with Emirates and Spirit on the same airplane does not serve that goal well.


JKG

Spoken like a man that has never run a company in a very competitive business.

 

[Goofy]

Entertaining way to put it...

"Engineers would say technically sardines are still packed tighter. But the difference between a can of oily fish and a coach cabin of sweaty airline passengers is getting smaller."

Wondered why they can't just widen the fuse a bit so us with shoulders can fit. Turns out they did, lotta good it did!

"Seats on widebody planes used to be 18 inches wide, but now that is dwindling to 17 inches. The Boeing 787 was designed to have eight seats across, but now almost every airline flies it with nine 17-inch-wide seats in each row. The Boeing 777 has gone from nine abreast to 10. One airline—French leisure line Air Caraïbes, has installed 10 seats across each row of its brand new Airbus A350 jets. Other airlines have nine seats, but will that last?"

 

[denverpilot]

Well, American is getting generous...by a whole inch....!

American says it can be a leader in changing people’s perceptions about air travel.

“It is clear that today, airline customers feel increasingly frustrated by their experiences and less valued when they fly. We can be leaders in helping to turn around that perception,” states the memo.

The airline will return to 30-inch-pitch seats in the 737 MAX.

So you're saying they found a way to say that they'd be landing that thing above tire speed in the seat pitch they really wanted, so slower and less seats is actually a plus? LOL.

 

[Ghery]

Flew Hong Kong Airlines from Nanning to Hong Kong today. Pitch? What Pitch? Where's the freakin' pitch?

That is why ANA is on my "never again in coach" list. I had a trip in 2012 which ran SEA-NRT-TPE-NRT-BKK-NRT-SEA. A week in Taipei, followed by a week in Bangkok. UA had quit flying the NRT-TPE leg for a while and the cheapest way to get from Taipei to Bangkok was to return to NRT and then to Bangkok. So, the NRT-TPE, TPE - TPE and TPE - BKK legs were on ANA. Legroom? What legroom? My knees where into the seat back in front of me before that person even thought about reclining. It took a month for my knees to quit hurting and I made it clear to my employer that I would NEVER ride in coach on ANA again.

Lost/delayed bags? Amazingly enough, it has happened rarely. I had a trip about 12 years ago where I was traveling to Penang, Malaysia to teach some classes at a company facility. I was supposed to go from SEA to LAX and then to Penang, through SIN. My Alaska flight to LAX was delayed enough that I know the connection would not work, so I had Alaska re-route me. SEA-SFO-HGK-Penang (bouncing in Kuala-Lumpur). With the delay in Seattle there should have been plenty of time to find my bag and re-label it. I was to get the bag at SFO and re-check it with Singapore Airlines. You guessed it, no bag in San Francisco. So, when I got into Penang I went straight to the agent in baggage claim. A few keystrokes and he said they knew where it was and it would be there the next day. No problem, I told him where I would be staying and to have it delivered. It was.

The most recent delay was a couple years ago. UA from SEA to SFO and then on to FRA. FRA to Dresden on LH. Got to Dresden, no bag. My wife's bag arrived, no problem. Gave them the name of the hotel where we would be staying (initially) in Prague. No problem, we'll deliver it. It didn't show up, we bought some clothes. Went on the Budapest and updated our location with LH. Still, no bag. Bought some more clothes. Continued on to Vienna. No bag. Got back to Dresden, checked with LH before taking a taxi to our hotel for a week for my professional society's annual symposium. No bag. Needless to say, where I would have preferred to be be wearing a coat and tie, I wasn't. While in the air between FRA and SFO going home there was a text message from LH baggage claim in Seattle (which I got after arriving in San Francisco) saying that they had found my bag. It never left Seattle. Never got put on the original flight (by UA). I had them deliver it to my home. Made unpacking easy, everything was clean and folded. Unfortunately, as LH was supposed to be the last carrier to handle it, they had to pay me for the clothes I bought in Prague and Budapest. Wasn't their fault, but...

I'm a million miler on UA, so I'm Premier Gold at a minimum for life. As is my wife. I don't miss the old CEO of the airline. Jeff Smisek was a disaster from a frequent flier point of view. And changes made since he left have not improved the experience. It's a race to the bottom. At least I have E+ seating at the time of booking. I see the posts saying wonderful things about legroom on DL. Really? They must have changed something. I've ridden them off and on since 1976 and have NEVER had adequate legroom on that airline. I regard them as the LH of American airlines. The only thing LH and legroom have in common is that they both start with the letter L. I haven't ridden American Airlines in years, so I can't say anything about them. Alaska Airlines is a good alternative, but they don't go to many places I need around the world. A trip later this year will be interesting. Hainan Airlines to Beijing, followed by S7 (whoever the heck they are) to Vladivostok. Paid a bunch extra to avoid Aeroflot coming home. S7 to Inchon and then Asiana on to SEA. Yeah, I know, I don't trust Asiana after their fiasco at SFO a few years ago, but it was that or ride around the world to get home (Aeroflot to Moscow and then on the LAX, then Alaska on to SEA).

I'm retired from full time employment, but I'm still active in international standards committee work (Chair, CISPR SC I) and consult a bit to pay for the travel. I don't mind riding the airlines to fun places (like Hawaii), but I'm getting tired of the nonsense they keep heaping on self-loading cargo. Unfortunately, GA won't work for many places I go. So, I'm stuck. I sure miss the "old days" when airlines at least appeared to value you.

 

[ktup-flyer]

Ditto. I'm now resigned to always buy 3 seats between my wife and me. And then having to fight with the FA's on every flight because they want to use the empty seat for their overbooking shenanigans.

x3. Width sucks. Every plane I've been on with slimline seats has been horrible. UA had us on a TEN abreast 772 on HNL-DEN, and I felt like I was going to die by the end of it.

 

[Larry in TN]

I see the posts saying wonderful things about legroom on DL. Really?

Delta has their version of United's E+ but it is fewer rows that UAL. American does, too.

 

[paflyer]

I don't really care about legroom or reclining seats. I just want the cheapest fare.

Guess that makes you part of the problem.

 

[paflyer]

Ditto. I'm now resigned to always buy 3 seats between my wife and me. And then having to fight with the FA's on every flight because they want to use the empty seat for their overbooking shenanigans.

I've thought of doing that for long-haul flights in coach; please explain how you prevail against the Flight Nazis.

 

[paflyer]

i'm in the same boat. I can't justify a grand more for a first class ticket, and work won't pay for it, but I could swing an extra $100, even if I pay out of personal funds.

Try the ADA gambit with your HR dept.

 

[Larry in TN]

I've thought of doing that for long-haul flights in coach; please explain how you prevail against the Flight Nazis.

Each airline has procedures for buying an extra seat (for various reasons). Google "[airline] extra seat" to find the page on your airline's web site that explains their policies and the procedure for buying the extra seat.

 

[wsuffa]

I fly a lot. I'm 6-2 @220# so not huge but not small. The comfort level of a standard coach seat in a 737-900 is far and away better than in an old MD-80. I choose my airline and my itinerary with the aircraft in mind.

I'd disagree, especially the hard-as-rock slimline seats. The Mad Dogs weren't great, but if you sat on the 2-side you didn't have an oversize (or standard American size if you get my drift) shoehorned in between.

I hate the slimline seats that seem to be going into 727-whatever these days. They have not nearly enough padding, regardless of what the airline says. Part of the reason for putting uncomfortable seats is to "encourage" you to buy up.

Well, American is getting generous...by a whole inch....!

American says it can be a leader in changing people’s perceptions about air travel.

“It is clear that today, airline customers feel increasingly frustrated by their experiences and less valued when they fly. We can be leaders in helping to turn around that perception,” states the memo.

The airline will return to 30-inch-pitch seats in the 737 MAX.

But that's not the whole story. Yes it will return the 30 inch pitch to a few rows in the very back of the plane. In return, they will remove one row of wider-legroom/pay-extra seats closer to the front.

And don't let their rhetoric fool you - this is not going to turn around anyone's perceptions of the torture that is commercial air travel today.
(mumbles something about waterboarding...)

 

[murphey]

You have a lot of choices when it comes to legroom.

All three of the largest US airlines (AA, DL, & UA) offer economy seats with extra legroom. Those seats are free for fliers with status in their loyalty programs (i.e. their customers who fly regularly). Other passengers can book the extra legroom seats for a fee which varies based on the length of flight and desirability of the particular seat. That fee is usually at, or under, about $100 for domestic flights--sometimes a lot less. United offers an annual subscription to their Economy Plus seating starting at $499--depending on the region you fly in and the number of traveling companions who you can "upgrade" with you--which can be a good option for those who fly with some regularity but not enough to earn the seats for free with status.

On United's domestic airplanes, roughly 25%-40%, depending on the airplane, of the economy seats have extra legroom. Go to the United.com site and pull up the seatmap of some flights that depart in the next day or two. You will see that what typically happens is that the regular economy seats fill up first. Usually there are quite a few E+ seats available when all of the regular E seats are assigned. This shows that most of the travelers are not willing to pay extra for the extra legroom. They'd rather save the money.



The information is easily available. www.SeatGuru.com is a good place to research airline seating and there are others. Also, the airlines that sell increased legroom seats will have that information on the booking screens to encourage the upsell.

Southwest is different. Lots more seats but not the really tight pitch of airlines like Spirit. As a comparison, Southwest puts 143 seats in their B737-700. United puts 126 seats in the same B737-700 with the extra room going to first class and Economy Plus seats. Spirit doesn't operate the B737 but the somewhat larger A320 has 178 seats with pitch of 28" compared to Southwest's 31". Spirit offers four seats, on that airplane, with increased pitch and width. United's pitch on the B737-700 is 31" in regular economy and 36" in E+.

If legroom is important to you, there are options and the information for making an informed decision is readily available.

With flights often being completely full these days, if airlines were to add more legroom--or extend the existing extra legroom throughout the economy cabin--who are we going to kick off the airplane when we remove seats to create that extra legroom? Who doesn't get to fly?



It's a weather delay.

An airport has a set acceptance rate which comes from ATC. As conditions change, weather, winds, runway construction, etc., ATC adjusts that acceptance rate. An airport might go from a rate of 60 arrivals per hour in good weather to only 40 arrivals per hour in MVFR to 30 arrivals in low IFR. ATC communicates the reductions to the airlines and the airlines decides what it will do.

So, you're the airline and have to cut 50% of your schedule at your hub due to weather. Do you cut mostly 150-180 seat airplanes or 50-70 seat airplanes? Which choice is best for your passengers? Is making choices that inconvenience the fewest number of your customers really "for the convenience of the airline"?

It sure is. The convenience of the airline translates to the larger aircraft with more pax and more money. Do not ever assume or believe anything the airlines do is for the benefit of the pax.

 

[Larry in TN]

It sure is. The convenience of the airline translates to the larger aircraft with more pax and more money. Do not ever assume or believe anything the airlines do is for the benefit of the pax.

How would cancelling the flight with the most passengers/larger airplane be best for the convenience of the passengers?

 

[murphey]

How would cancelling the flight with the most passengers/larger airplane be best for the convenience of the passengers?

You read my comment wrong. The airline will cancel the smaller aircraft. It will always inconvenience the smaller number of people to maximize income.

 

[Goofy]

Not one U.S. carrier made this list of the top 25 airlines - Gee what a surprise.....!

U.S. airlines didn’t make a big showing on the list, with United Airlines ticker coming out the highest at No. 29, followed by American Airlines (UAL) at No. 33 and Delta Air Lines (DAL) at No. 45. Past domestic rankings in the U.S. have shown Southwest (LUV) as the favorite, followed by Delta and American Airlines (AAL) JetBlue (JBLU) and Southwest have also since apparently benefited from United Airlines’ recent PR disasters, with more people considering purchasing from them instead. (These airlines were not immediately available for comment.)

However, AirHelp’s survey takes into account not just airlines’ approval rating, but also their performance. Here are the top 10 airlines:

1. Singapore Airlines

2. Etihad Airways (United Arab Emirates)

3. Qatar Airways

4. Austrian Airlines

5. Air Transat Canada

6. Air Dolomiti (Italy)

7. British Airways (U.K.)

8. Virgin Atlantic Airways (U.K.)

9. Aer Lingus (Ireland)

10. TUI fly Netherlands (Netherlands)

 

[wsuffa]

All I'll say is that BA's policies and systems are worse than some of the US carriers. And Heathrow is a place to avoid.

 

[X3 Skier]

And Heathrow is a place to avoid.

I believe it was Dennis Hopper who once said, "I never understood the term "Terminal Illness" until I was in Heathrow."

Cheers