Rope break 100 feet glider

PaulS said:
Pretty sure, make sure you read my reasoning, however faulty it may be.
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I don't see a road within miles of where she was heading west.
 
I see some power lines and a loop of access road with what looks like a skinny irrigation canal running in the middle of it. Other than the power lines, I don't really see anything that would make me think I've got to get this thing stopped or that's going to hurt. Once you're on the ground, speed is going to drop below 30 pretty quickly. At that point, there isn't a lot you're going to hit and not be able to walk away from it.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
I see some power lines and a loop of access road with what looks like a skinny irrigation canal running in the middle of it. Other than the power lines, I don't really see anything that would make me think I've got to get this thing stopped or that's going to hurt. Once you're on the ground, speed is going to drop below 30 pretty quickly. At that point, there isn't a lot you're going to hit and not be able to walk away from it.
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I think you are also looking at the east side of the airport, she took off to the west.
 
Warner Springs Gliderport right? SR79 is on the North side of the runway running east/west and makes a turn to the north just beyond the end of the runway. Am I looking at the wrong place?
 
I see. I thought you meant a real road, not a dirt road. She'd have been down WAY before that.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
That looks like a dirt road in the scrub. Why would you think hitting that would hurt?
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You are kidding, right?

Might be nothing. Or it might have a drainage ditch or berm. Nothing to kill or injure you but the plane can easily lose it’s gear.

When I see a road, even a dirt road in the scrub, I assume power lines; they can hurt and can be very hard to see (look for poles). Fortunately out west they tend to follow roads unlike the valleys of a Vermont where they run straight along valleys and crisscross fields independent of roads and tracks.

Fences can and do kill. They are often associated with roads but this one looks like a no fence situation - the vegetation is the same on both sides.

Then there’s scrub and there’s scrub. This stuff looks pretty benign because of the tracks you can see in it and the actual video. No creosote bushes which are the next thing to concrete bollards.

I’m sure glider guiders of Warner Springs know exactly what’s landable out there (between the fence and the road) and what’s not (before the fence she called out). The ropes may break at anytime and it’s good to have a specific plan up to 200+’.

OTOH, western smooth looking scrub terrain can rip the stuffing out of a sailplane and hide stuff that can hurt you. All discontinuities are suspect and a working knowledge of the vegetation is useful for out landings. Of course glider out landings are slowly going out of style with GPS, engines and motors.


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Yeah, I'd avoid that road, unless I had walked it. Doesn't take much to ruin your day, especially in something like a glider, or an aircraft for that matter.
 
wrbix said:
Aw, c’mon......used to be “I’d hit that”....when did that become unacceptable?;)
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Dude, I'd hit that like a retarded kid on a drum set!

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Beggs said:
Dude, I'd hit that like a retarded kid on a drum set!

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I assume you were trying for max offensiveness.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
So you're saying I'm wrong...

... and yet you agree with me. :rolleyes:
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No, I’m gently suggesting you don’t have a clue but one might get away with being cluelesss.

Planning a landing that crosses a road like that is stupid, unless it has been previously assessed. There’s always luck however.

If I visually cleared it from power lines and signs, I might land on it, but never across it unless previously walked.

What were you saying?


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Bill Watson said:
What were you saying?
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I was saying if I was flying something that landed as slow as that does and I saw that road ahead of me during the roll out as I was already slowing down, I probably wouldn't crap my pants over it.
 
Beggs said:
Dude, I'd hit that like a retarded kid on a drum set!

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You mean with absolutely no sense of timing and a lack of gentle motor skills?... I can see why she'd be interested.

I gotta admit... I laughed. Sometimes totally tasteless wrong things are funny when they're meant to be funny. I gather you meant to be funny. Sure hope so.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
I was saying if I was flying something that landed as slow as that does and I saw that road ahead of me during the roll out as I was already slowing down, I probably wouldn't crap my pants over it.
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Well, you’re right. I wouldn’t either.

I have knocked 2 gears out. Problem is the single wheel on most gliders is fixed to the frame with no shock absorption. And it’s only inches below your butt instead of feet. The physics is such that you hope you’ll be able to crap again soon.


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Bill Watson said:
Well, you’re right. I wouldn’t either.

I have knocked 2 gears out. Problem is the single wheel on most gliders is fixed to the frame with no shock absorption. And it’s only inches below your butt instead of feet. The physics is such that you hope you’ll be able to crap again soon.


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I think unless you've considered it, you probably don't realize how even a 6 inch berm on a dirt road, kicked up from a few years of use, could really mess up an airplane hitting it at even 40 mph. It's stuff we should consider as pilots. Another is some who think landing in trees will some how cushion your impact as you break off limbs and the wings using up all your excess energy until you gently stop. The reality is most trees, at least around here, are at least twice the size of a telephone pole and will obliterate a small plane if you have direct hit. Some times perception leads you astray of reality.
 
Bill Watson said:
Okay Brian CFIIG, you are right and I would guess a good instructor.

At the training and local flying stage of the sport, ‘follow the plan’ is a good way to view one’s flights and the various things that might happen on a flight. Which, if everything is done correctly by the pilot, is limited to tow rope breaks above and below 200’; just ‘follow the plan’.

I’d like to give her an extra point for following the plan to the letter; i.e. she appears to have even pulled the release right after the break in order to clear the rope since she has no idea where the break occurred or even if she had been released by the tow pilot. Anyone else catch that? She’s a YouTube star just because it looked so damn good on video. Just flawless

But, I would submit that there isn’t necessarily a plan for when the truly unexpected happens; like a bird strike, or a middair, or a stuck ballast valve, or a broken wheel brake cable or an a-hole tow pilot/airport manager who decided to spread some toxic masculinity around by trying to scare the only flying female on the airport out of the sport by signaling her to release at hundreds of feet over unlandable territory for no explicable reason (yeah, I watched it and knew her).

Sorry, I digressed a bit, but just wanted to make the point that there isn’t always a ‘plan’ for real world things happening in soaring or flying. It’s just too dynamic. But ‘following the plan’ is the way to start for sure.


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Thanks Bill, and very true stuff does happen where you have to improvise. But then that is were watching Videos like this and reading accident reports are a good thing. Even speculating what might have happened gets us thinking about all the scenario's that might happen to us.
The fact that you list some "unexpected things" means you have at least thought about them. Maybe even practiced some scenarios to remove as many unknowns from these kinds of situations as possible. I lake the phrase "Make my emergency a normal as possible", meaning if possible stick to what you know and add as few unknowns as possible.

Things I have learned from reading about or talking to pilots that have experienced these things, and maybe a few others...

Goose through the windshield of a C-150. Lesson C-150's have a lot more drag when the windshield is gone, and it may negatively impact the stall Characteristics. I recalled this when I had the Skylight on a Bellanca Scout blow out and made a faster a approach than normal as a result.

Midair flying back to the airport with 10 feet of wing missing. Lessons, I could be done, was it smart, since he had a parachute? I don't know, but something to consider if I find myself in a similar situation.

Bailout after loosing rudder control. Lesson> Getting out the airplane/Glider can be difficult when it is out of control. Bailing out isn't as

Broken Canopy and compromised controls after Lightning strike. Lesson, maybe I should stay a bit further away from that thunderstorm. Again Lots of Drag from Canopy Gone.

Canopy Lost on Take off. Lots of wind in the cockpit, everything (Glasses?) will blow out of the cockpit.

Flying with a Disconnected control (Aileron), Flaps can make things worse (or Better), Adjust with care, unless what you are doing isn't working. some glider manufactures even have a recommended procedure for this (Negative flaps?), Would an imbalanced wing (Stuck Ballast Valve) be similar?

Broken Wheel Brake Cable, I actually got my glider rating (a long time ago) in a Blanik that was waiting for parts from the Factory for the Brake, Brake was inoperative. Got good at using Dive Brakes. Also stopped taxing off the runway with another Blanik after the Brake handle broke on me.

Signal to release in unsafe area, (Good Story to share, Thank you) Lesson, is you are the pilot in command. Another long time ago story was that examiner that would give the applicant a series of tasks to do during the flight from a specific altitude. He designed it so it was impossible to complete the tasks and get back to the airport at a safe altitude. He did emphasize that the applicant was the pilot in command and responsible for the Safety of the flight. If the applicant did not exercise the PIC responsibility to complete the flight safely over completing the designated tasks they would fail the Checkride, Which of course was the examiners point. (this was a long time ago, Examiners probably could not get away with that no)

Stall spin after low pass, Lesson> Inexperienced pilots are watching the experienced pilots. I am sure the experienced pilots that did the low passes the day before had fun doing it and felt terrible the next day when they watched the new pilot spin in trying to copy them. Inexperienced pilots Lesson, just because you saw some else do it doesn't mean you can or even should. There is probably someone even less experienced watching you.

Thanks Again Bill, you make a good point as well. An my points above is simply be a prepared as you can be.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
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