Red Tails

I saw it on opening night. Late show, theater was about 1/3 full.

I'm normally one to suspend reality and enjoy just about any movie. Unfortunately, I was stil really disappointed in this one. My complaints fit in two major categories:

1) Ridiculously inaccurate airplane footage. Every bomber that gets shot has its wing spar fail near the #2 engine, which is also on fire... I think they copied the same animation several times. Also, the landings were AWFUL - They looked like RC models, only worse (RC models still have to obey the laws of physics). I didn't see a single landing in the movie that looked anything remotely close to realistic.

2) WAY too formulaic. You had your obligatory love story (which felt forced), plus the included one-of-the-couple-gets-killed bonus... And you had some very contrived "here's some adversity" and then "here we're overcoming adversity" moments.

It also didn't feel like any passage of time was apparent. It felt like in one week the TA went from not being allowed near the enemy to a single beach-landing-cover mission that completely changed their fortunes in one fell swoop, and next thing you know they're escorting bombers to Berlin in brand-new P-51's.

With Lucas' resources and today's technology, this should have been a MUCH better movie.
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

roncachamp said:
You don't see a difference? You believe a person that says he can't think of something is declaring that that something does not exist?
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You claimed there were no other movies with accuracy and impact. I provided several examples. You choose to dismiss them for not meeting your ever-narrowing criteria.

I suppose my command of English is not up to the challenge of parsing this sentence:
roncachamp said:
I can think of movies with far more accuracy, and I can think of movies with more impact, but I cannot think of any movie with far more accuracy and impact.
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Perhaps we can find a team of forensic grammarians willing to have a go?
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

dmccormack said:
You claimed there were no other movies with accuracy and impact.
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No I didn't. Saying that I cannot think of any is not saying that none exist.

I provided several examples.
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No you didn't, as I have explained.

I suppose my command of English is not up to the challenge of parsing this sentence:
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You have so demonstrated.

Perhaps we can find a team of forensic grammarians willing to have a go?
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I do not believe it can be simplified any further.
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

roncachamp said:
No I didn't. Saying that I cannot think of any is not saying that none exist.
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There are several movies with more accuracy and impact than Red Tails.

Fail Safe
Battleground
The Big Red One
Platoon
Pork Chop Hill
The Hurt Locker
They were Expendable
Paths of Glory
Tora, Tora, Tora
Full Metal Jacket
Courage Under Fire
All Quiet on the Western Front
Twelve O'Clock High
Sergeant York
Glory
The Deer Hunter
Apocalypse Now
Born on the Fourth of July
Schindler's List
The Longest Day
Saving Private Ryan
The Bridge Over the River Kwai
Patton
The Great Escape
Gallipoli
The Red Badge of Courage

Heck, even Gettysburg was true to the movements of the units and dates and commanders...
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

dmccormack said:
Red Tails accuracy = negligible
Red Tails "impact" = what, precisely? emotional? societal? economic?
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Perhaps you can explain these glaring inaccuracies, and how it compares so badly to all these other movies. I think you loose sight of the fact that movies are about telling dramatic stories, and often invent or change to make things to make the story more acceptable. I think you also loose sight of that fact that stories about pilots have a very different tempo than those involving other aspects of military endeavor.

I wouldn't claim that Red Tails is any kind of masterpiece, but I don't think it deserves the kind of disapprobation it's receiving here.
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

dmccormack said:
Red Tails accuracy = negligible
Red Tails "impact" = what, precisely? emotional? societal? economic?
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"Impact"? To make George Lucas feel good for promoting the past plight of minorities, which is a travesty to their honor and memory as individuals.
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

steingar said:
Perhaps you can explain these glaring inaccuracies, and how it compares so badly to all these other movies. I think you loose sight of the fact that movies are about telling dramatic stories, and often invent or change to make things to make the story more acceptable. I think you also loose sight of that fact that stories about pilots have a very different tempo than those involving other aspects of military endeavor.

I wouldn't claim that Red Tails is any kind of masterpiece, but I don't think it deserves the kind of disapprobation it's receiving here.
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I did a review. I'm not going to paste it here.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
1) Ridiculously inaccurate airplane footage.

2) WAY too formulaic.
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Definitely true. But I think it was intended to be that way.

Lucas said Redtails is a "popcorn movie", and that popcorn movies must have corn. And you've identified some of the corn.
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

dmccormack said:
I did a review. I'm not going to paste it here.
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I wouldn't either. Looked like it was written ahead of time , such as a newspaper late edition headline. Just the "spaces" were filled in, after actually viewing Red Tails. Full of cartoons and silly pics, that had nothing to do with the actual movie. These illustrations were only used to make the author's points, whether it had anything to do with the actual movie or not. Nothing redeeming about this review, unless you're into the "Simpson's" type of comedy. I'm not.

However, reviewer did get some brownie points for this wasted effort (IMO of course). Numerous "followers" stated that they wouldn't bother to see this film, solely based on this review. Two points for the author....

L.Adamson
 
Re: Red Tails movie 01/12

L.Adamson said:
I wouldn't either. Looked like it was written ahead of time , such as a newspaper late edition headline. Just the "spaces" were filled in, after actually viewing Red Tails. Full of cartoons and silly pics, that had nothing to do with the actual movie. These illustrations were only used to make the author's points, whether it had anything to do with the actual movie or not. Nothing redeeming about this review, unless you're into the "Simpson's" type of comedy. I'm not.

However, reviewer did get some brownie points for this wasted effort (IMO of course). Numerous "followers" stated that they wouldn't bother to see this film, solely based on this review. Two points for the author....

L.Adamson
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Where's your review?
 
CAF RedTail Squadron will be doing a webinar Wednesday 2/1 on Red Tails the movie.

http://tinyurl.com/RedTailWebinar

Join us in talking to two real Tuskegee Airmen from WWII. Moderator Stan Ross will introduce Col. Charles McGee and Lt. Col. Harold Brown who tell their own story in relation to the new 'Red Tails' movie. They share the good, the bad, and the ugly about being an African American pilot in the military during the war, and the tools they used to 'Rise Above' and overcome adversities.

Find out first hand what aspects of the movie held true to real life, and what aspects were Hollywood dramatizations.

Then ask questions yourself about their experiences and take away a true piece of history from some of the few remaining Tuskegee Airmen living today.

On behalf of the CAF Red Tail Squadron, we hope you enjoy the experience. If you'd like to support the work of the CAF Red Tail Squadron, please visit us at: http://tinyurl.com/GiveToRedTail
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I'm about a minute into the movie right now. I didn't realize that it would be nothing but terrible computer graphics. I wasn't prepared to watch a cartoon-like show. I thought it would be more like Memphis Belle.
 
Gerhardt said:
I'm about a minute into the movie right now. I didn't realize that it would be nothing but terrible computer graphics. I wasn't prepared to watch a cartoon-like show. I thought it would be more like Memphis Belle.
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The trailers had airplanes doing maneuvers that defied physics... I didn't even bother...:nonod:
 
FlySince9 said:
The trailers had airplanes doing maneuvers that defied physics... I didn't even bother...:nonod:
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I won't watch it either. That stuff just makes me nuts, especially if it is through out the entire movie.

In "The Aviator" which I liked, the one scene had WWI era airplanes taking off and almost climbing straight up. It looked like a four year old had done the CG. Actually, I know some four year olds that could do better.

Why these "experts" can't get it more correct is beyond me. Maybe they need a few more, ahem, "real men" in the movie production mix out there.

:wink2::D
 
I'll probably end up watching it eventually, but I'm in no big rush. I've heard that the movie did not do justice to the honor that these men deserve.

That said, my two grandkids are black, have recently flown for the first time, and (after watching it myself first) this movie may help inspire them. We'll see.
 
I was disappointed as well. Has anyone seen act of valor? The crappy acting is excusable because the actors are all ex-mil and the rest of the movie was bad ass. And there is very little computer generated stuff compared to Lucas films...
 
Its on HBO this month. Im DVRing it although i saw it in theater
 
flyingcheesehead said:
You're going to willingly watch it again? :dunno:
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I saw opening night last year. Totally dissapointed. Bad acting, bad story line, and way too much CGI. I gave it a C-. Just seems like no one makes aviation movies with enough real aircraft anymore. Spend some money, get a few B-17s, P-51s, Me-109s, even a ME-262 and show some real flying. Gone are the days of Memphis Belle, Battle of Britain, The Blue Max and dare I say Top Gun. I guess people these days don't mind watching a computer game for a movie but I do.

Anyone who wants to see a good movie on the Tuskegee Airmen just rent the HBO version. I have it on Bluray and it is way better than Red Tails.
 
I watched it ..tried to anyways on video this summer....turned it off after half-an hour....terrible dialogue,terrible acting and the cg was terrible....really cheap amateur crap.
 
genetk44 said:
I watched it ..tried to anyways on video this summer....turned it off after half-an hour....terrible dialogue,terrible acting and the cg was terrible....really cheap amateur crap.
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I agree...a total waste of time...:mad:

The brave pilots of the Red Tail squadron deserved a much better tribute to their memory...

Like this movie for example:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0244479/

large_detail.asp
 
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Any movie that at least has a real functioning P-51, in addition to CGI, is at least worth watching................unless of course you just think a Cessna 172 is the greatest piece of machinery to maneuver above the earth.:wink2:

In the meantime, I have a video library stocked with all of the old "real" planes, but it doesn't mean I'll totally skip out on BluRays such as Red Tails & Flyboys. Yes, I saw them at the theater too.
 
Gone are the days of Memphis Belle, Battle of Britain, The Blue Max and dare I say Top Gun
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Top Gun? If it's top gun or worse, I refuse to waste my time watching it.

L.Adamson said:
unless of course you just think a Cessna 172 is the greatest piece of machinery to maneuver above the earth.
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Compared to the cgi fakery that's overdone by people who don't know how airplanes are supposed to move, a 172 is the greatest airplane above this planet.
 
fgcason said:
Top Gun? If it's top gun or worse, I refuse to waste my time watching it.



Compared to the cgi fakery that's overdone by people who don't know how airplanes are supposed to move, a 172 is the greatest airplane above this planet.
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I'm not referring to the storyline, I'm talking about the flying scenes. Have you ever watched the behind the scenes on how they filmed it? They went through incredible effort to show the viewer what flying a fighter is about. Although unrealistic, it has some of the best jet flying scenes ever on film. Not this CGI crap that's everywhere.

Another good movie is is the Final Countdown. Once again a lot of effort was made in creating the flying scenes. The storyline was brilliant as well. Now the acting? Ugh!
 
fgcason said:
Top Gun? If it's top gun or worse, I refuse to waste my time watching it.
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I would say it's very much like Top Gun. Probably more popular with the young crowd (who it was made for) than people interested in history.
 
I was very disappointed with this film. The original film was much more believable and although the CGI was nice, it was a bit unreal. Especially the scenes where every B17 managed to break its wing in the same spot.

They really had a chance to redo the original to a much higher level.
 
George Lucas has the reputation of being a bit of a control freak. I read somewhere that the CG for most of his movies is subpar because it's all done in house.

I agreed with another criticism I read that the movie was a bit "Capra-esque", but it didn't bug me. What did bug me were the two poor performances of Cuba Gooding Jr. and Terrance Howard, two Oscar nominees whose sole purpose in the movie was to bring star power. The writing was weak and their characters were one dimensional. The one performance I did enjoy was David Oyelowo as Lightning, not because the character was particularly complex, but because he exemplified what I want to believe about the Redtails and their moxie.
 
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