Raptor Aircraft

WDD said:
Even the Spruce Goose flew. For a few seconds. Was an interesting idea that didn't work. Just like......
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The Spruce Goose flew for about 1 mile at 70' (looks like less because of the sheer size). For many years I assumed that eight 4360s weren't enough power and that is why it didn't climb.
Not quite two years ago my son and I went to visit the plane and got a full tour, including sitting in the pilot seats. Turns out the real limitation that day was that the hydraulic boosted controls got hydraulic pressure from (wait for it) the engines. And when you reduced power you lost boost and couldn't do much other than enjoy the view (and crap yourself). Getting it back on the water surface under control was probably quite exciting.

After that flight the throttles were labeled H and E for which engines provided Hydraulic pressure and which ones provided Electrical power (I think engine #1 doesn't have either).

Additionally, there was a giant AC electrically driven hydraulic pump installed in the nose of the plane under the flight deck to provide constant hydraulic power, and a continually manned station behind that pump where a dude sat to monitor electrical power to that boost pump. He sat behind a big fuse box and was to replace anything that blew, with a big johnson bar to temporarily cut current to make the fuse swaps.

Would it have been enough to allow safe flight? Probably. Oh and the math says those 4360s were more than enough power. I only sat on the FO side and let me kid sit in Howard's seat but the view from up there is incredible.
 
iamtheari said:
He mentioned that the "ambient temp" field is the intake air temperature.
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I don’t think his cooling and intake air are ducted and separated. He’s not exhausting all the hot air and it is recirculating and mixing with his intake and cooling air. Basically a heat adding feedback loop.
 
The oscillations are wild... and you can see the stick vibrating and he is fighting to keep it controlled... super unstable... Hardly climbing at 100 knots so probably under powered. Winds were calm, conditions were great.... yikes.
 
Each excuse and possible fix is worse than the last. Have to walk away before you can't.
 
Tantalum said:
"I didn't totally correctly shut my door, but can't be perfect on everything" - this guy gets worse with each video
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I forgot to even mention the door problem. He said not to worry because he was using a checklist. While the checklist did not apparently mention latching the door, it's fun to imagine the after takeoff climb checklist: "108 knots ground speed, rotate. Negative rate, reduce power for climb."
 
Salty said:
There never seems to be anybody waiting back at the hangar, or watching. He seems to be completely in a vacuum other than random fans on the internet.
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The wasabi guys stated it's a one man band at this point.
 
Salty said:
If it were me, I'd have telemetry to the ground with someone watching everything in parallel with me and scrubbing the flight as soon as anything looks odd. We have the technology do to such things. :rolleyes:

I would have at least one person outside myself making go / no go calls for such a flight. Probably a team of people I trust.
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While probably not a formal arrangement, I suspect the Valdosta Tower Controller had "the red phone" in their right hand during that little sojourn, ready to summon forth "the equipment" :D
 
Racerx said:
The wasabi guys stated it's a one man band at this point.
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Actually, the Wasabi last statement was they were willing to return after the plane was moved. The stated in their video that they had addressed all of their other "must have" issues. PM chose not to bring them back. Though after this flight, there would most likely be another long list of must haves before someone test flew it again (other than PM).
 
Anybody else feel sick just watching that video? He's really lucky everything came out fine and that he flew on a calm day. Each flight is a ticking time bomb. Add 10 kts of wind and I think we all know how this will end.
 
He took off with the door not completely latched?

I'm guessing he hasn't though about the implications of that door opening in flight.
 
donjohnston said:
He took off with the door not completely latched?

I'm guessing he hasn't though about the implications of that door opening in flight.
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He did not realize the door was open until after the flight and seeing the video footage ... not very thorough pre-flight.
 
Volzalum said:
Actually, the Wasabi last statement was they were willing to return after the plane was moved. The stated in their video that they had addressed all of their other "must have" issues. PM chose not to bring them back. Though after this flight, there would most likely be another long list of must haves before someone test flew it again (other than PM).
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Was actually talking about when they first showed up how it's usually a team of people working on something and in this case it's just Peter and they went on to talk about personality traits someone in his position usually has and how it's a delicate situation.
 
You should unlatch the door before crashing, to prevent door jamming shut. He just did not want to tell us that.

Did any of you notice the flutter of the opposite wing tip at 5:07 to 5:17 minutes? Right wing camera on top, looking across to the other side. Wing tip seemed to do a rotational flutter. He cut the segment to a different view, and time, after the problem went away. No top of wing video in any of the rest of the flights. I would have cut that sooner, but wonder if it got even worse, and he just cut the most violent portion.

Until then, the gyrations could have been just a nervous pilot in a very responsive plane.
 
What is with him keeping the air scoop closed?? Um, kinda asking for, maybe, some..... I don’t know.......overheating maybe??o_O
 
schmookeeg said:
While probably not a formal arrangement, I suspect the Valdosta Tower Controller had "the red phone" in their right hand during that little sojourn, ready to summon forth "the equipment" :D
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They rolled an ARFF truck out of the station to stand by during his flight.
 
Volzalum said:
He did not realize the door was open until after the flight and seeing the video footage ... not very thorough pre-flight.
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Door opening on an aircraft with a pusher engine AND a gull wing door hinge will absolutely ruin your day. It's enough of an issue that every Velocity has microswitches in the latch to indicate if the door is not completely latched.
 
geezer said:
Did any of you notice the flutter of the opposite wing tip at 5:07 to 5:17 minutes? Right wing camera on top, looking across to the other side. Wing tip seemed to do a rotational flutter.
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I *think* that may be a "jello" artifact that action cameras like the Gopro experience in certain circumstances. I don't think it was flutter.
 
Kudos to him for a successful milestone flight.

Just curious...

In a “normal” aircraft, you can reduce longitudinal instability by moving the cg forward a bit.

Would this work the same way in a canard? I’m having trouble visualizing it.
 
FastEddieB said:
In a “normal” aircraft, you can reduce longitudinal instability by moving the cg forward a bit.

Would this work the same way in a canard? I’m having trouble visualizing it.
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Yes, the principle is the same, the scale is just a little different.

Nauga,
neutrally pointed
 
FastEddieB said:
In a “normal” aircraft, you can reduce longitudinal instability by moving the cg forward a bit.

Would this work the same way in a canard? I’m having trouble visualizing it.
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Works just the same - canard or conventional planform.
 
Watching that thing wobble its way around the pattern with the engine sweating its balls off and the airspeed barely over 100 knots while it eeks out a meager climb with a substantial nose up attitude makes me appreciate the engineers at Piper, Beech, etc. who were cranking out planes several times as 'competent' as this nearly 70 years ago
 
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Tantalum said:
Watching that thing wobble it's way around the pattern with the engine sweating its balls off and the airspeed barely over 100 knots while it eeks out a meager climb with a substantial nose up attitude makes me appreciate the engineers at Piper, Beech, etc. who were cranking out planes several times as 'competent' as this nearly 70 years ago
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Say it with me... Cessssss-naaaaaa ;)
 
FastEddieB said:
Kudos to him for a successful milestone flight.

Just curious...

In a “normal” aircraft, you can reduce longitudinal instability by moving the cg forward a bit.

Would this work the same way in a canard? I’m having trouble visualizing it.
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The point of moving the CG forward is to get it further from the center of pressure, to give the positively stable forces of flight a larger moment-arm to act on the aircraft to keep it pointing straight and travelling forward like an arrow. To my knowledge it shouldn't really matter where your elevator/wing/canard is with relation to CG/CoP except for how it affects those two.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
Say it with me... Cessssss-naaaaaa ;)
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hahaha, I appreciate that my abhorrence to the 172 is so well known on this forum. But, to be fair.. maybe I'll be less likely to take it's **extremely** forgiving handling for granted next time I'm loping around the pattern with someone in a 1971 beater. I'll think of THE RAPTOR next time the air vent falls in my lap during run up or I want into the wing.. "cool diamond tattoo man!"
 
Sidebar.. the 190/195 continue to tickle a very special steampunk fantasy of mine. It's the proper plane. And the straight tailed high wings look bad ass. I'm more upset that they basically gave up and started vomiting out crap 172s to the flight schools... "here Jimmy, yes, it's perfectly normal to sump 13 fuel drain. Don't worry about Mike over there in the Archer with just 3 to worry about.. also, yes, that 180 conversion will pee all over your shoe when your purge the gascolater. Just hope you spilled enough on the floor that all the water is gone and no one from the EPA saw you pour two cups of leaded gas everywhere. Total trash.
 
How does he mount his cameras? I like that they aren't completely fixed to the airframe.
 
woodchucker said:
As a former drunken sailor I take resembelences to that <hic> comment.
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Formerly a sailor but still drunk, or formerly drunk and sailing sober until you find another fifth?
 
Dave Theisen said:
The only thing missing was footage of one of the tower controllers paying off his bet to the other controller because he didn’t crash.
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The pool isn't based on IF he's going to crash. It's based on WHEN the Raptor is going to crash...
 
Tantalum said:
"I didn't totally correctly shut my door, but can't be perfect on everything" - this guy gets worse with each video
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Did you notice how nervous he was? He seemed to shake a little and watch his chest for the heavy breathing.

A test pilot should have an ultra rigorous checklist.
 
NordicDave said:
A test pilot should have an ultra rigorous checklist.
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It's total bulls##t what he's doing. This is why you have someone like the Wasabi guys go through everything methodically, in order to have as successful as possible of a first flight. Other than crashing, that first flight was basically a failure. Skyrocketing engine temps and an aircraft that had serious performance issues

The builder's "day job" is in computer science, right? He's a coder? Did I make that up? I feel like he's one of those people that will write something, believe it to be the best thing on earth, and not test any of it in a QA environment. Eventually, on deployment, when production crashes he'll blame everything but himself
 
NordicDave said:
A test pilot should have an ultra rigorous checklist.
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I don't know what you are talking about? Didn't you see the Post-It note on the dash?

Yeah, he was damn lucky to get it down in one piece. I kept watching those trees getting closer and closer on takeoff. That wobbly low level turn.

Just the fact he had to rush to the runway to get airborne before the engine could warm up. That alone shows the system is not ready for flight, it should at the very least be able to stabilize at idle on a long run without over heating. I could see it not being able to do continuous full power not moving without overheating, but a normal taxi and takeoff should not make you worried about it.

I couldn't tell when watching, did he have a parachute? Not that he was ever high enough to use it. I doubt he ever would bail out anyway, he'd never want to admit his pride and joy failed.
 
midwestpa24 said:
Just the fact he had to rush to the runway to get airborne before the engine could warm up
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I know, right?! he's scared to let it idle on the ground but thinks it will perform fine at 100% power. This plane is a LOONG way away from being a viable machine. Can you imagine you buy this as a kit, build it, and the first time you have to wait 15 minutes for an IFR release while it's 95* out your engine overheats. Crazy.
 
Llk said:
This thread delivers :)

For all the naysayers that didn’t expect he would take off and stay in ground effect...he got past that.

Then, people didn’t expect him to fly...and apparently the plane goes up and down.

Then, for the plane to fly and the pilot to live? I guess he made it past that.

He may not be an amiable chap, and the plane’s design may be wanting for more, his logic may be flawed, the plane may never be commercially viable, but Peter has effectively made himself a protagonist in his own “astronaut farmer” movie, even with less lofty goals.

I do like to root for the underdog while he knows full well he may end up as a burning hole on the ground.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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the flat earth guy that built his own rocket didn’t die the first time he flew either...
 
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