O-540 Overhaul Cost?

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SepticTank

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SepticTank
Anybody recently price out an overhaul for an O-540 or similar? A couple of years ago you could get them done in the high $20k-low $30k range. I recently heard someone say they're now high 40s to low 50s. Absurd!! This might be what will finally kills GA.
 
SepticTank said:
Anybody recently price out an overhaul for an O-540 or similar? A couple of years ago you could get them done in the high $20k-low $30k range. I recently heard someone say they're now high 40s to low 50s. Absurd!! This might be what will finally kills GA.
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A couple of years ago I couldn't get an O-360 done for high 20k low 30k, let alone an O-540
 
Everything, forever, has been the thing that will kill GA. The end of 80/87, transponders, Mode C, tailwheel/complex/high performance endorsements, ACS, ADS-B, costs. Probably back in the nineteen-teens pilots swore that requiring training and certification was going to kill GA.
 
ateamer said:
Everything, forever, has been the thing that will kill GA. The end of 80/87, transponders, Mode C, tailwheel/complex/high performance endorsements, ACS, ADS-B, costs. Probably back in the nineteen-teens pilots swore that requiring training and certification was going to kill GA.
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To be fair, it's likely a gradual atrophy vs an immediate death. I am in a pretty high earning household and am one of the healthiest people I know. But still the financial barrier to entry along with crazy FAA medical requirements are making things a bit more difficult than I think they could be.
 
Does anybody know how much a factory new or overhaul is?
 
I got a quote this spring for 56k for a lyco factory overhaul on an io540. I assume the 260hp version would be a bit less but not a lot.

Oh and lead time was 9 months...
 
Jim K said:
I got a quote this spring for 56k for a lyco factory overhaul on an io540. I assume the 260hp version would be a bit less but not a lot.

Oh and lead time was 9 months...
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must only have one guy in a corner rebuilding them w/a 9 month lead time
 
Mxfarm said:
must only have one guy in a corner rebuilding them w/a 9 month lead time
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With so many variants and no new planes being built with an io540...I've heard they build them in batches and it might be a while before they get to what you need.

Now, if you need one for your rv10, different story.
 
Jewel Aviation in Missouri claims on their price list that they can do it for high $20ks. Having said that, I think I recall a complaint about them on POA somewhere so due diligence is advised.
 
Field overhaul will likely be your only price point alternative, reusing existing cylinders and iran engine accessories to the max extent possible.

Youre not alone OP. Im not incurring that kind of cost to hull value ratio expenseneither if i have to repair the engine of my low hull arrow, and cant do it below a 70pct of insured value basis (total trigger if i were to wrap it around a tree). Ill just gut the 430w, salvage the carcass, and go EAB early (im done with fac built retracts once i salvage or sell the arrow). Theres no one size fits all answer, but 2022 engine overhaul pricing has in fact jumped the shark for many of us in the lower hull price points.
 
Our club recently did a very candid open-spreadsheets review of what the owner's costs were in maintaining their planes. A g1 SR22 NA had it's io550 overhauled, the all in costs once said and done was $97K, he had the sales receipt up on the slide with the itemizations. I believe the engine itself was in the $55K range. Owners I've talked to with bigger 500 series engines all report an all in expected cost in the $50K to $80K range

Expensive powerplants aren't a unique-to-GA thing.. if any of you have priced out what a large 200-300+ hp marine outboard costs it's not dissimilar of what GA sees. In many cases you're buying two of those

Engines ain't cheap!

The allure of the "car engine crate motor" is strong thanks to the low costs, but so far no one has been able to effectively make it work. Except for maybe the corvair guys. But I don't know of too many Chevy LS experimentals cruising around with equivalent TBO times. I'd love to see it though!
 
Tantalum said:
The allure of the "car engine crate motor" is strong thanks to the low costs, but so far no one has been able to effectively make it work. Except for maybe the corvair guys. But I don't know of too many Chevy LS experimentals cruising around with equivalent TBO times. I'd love to see it though!
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Guy had an LS in his rv 10. I believe it ended in flames, but nothing to do with the engine itself. Going LS is heavier with all the liquid cooling, plus the weight of the gearbox, and would probably have to go with a composite electric prop. Significant obstacles.
 
Good God!
If I have to overhaul my engine, I am selling the plane and taking up a different hobby.
 
Racerx said:
Significant obstacles
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Indeed, once you start piecing it together you realize those big gains you saw in your head slowly diminish. The costs add up too there as well... no free lunch!
 
Tantalum said:
Our club recently did a very candid open-spreadsheets review of what the owner's costs were in maintaining their planes. A g1 SR22 NA had it's io550 overhauled, the all in costs once said and done was $97K, he had the sales receipt up on the slide with the itemizations. I believe the engine itself was in the $55K range. Owners I've talked to with bigger 500 series engines all report an all in expected cost in the $50K to $80K range
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Guessing it was a factory reman?

The added $42K cost will either have been some serious catch-up maintenance, upgrades, or man I can't even guess. But that's a bit much. I'd expect +10K for engine R&R and other necessaries. A "while we're here" prop overhaul might be another 5k. I'm at a loss otherwise.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Good God!
If I have to overhaul my engine, I am selling the plane and taking up a different hobby.
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Every hour you fly you're paying the pro-rata hourly cost of an engine overhaul, whether you're building reserves or not. You'll either pay when you have the engine overhauled or you'll pay in the form of a lower selling price.
 
schmookeeg said:
Guessing it was a factory reman?

The added $42K cost will either have been some serious catch-up maintenance, upgrades, or man I can't even guess. But that's a bit much. I'd expect +10K for engine R&R and other necessaries. A "while we're here" prop overhaul might be another 5k. I'm at a loss otherwise.
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I obviously don't have any insights specific to this specific instance but I'd guess that I could easily come up with plenty of firewall forward consumables that are engine install related and would make up the difference, assuming that labor is also included in the $42k.
 
mondtster said:
I obviously don't have any insights specific to this specific instance but I'd guess that I could easily come up with plenty of firewall forward consumables that are engine install related and would make up the difference, assuming that labor is also included in the $42k.
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Sure.

New Engine Analyzer

Addition of a second airframe parachute

4-color painted firewall mural of this guy:

upload_2022-11-2_15-1-47.png

...

I should reword my remarks to "I can't think of anything necessary or typical with an engine overhaul that would tot up to 42K" :D
 
schmookeeg said:
I should reword my remarks to "I can't think of anything necessary or typical with an engine overhaul that would tot up to 42K" :D
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Actually repairing or replacing baffling (not just the rubber) will add up quickly. I can't believe the amount of new engines I've seen installed with garbage baffling.
Engine mount should be inspected/overhauled.
Exhaust likely needs work.
Lord mounts.
Engine hoses.
Accessory overhaul/repair that may not be included with the engine.
Prop/governor overhaul.
Etc...

It all adds up quickly.
 
…and what does it take to overhaul a PT6….? Are lead times as insane on the turbine side as they are on the piston side?
 
I am getting an overhaul on my AEIO-360 right now, so the experience is fresh.

I got quotes from 20K to 35K depending on field vs new limits, new vs rebuilt cylinders, shop reputation, etc. You pay about 10% extra for brand name. Wound up agreeing on 30K for new limits and cylinders from a reputable local shop. Will probably renegotiate next week for rebuild cylinders since new ones are now made of unobtanium.

However, keep in mind that is JUST the cost of the engine work. You still have to factor the cost of labor to pull and hang the engine and prop. Figure at least 2 days on either end, so that's roughly $3K labor. Plus a new engine generally warrants new or overhauled hoses (2K), oil cooler (1K), prop governor (1K), boost fuel pump (1K), baffle work, etc. Oh yeah, and sales tax (2K).

All told, my 30K engine is going to wind up costing me at least 40K. I laughed when my A&P first said that. He was right.
 
ateamer said:
Everything, forever, has been the thing that will kill GA. The end of 80/87, transponders, Mode C, tailwheel/complex/high performance endorsements, ACS, ADS-B, costs. Probably back in the nineteen-teens pilots swore that requiring training and certification was going to kill GA.
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yup - fur sure - the cost of an engine overhaul definitely will enhance GA.

:rolleyes:
 
Bob Noel said:
yup - fur sure - the cost of an engine overhaul definitely will enhance GA.

:rolleyes:
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I didn’t say, and sure didn’t want to imply, that the cost is good. Not at all. But there’s always some cost or requirement, some onerous and some just predictably increasing. I don’t see GA failing.
 
schmookeeg said:
Guessing it was a factory reman?

The added $42K cost will either have been some serious catch-up maintenance, upgrades, or man I can't even guess. But that's a bit much. I'd expect +10K for engine R&R and other necessaries. A "while we're here" prop overhaul might be another 5k. I'm at a loss otherwise.
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I will try to dig up the actual receipt, this guy takes good care of his plane so doubt it was catch up items.. maybe it was closer to $75K for the engine and all in cost for the year was hanger, etc., to $97K? Either way, it was a lot..
 
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