MooneyDriver78
En-Route
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Tom
I'm waiting for the day that a pilot declares an emergency when his IPad crashes.
Tablet Crash on Approach
- Thread starter airdale
- Start date
petrolero
Pattern Altitude
I carry an extra iPad (well OK three if my kids are on board). If I am shooting an approach in IMC I will have one sitting next to me with the plate displayed on it. If there were a failure, I could switch quickly.
But also this is why ForeFlight is great. It has an iphone app that has plates also - in case you don't have an extra ipad.
I also carry an external battery that can actually charge an iPad while it is ON. Made by NewTrent. I use it en route to ensure that I have juice when I arrive at my destination after a 5-hr XC.
[In any case, the GTN 750 can display approach charts on the map or in the charts page. I always put them on the moving map.]
But also this is why ForeFlight is great. It has an iphone app that has plates also - in case you don't have an extra ipad.
I also carry an external battery that can actually charge an iPad while it is ON. Made by NewTrent. I use it en route to ensure that I have juice when I arrive at my destination after a 5-hr XC.
[In any case, the GTN 750 can display approach charts on the map or in the charts page. I always put them on the moving map.]
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
And IIRC, a single subscription to ForeFlight is good for TWO iPads plus an iPhone - No extra cost for the backup devices!
comanchepilot
En-Route
Yes, I have a 530.
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Yes, I have a good AP.
Yes I have a ipad mini and foreflight and stratus and use them often.
Yes I also write down the pertinent data in an approach block on my kneepad
Yes - I still replace the charts with paper once a year and on EVERY approach in actual the paper chart is also open . . .
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Yes, I have a good AP.
Yes I have a ipad mini and foreflight and stratus and use them often.
Yes I also write down the pertinent data in an approach block on my kneepad
Yes - I still replace the charts with paper once a year and on EVERY approach in actual the paper chart is also open . . .
Turningfinal
Pre-takeoff checklist
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Turningfinal
Just an iPad and iPhone here.
If an iPad with no paper charts is good enough in the FAA's eyes for Part 121 operations (AA, etc.) it's good enough for me.
If an iPad with no paper charts is good enough in the FAA's eyes for Part 121 operations (AA, etc.) it's good enough for me.
ChrisK
En-Route
Do you reference the paper chart?
Dead Stick
Line Up and Wait
That thinking is so 2010, but I'm sure Jeppesen appreciates the business.
That may or may not be a good backup. What if the problem is in the iOS version (shared by both units) or a bug in FF itself?And IIRC, a single subscription to ForeFlight is good for TWO iPads plus an iPhone - No extra cost for the backup devices!
Just something to consider.
chartbundle
Pattern Altitude
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chartbundle
This is why right now my primary is Garmin Pilot on the iPad, backup is Garmin Pilot on Android Tablet, backup to those if the device is working is charts(Orux Maps) and Plates(PDF) downloaded from my website to the Android tablet. And backup to that is the same charts and plates downloaded to my Android phone(from a different vendor, on a different OS than the tablet).
If I manage to lose all three of those, I probably got hit by an EMP and am going to go need to find somewhere VFR anyway since I won't have any NAV radios either.
What if your plates are mis filed or the fly out the window?
You can either print plates in advance, or do what I suggested about two pages ago and copy down the necessary details as part of your approach briefing: mins, missed approach procedure, step downs.
Turningfinal
Pre-takeoff checklist
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Turningfinal
Not very likely. The iPad was tested extensively in the cockpit for certification purposes.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
You don't always have to upgrade to the latest version - You could keep both iOS and ForeFlight a version behind on the backup device if you really wanted to.
airdale
Pattern Altitude
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airdale
Yes. You can always tell the guys in front -- the ones with arrows in their chests. The latest IOS fiasco illustrates.
Android 4.4.4 has been out for a couple of months now. I have found no compelling reason to upgrade, though I will probably do it at some point.
For the same reason, my devices are never set to permit automatic app upgrades. To permit this, IMO, is the cyberspace equivalent of wearing a "Kick Me" sign.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
Yeah, but you have to remember that there are enough people who NEVER update ANYTHING otherwise - And the John McCains of the world who complain about how hard it is - That your average non-techie is better off with automatic upgrades.
Er, non-techie non-pilot. Every pilot should have automatic upgrades turned off on every device, because your device does not know that you're on your takeoff roll when it starts to auto-upgrade your EFB, rendering it useless when you lose reliable data service a couple hundred feet AGL...
I'm not sure what promoted the comment about plates flying out the window.
The suggestion about writing down the essentials is ok for those who still use paper in the cockpit regularly. I don't.
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I think the entire thread is based on an OP where the, well, read the title.
My only point is, if one is concerned about the technology one are using crashing, the best backup might not be the exact same technology.
Btw, my rigorously tested Safari just crashed while writing a post. So far Apple's own Safari seems to be the only iOS 8 instability I've seen.
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Dr. O
Pattern Altitude
Being a dinosaur compared to you whipper snappers I suspect that you suspect that I might be against all this new fangled stuff and bellow "paper forever" as I totter across the ramp towards my Waco, leather helmet and goggles accented by my silk scarf blowing jauntily in the 35 knot gusts.
Actually, I love this new fangled stuff. And I have an Ipad with Foreflight running on it. And I have a battered Garmin 296 running on the co-pilot yoke. Belt and suspenders. This does the job nicely for hamburger runs, etc.
But I DO have a bound set of VFR and IFR charts under the seat (out of date cast offs of other pilots, mostly). So when going further than Burger Heaven I will look ahead and jot down a few VOR frequencies along my intended route and stick the 3x5 card on the edge of the glare shield to keep the VOR receiver tuned to the next vor ahead of my current position. I can switch to paper if there is an epidemic of blue screens of death.
I only print the approach plate for the intended destination and the alternate (if needed).
I assume that all else failing I can sweet talk ATC to give me an approach briefing for the nearest ILS.
BTW - and totally aside - I went to Best Buy this week to replace my ancient Ipad with the newest retina screen mini 4G with built in A-GPS. Their Ipad expert, lady, there gave me a heads up. Said they have to order all 4G minis shipped in now, Apple is not allowing them to be in the shelf. Says she has seen this before and it usually means there is a new model replacing the old model and they are clearing out the inventory. She suspects an announcement for Christmas time. Given that I elected to stick with my ancient Ipad (all of 4 years old) for now.
Actually, I love this new fangled stuff. And I have an Ipad with Foreflight running on it. And I have a battered Garmin 296 running on the co-pilot yoke. Belt and suspenders. This does the job nicely for hamburger runs, etc.
But I DO have a bound set of VFR and IFR charts under the seat (out of date cast offs of other pilots, mostly). So when going further than Burger Heaven I will look ahead and jot down a few VOR frequencies along my intended route and stick the 3x5 card on the edge of the glare shield to keep the VOR receiver tuned to the next vor ahead of my current position. I can switch to paper if there is an epidemic of blue screens of death.
I only print the approach plate for the intended destination and the alternate (if needed).
I assume that all else failing I can sweet talk ATC to give me an approach briefing for the nearest ILS.
BTW - and totally aside - I went to Best Buy this week to replace my ancient Ipad with the newest retina screen mini 4G with built in A-GPS. Their Ipad expert, lady, there gave me a heads up. Said they have to order all 4G minis shipped in now, Apple is not allowing them to be in the shelf. Says she has seen this before and it usually means there is a new model replacing the old model and they are clearing out the inventory. She suspects an announcement for Christmas time. Given that I elected to stick with my ancient Ipad (all of 4 years old) for now.
azure
Final Approach
I use an iPad and an iPhone, and this is part of the reason I keep the two devices at different iOS levels.
(The other part is that like all OSs, iOS gets bigger with each major release and my iPhone is only 16GB - I'm keeping it at iOS 6.)
gismo
Touchdown! Greaser!
So does that mean you carry a printer with you on most trips that have intermediate stops or unplanned excursions? If not how do you print the necessary approaches when your return trip must use a different fuel stop due to weather or schedules?
airdale
Pattern Altitude
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airdale
I read this as a very weak attempt at reductio ad absurdum but I'll answer your two questions anyway.
No.
I don't. Lots of options: Use my backup which is the toy computer, use expired plates from the local book that is in my flight bag, buy a book of plates, print plates on the FBO computer.
Are you suggesting that if I might not be able to print every plate I could need, then I shouldn't print any plates? That's kind of a silly argument.
Reduction ad absurdism is giving too much credit to what comes down to "you don't do it the way I do so it automatically makes no sense."
gismo
Touchdown! Greaser!
My point (albeit a weak one) is that printing the plates I thought I might need with the tablet as backup didn't cover all situations I've encountered. As a result I decided that a tablet backed up with a cellphone running the same app and I don't bother printing approaches any more. That doesn't mean printing can't work for you, I was just trying to provide examples of why it didn't work for me.
flyingcheesehead
Taxi to Parking
Yup... It's that time of year. The last two rounds of new iPads were released on 10/23/2012 and 10/22/2013. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that there's a high probability the next generation will be announced on 10/21/2014. But, the rumor sites are going to spew whatever they can about it until then.
Might have something to do with the Christmas shopping season.
couplescaddy
Filing Flight Plan
Have an original iPad mini with cached plates & my newer iPad Air with cached plates, a battery pack, iPad cable, and iPhone. Never considered I'd ever need anything more.