Train vs plane

I’ve thought about this a lot; you can see it everywhere once you start looking. My pet theory is that our fight/responses are just not wired for machinery and the speeds/forces involved. People just aren’t good at anticipating the consequences of how much energy/speed/force is in the modern world. Maybe it’s not modernity; maybe it’s just things that are bigger than mammal-sized
 
In one of the shots you can see the yellow crime scene tape already up. It looks like they could have pulled the pilot out a bit earlier.
 
eman1200 said:
“Guys” as in “group if people”.

Also, because a woman would have been screaming frantically waiving her arms in the air running around in circles having no clue what to do and the guy (you know, the person who is a man) would have been crushed by the train.
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Yes, guys is a generic group. Also, there's at least one woman.
 
Looking at how beat up that Cessna was, saying it "landed" on the tracks could be debatable. Looks like it fell on the tracks.

Glad for the outcome though, those officers rock!
 
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dreyna14 said:
Oh, definitely. A train is big and that size makes it looks deceptively slow. I would never fault the officers for their course of action. I will fault the lookey-loos standing around recording things. Put the ****ing phone down and help out ***hole!!
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Oh hell no!!! If the PD or FD are on scene, stay out of the way unless asked for help.
 
Zeldman said:
My first thought is why are folks standing down stream of an accident about to happen.??
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Because you don't know what "down stream" is until you know which way the train is coming from. And in this case (I'm guessing) by that point, it's too late to relocate to be "up stream".
 
ktup-flyer said:
I just saw that. Dude needs to blow the rest of his savings on lottery tickets
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the other way to look a that is that the dude already used up all his good luck.
 
dreyna14 said:
Why complicate things? Instead of a tow strap, why not just use the cruiser to push the thing off and well clear of the tracks? I mean, the train eventually did it. See how simple?
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More simple to just drag it off by hand, no? It is just a 172 not a car. :dunno:
 
eman1200 said:
I knew you were busting balls. Or whatever genitalia people are identifying as these days.
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@Rushie got you again! ~9 months ago there was a funny exchange where she baited you into explaining other's interest in your "junk" ;-)
 
Pre-Covid I rode the Metrolink daily (another line). A few "trespasser strikes" and only 2 successful stops before, gives an appreciation of why they seen to barrel through things. They stop quick by train standards but they still can't stop on a dime. (Pesky physics)

I hope they quickly told the train crew it was non fatal. Those events mess with the conductor who has to survey the train and the scene then talk to responders.
 
eman1200 said:
Lol I don’t recall that but I certainly believe you :)
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I tried to find the thread but gave up. Search on the word "junk" posted by you. The volume of results is quite funny :)
 
dtuuri said:
More simple to just drag it off by hand, no? It is just a 172 not a car. :dunno:
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Yeah, "just a 172" is rather a PITA over our high hangar threshold; I'd hate to untangle one from tracks. Especially with an oncoming train.
 
Kenny Phillips said:
Yeah, "just a 172" is rather a PITA over our high hangar threshold; I'd hate to untangle one from tracks. Especially with an oncoming train.
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Yep, again especially when it's not sitting on the gear. The nose and the left main looked broke to me. The prop was firmly planetd on the ground and it looked like they had to lift the guy up out of the plane to get him out.
 
Jim K said:
What's surprising is the number of cops that were able to get there so fast.
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Crash site is about 100 yards from the Foothill Division police station. A few more degrees to the right and he probably would have crashed right through the front doors. (Except there is a cinder-block wall erected in front of this particular station to protect it from drive-bys. It ain't exactly Beverly Hills.)

C.
 
camorton said:
Crash site is about 100 yards from the Foothill Division police station. A few more degrees to the right and he probably would have crashed right through the front doors. (Except there is a cinder-block wall erected in front of this particular station to protect it from drive-bys. It ain't exactly Beverly Hills.)

C.
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That explains that lol
 
donjohnston said:
And for that, we are grateful.

I keep seeing comments like this when I read about this story. :rolleyes:

Police roll up, see it's on the tracks, get tow strap out of trunk, loop it around the tail of plane and hook the other end to the car. Start backing up. Fuselage twists, piece of metal slices through femoral artery in pilots leg. Airplane landing gear gets jammed in railroad track. Cop stops car. Notices red liquid pouring out from cabin. Assumes it's hydraulic fluid because pilot wasn't bleeding that bad before. Starts to approach the plane to unhook the tow strap when plane (and pilot) are destroyed by train.
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i mean the main point is that LAPD did not go "by the book" and do their required standard protocol when arriving on scene, which would have been to shoot the airplane off of the tracks

all kidding aside, great job by them and unbelievable situation that turned out about as well as it could have
 
Amtrak has what is called blended braking. It uses air brakes on the cars in conjunction with air brakes on the locomotive while at the same time using dynamic braking. Dynamic braking turns the traction motors into generators and uses electrical grids to place a load on those generators (traction motors) thus reducing the train speed speed. Kinda like when you turn on something electrical and you hear a generator motor slow down. They are still difficult to stop at 79mph on straight rail.
 
Sorry if this has already been addressed and I missed it. Watching the video, I was surprised there didn’t appear to be any smoke or fire even after the train struck it. Other than, no gas on board, interested hear the communities theories of possible explanations. TIA
 
TRC1969 said:
Amtrak has what is called blended braking.
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Most diesels and electric trains do this. This was a Metrolink Tier 4 locomotive not Amtrak.

When I worked for the Army, we had this thing called the Mobile Dynamometer (well two of them actually). They were effectively a diesel locomotive mounted on tires. It had a precise strain gauge on the towing interface and could either tow a vehicle (think tanks and stuff) and measure the energy consumed or they could be towed in dynamic braking mode and measure the electricity generated.
 
What? No "That'll buff right out" comments? Or "Do you think insurance will total it?"
 
This happened at my home airport. I've envisioned this scenario dozens of times...it's actually crazy to see it play out for real. Straight out of a Jerry Bruckheimer movie! I put together a visual analysis that might help provide a little context to how it all unfolded:
 
pmanton said:
In one of the shots you can see the yellow crime scene tape already up. It looks like they could have pulled the pilot out a bit earlier.
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The police were probably responding like any other accident and not wanting to move the pilot/patient until medical arrived. Then the train came and changed all that in a hurry.
They pulled the guy out through the missing windshield, so they were probably getting the plane ready for extraction by EMS.
 
mr_happyland said:
This happened at my home airport. I've envisioned this scenario dozens of times...it's actually crazy to see it play out for real. Straight out of a Jerry Bruckheimer movie! I put together a visual analysis that might help provide a little context to how it all unfolded:
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Well done. Have you re thinked your tracks first choice.
 
luvflyin said:
Well done. Have you re thinked your tracks first choice.
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It all depends on when the failure occurs. I've always thought the railroad tracks were a sketchy yet best choice option down low like this guy. You get up a little higher and you get a couple more options.
 
mr_happyland said:
It all depends on when the failure occurs. I've always thought the railroad tracks were a sketchy yet best choice option down low like this guy. You get up a little higher and you get a couple more options.
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Sometimes bad options are the only options.
 
mr_happyland said:
It all depends on when the failure occurs. I've always thought the railroad tracks were a sketchy yet best choice option down low like this guy. You get up a little higher and you get a couple more options.
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Yeah, people keep saying this guy was lucky, but that's not how I see it. If the engine cut 5 seconds earlier, he could have put it down on the remaining runway. Five seconds later and he could have made the golf course.

C.
 
My question has nothing to do with aviation.

my question is why the hell is a train going so fast through a densely populated area that it can’t at least slow down more than that before crossing an open access roadway? It seems stupid to be running a train at even the speed they hit the plane at, let alone any faster, assuming they attempted to stop.
 
Salty said:
My question has nothing to do with aviation.

my question is why the hell is a train going so fast through a densely populated area that it can’t at least slow down more than that before crossing an open access roadway? It seems stupid to be running a train at even the speed they hit the plane at, let alone any faster, assuming they attempted to stop.
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how fast was the train going?

from the point at which the train could have seen the obstruction, how slow would the train have to be going in order to stop in time?

edit: https://www.minnesotasafetycouncil.org/facts/factsheet.cfm?qs=858251BECECF1976F908D7D68B570E85
 
Salty said:
My question has nothing to do with aviation.

my question is why the hell is a train going so fast through a densely populated area that it can’t at least slow down more than that before crossing an open access roadway? It seems stupid to be running a train at even the speed they hit the plane at, let alone any faster, assuming they attempted to stop.
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Metrolink is a regional commuter rail. It's aim is to transport people who'd otherwise drive at freeway speeds.

The tracks are protected by fencing and double crossing gates in many populated areas. At some point you just accept that being on the track equals death for anyone on the tracks ... and sometimes ppl on the train.

An acceptable risk imo.
 
Salty said:
My question has nothing to do with aviation.

my question is why the hell is a train going so fast through a densely populated area that it can’t at least slow down more than that before crossing an open access roadway? It seems stupid to be running a train at even the speed they hit the plane at, let alone any faster, assuming they attempted to stop.
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They had no reason to slow down until they saw something on the tracks ahead of them, at which point it's far to late to stop prior to impact.
 
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