New vehicle, what to get?

PilotAlan said:
Another vehicle to consider is the Jeep Patriot.
It is almost exactly the size of the old Jeep Cherokee (the original mid size SUV), good gas mileage, and inexpensive.
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We rented one of those a while back and both SWMBO and I opined that it was probably the worst vehicle we'd driven in a decade. Terrible dynamics and incredibly loud on the highway.
 
How's the road noise with Subaru? I drove a Ford Escape a few years ago and didn't like the ride or the way it handled. Someone mentioned Ford Flex, it has a real nice ride and it's quiet.
 
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denverpilot said:
Out of your list, I'd say Subaru.

Co-worker has the Escape. It's in the shop for really bad stuff(TM) all the time. And unless they've changed it, the rear I-beam suspension kills any actual ground clearance it might have been able to claim.

I'm not a big fan of towing with unibody car-like vehicles with car-like suspensions. Seems to just beat them up.

Thought about the EcoBoost V6 Turbo F-150 at all? That's a nice truck if all the kinks are worked out of that engine. I think the jury is still out on that.

With a four door short-box and a tonneau cover or topper, it makes it the best "SUV" out there.
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That is good to know about the Escape, I'll check it out a little closer. It was a toss up with the F150 when I bought the Silverado. Two reasons I'm getting rid of the Silverado, poor mileage and I'm tired of herding a tank down the road all the time. That is also why I am staying away from full sized SUVs.
 
JOhnH said:
You need a new light duty truck. They are as comfortable as a car, you can get any option you want, they are roomy, they are always reliable and they make you a lot of friends. (Well, that last reason might not be a positive if you find you are always helping people move things when you would rather be flying).
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I don't really want a truck anymore. There is a lot space back there that I seldom use. That is one of the things that I don't like about the Silverado. It is a crew cab and then I'm hauling six foot of useless metal behind me all the time. I have a trailer that I can haul stuff from the lumber yard if I want, otherwise I never use the box of my truck. Back when I was younger and I owned a truck, my friends would get me to help them move and such, but at this stage, my friends either hire it done, or they have their own trucks. Frankly, when it comes to moving the kids, I would rather rent a U-Haul than have them climbing over the side of my Silverado and scratching up the paint.
 
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mirage00 said:
Worst vehicle I ever owned. :mad2:
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It is really interesting about vehicles. I've been looking at the Escape, and I've had people who have owned them tell me the are a POS, and others who are on their third one and wouldn't drive anything else. Same with the RAV4. I haven't met anyone who has any experience with the Lincoln. I was interested in the Range Rover, and some guy spent a half hour yesterday telling me how much he hated the one he had. I laugh, because that is kind of how I feel about my Siilverado, but everyone else I know who has one can't say anything bad about them.
 
ron22 said:
I own a 2006 Escape and my friend has a 2010 Escape Hybrid. Both have A LOT of road noise. Much worse in back seat. The back seat is not real good for a full sized adult.
My friend also has a 2012 Explore with the 3 row seating. This has less road notice by far. But has even less back seat room.
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The Explorer used to be BOF, but since the 2011 redesign has been on a modified version of the Volvo D3 unibody platform that also underpins the Volvo S80 and XC, and the new Ford Taurus. It's a stout vehicle, but I think you'll find that interior room is woefully deficient for as large as the Explorer is on the outside.

As the owner of a 2012 Escape and something of a Ford enthusiast (at least compared with Gov't Motors and Fiasler) I nevertheless cannot recommend any new Ford vehicle. I really like my Escape, but sadly it has suffered from a slew of quality and durability problems ranging from paint defects (just found another one today) and the need to have its transmission rebuilt at only 18,000 miles. The new ones have even more problems - particularly with the EcoBoost powertrains and MyFord Touch system - and build quality frankly sucks across most of the new Ford line.

It pains me to say it, but a GM Lambda (Chevy Traverse, Buick Enclave, GMC Acadia) or Theta (Equinox, Terrain) - or the Jeep Grand Cherokee -would almost certainly be better options.
 
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Ford seems to have focused (heh) on the newer platforms and the F-150.

The 5.0L in the F-150 is the fleet-duty engine. The 5.4 has well known but reasonable issues (lifters tapping, the spark plug issues), and the EcoBoost is fussy for some. EcoBoost needs a few years to work out the bugs unless you get a good one.

Escape redesign got neglected and rushed, I think. It's their cheap truck-like SUV for those that don't want the bubble cars. They didn't put much effort into it.

Ford needs to give a little design love to the Super Duty line, just in looks. The F-150 looks a heck of a lot better than her heavy duty cousins.

GM has completely given up in that department and even the 2014 Silverado looks like it did in 2000, pretty much. Definitely no useful interior changes.

Dodge? Welcome to 1995. We will take your DeLorean in trade for the scrap metal value. ;)
 
denverpilot said:
Ford seems to have focused (heh) on the newer platforms and the F-150.

The 5.0L in the F-150 is the fleet-duty engine. The 5.4 has well known but reasonable issues (lifters tapping, the spark plug issues), and the EcoBoost is fussy for some. EcoBoost needs a few years to work out the bugs unless you get a good one.

Escape redesign got neglected and rushed, I think. It's their cheap truck-like SUV for those that don't want the bubble cars. They didn't put much effort into it.

Ford needs to give a little design love to the Super Duty line, just in looks. The F-150 looks a heck of a lot better than her heavy duty cousins.

GM has completely given up in that department and even the 2014 Silverado looks like it did in 2000, pretty much. Definitely no useful interior changes.

Dodge? Welcome to 1995. We will take your DeLorean in trade for the scrap metal value. ;)
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Hey Chevy, aren't wheel wells supposed to be round???

Avoid My Ford Touch. Cumbersome to use and freezes up. You'll be wishing you had old fashioned knobs rather quickly.
 
How about the Jeep Compass Limited? That is their top of the line Compass. Looked at the Grand Cherokee and it is bigger than I want. Plus mileage wasn't really great on the sticker, and that is always pretty exaggerated to start with. I liked the Compass. The Compass actually listed a towing capacity of 2000 pounds, which is well within the limits of my little trailer. It is the only mid size SUV that I've seen that actually put the towing capacity right on the sticker.
 
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Maxmosbey said:
How about the Jeep Compass Limited? That is their top of the line Compass.
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It is not really a jeep product, re-badged chrysler somethingandtheother. Had one as a rental, awful tin-can that followed every rut in the road.
 
weilke said:
It is not really a jeep product, re-badged chrysler somethingandtheother. Had one as a rental, awful tin-can that followed every rut in the road.
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Mitsubishi lancer with a Hyundai engine. I drove one, slow, a real pig, not even that great of gas mileage. Relic from the Diamond Star motors era.
 
JHW said:
if you're upping the ante to explorer and grand cherokee sized vehicles, then I'd look at a toyota 4-runner. Not that there's anything wrong with the jeep vehicle itself but I'll never drive another GM or Chrysler product after my grandchildren were saddled with the debt to keep them afloat. That said, of the choices you list I'd get the subaru. You're not listing any requirements for a vehicle on a truck-type frame so why put up with the ride and handling that come with the same ?

btw I've got nothing against fords and my next car might be a focus. Nice line of vehicles overall. But the explorer seems to be lacking in towing and payload for the other sacrifices you have to make.
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No more GM vehicles for me. Soon to have 17 plants in communist China vs 12 in the US. Ford is at 6 in China. BMW is at 2 in China. Mercedes is at 2. I know they have to go where the demand is growing, but maybe business would not be so slow here if some of our greedy manufacturers and government did not trade with communists. Toyota is going to be high on my next shopping list.
 
I just read that the 2014 Compass with the 6 speed automatic is greatly improved. I don't know what to believe from reviews like that. I am a pessimist by nature when it comes to that kind of stuff, but it is still something to look into. I'm starting to get convinced that the Escape might not be the one.
 
RV10flyer said:
No more GM vehicles for me. Soon to have 17 plants in communist China vs 12 in the US. Ford is at 6 in China. BMW is at 2 in China. Mercedes is at 2. I know they have to go where the demand is growing, but maybe business would not be so slow here if some of our greedy manufacturers and government did not trade with communists. Toyota is going to be high on my next shopping list.
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I'm not swearing off GM, but I've not been real impressed with my Silverado, so that sort of colors my perception of them.
 
Maxmosbey said:
Is there any Jeep that is actually a Jeep product anymore?
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The Wrangler and the Grand Cherokee are the only ones I would consider 'Jeep'.

Almost bought a GC back when they offered them with the 3.0L diesel. After I talked to someone who owned a recent model and went through ungodly numbers of brake-rotors and some atrocious reviews about mechanical reliability, I decided to pass.
 
kawizx62003 said:
Ford Edge.
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Second this..
I rent them 5 or 6 times a year for the past 2 years, I enjoy the ride, and the quality. Nice Sync® system too. I always request a mid size SUV from Avis, and they have it in my profile that I prefer the Edge. No PT Cruisers or HHR's or Jeeps, thank you.
 
Maxmosbey said:
... and I've had people who have owned them tell me the are a POS, and others who are on their third one and wouldn't drive anything else. Same with the RAV4.
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My 2006 was ok. But it was rather typical of Toyota of today. Never any issues with anything in the drivetrain or electrics, but cheap-cheap-cheap. Glovebox latch broke, rear seat rattled. CD died and I replaced it with an aftermarket DIN unit for $100. It officially pulled 3500 lbs without that scam "tow prep" package (very slowly uphill on 2.4L engine), but since tongue load for most trailers is about 10%, and 350 lbs is the load limit, I could not load it up and tow.

Modern RAV4 changed little. Everyone raves about the 2.5L engine that replaced my 2.4L, and the mileage is improved. Oddly enough, I was beating EPA numbers in daily driving, got about 26..28 mpg.

If you are looking at RAV4, look at CR-V as well. There's very little apart between them.
 
Of course I'm a little prejudice, but the new Escape has been great for us. The only issues we've had, other than a recall of some very early ones is the Sync system. It's as much a problem with the phones as anything in most cases, while we've had a couple updates, turning the phone off and back on solves most issues.:dunno: I'm not sure why, but that's the first thing I have customers do when they are having an issue with the phone pairing to their cars.
Drive them all and decide, if you were closer I'd let you take an Escape overnight.;)
 
weilke said:
The Wrangler and the Grand Cherokee are the only ones I would consider 'Jeep'.

Almost bought a GC back when they offered them with the 3.0L diesel. After I talked to someone who owned a recent model and went through ungodly numbers of brake-rotors and some atrocious reviews about mechanical reliability, I decided to pass.
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The Grand Cherokee is a clone of the Durango (or the Durango is a clone of the GC, take your pick). The Wrangler is the only "Jeep-only" product.

One thing about rentals, they are built as fleet orders with the cheapest tires, less soundproofing, and get beat to death by rental drivers with minimal maintenance (read: alignments and suspension repairs). Be cautious of making decisions based on rental vehicle impressions.
With the exception that if you drive a rental with 20-30k on it and you like it, that's a stout car.
 
Maxmosbey said:
I'm starting to get convinced that the Escape might not be the one.
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Even know I was one of the people with some bad things to say about the Escape I would not rule it out because of what people on the Internet tell you.
Test drive one if nothing else it will give you something to compare too.
As for the towing I think you will be fine with any SUV. You are not talking a large load or long distance drives.
 
PilotAlan said:
One thing about rentals, they are built as fleet orders with the cheapest tires, less soundproofing, and get beat to death by rental drivers with minimal maintenance (read: alignments and suspension repairs). Be cautious of making decisions based on rental vehicle impressions.
With the exception that if you drive a rental with 20-30k on it and you like it, that's a stout car.
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'JD Powers has never seen a car he didn't like'.

I put my judgement based on a rental above reviews by either papers or websites. While the rentals are usually basic trim level, I don't believe the story about them being stripped any below that. Both the rental company who re-sells then after 15k miles and the car manufacturer have no interest in doing this.

I know its not an SUV, but I really liked the current model Taurus when I got it as a rental. I believe they offer a AWD powertrain, at least they used to. I could do without the touchscreen crap, in a short while, this will be as dated and nonfunctional as moving tape spedometers from the eighties and keypad door entry on Lincoln products from the 90s. What is so wrong with offering a couple of round knobs ??
 
We have an Outback. It's my version of a pickup. I've loaded it with all sorts of stuff, and pulled the occasional trailer with no trouble at all. The 4 tows 2700lbs and the 6 tows 3000lbs.
 
I will never own another Jeep product. I had a 96 Cherokee I bought brand new that was in the shop 9 times before it hit 30,000. At 28,000 the transmission went out, and the 4WD wouldn't engage after they replaced it. I understand there are lemon cars but after the regional manager for Jeep told me to "go **** yourself and deal with it" when I went up the chain high enough to interact with him, that sealed the deal for me. I will never have a Jeep/Dodge/Chrysler ever again. Never. I went back to Chevy before the weekend.
 
I love Outbacks and Foresters. It pays for my Av gas. I own an auto repair shop.
 
EdFred said:
I will never own another Jeep product. I had a 96 Cherokee I bought brand new that was in the shop 9 times before it hit 30,000. At 28,000 the transmission went out, and the 4WD wouldn't engage after they replaced it. I understand there are lemon cars but after the regional manager for Jeep told me to "go **** yourself and deal with it" when I went up the chain high enough to interact with him, that sealed the deal for me. I will never have a Jeep/Dodge/Chrysler ever again. Never. I went back to Chevy before the weekend.
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I had a 96 Cherokee I bought brand new too, and it didn't have problems. Sorry to hear yours sucked. I took mine to Germany and sold it there for more than it was worth in the US. When I moved back to the US, I wanted to buy a new Cherokee, but they had stopped making them. I dont like the Grand Cherokees or any of the current models.
 
It wasn't that the vehicle sucked. I understand the Friday/Monday car off the line problems, and I would have considered another one until I met with the regional manager. That's the reason I won't ever own one again. Even if someone gave one to me.
 
My other neighbor has one of the few diesel small Jeeps. He's been plagued with recalls, and repairs and he keeps his vehicles in top condition. Also, after one of the recalls he got the car back from the dealer, drove it 8 miles and it shut down hard on him. He called me to come pick him up and we looked around in the engine bay and I found the injector harness which was supposed to be clasped into a set of clips left loose where it contacted the exh manifold. I took a picture and told him not to say anything to the dealer. They picked it up, and fixed it and told him it was a relay. I asked the dealer service writer if there was anything wrong with the injector wiring. He said no, so I showed him the picture, and then we went out and looked at the car, and the wires were all spliced with black tape around them. He left the car, and told them to replace the whole harness and call when it was ready. What a CF.
 
Maxmosbey said:
I was interested in the Range Rover, and some guy spent a half hour yesterday telling me how much he hated the one he had.
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He probably had an original British made version.

I had one of those, and it was in the shop all the time.

Anything after about 2004 is night and day difference from the old Range Rover's.

BMW bought them in 2002 and started making radical changes before selling it to Ford Motor Company.

My wife's is a 2006 HSE.

We left the suburban in the garage yesterday and took a road trip in her car. I had forgotten how nice that car is, as it has been a garage decoration for over a year now since I got my power chair and have to haul it around in the suburban
 
EdFred said:
It wasn't that the vehicle sucked. I understand the Friday/Monday car off the line problems, and I would have considered another one until I met with the regional manager. That's the reason I won't ever own one again. Even if someone gave one to me.
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That is why I never put my customers in touch with my factory reps. It never turns out well, my service manager had to get between a customer and a service zone manager one time, they were about to go at it!:mad2::mad2:
I tell my customers it's always better if I talk on their behalf, cooler heads can usually get stuff done, not always, but usually. ;)
 
Range Rovers aren't terrible, unless they are out of warranty.;) They are nice cars, but the cost of repairs gets pretty steep if you're paying out of pocket. :mad2:
JimG. said:
He probably had an original British made version.

I had one of those, and it was in the shop all the time.

Anything after about 2004 is night and day difference from the old Range Rover's.

BMW bought them in 2002 and started making radical changes before selling it to Ford Motor Company.

My wife's is a 2006 HSE.

We left the suburban in the garage yesterday and took a road trip in her car. I had forgotten how nice that car is, as it has been a garage decoration for over a year now since I got my power chair and have to haul it around in the suburban
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N747JB said:
That is why I never put my customers in touch with my factory reps. It never turns out well, my service manager had to get between a customer and a service zone manager one time, they were about to go at it!:mad2::mad2:
I tell my customers it's always better if I talk on their behalf, cooler heads can usually get stuff done, not always, but usually. ;)
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The dealer wouldn't do a thing to solve the problem. I had to go up the ladder.
 
N747JB said:
Range Rovers aren't terrible, unless they are out of warranty.;) They are nice cars, but the cost of repairs gets pretty steep if you're paying out of pocket. :mad2:
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My 1994 County shared the same acronym as a boat…

Bring out another thou$and every time I took it into the shop


This 2006 has not had anything wrong with it other than the passenger side mirror housing got broken in a carwash.

Since the dealer is 45 min. away, a strip of black tape has held it on for well over a year now (and you can't tell from a distance):D
 
I drove a Compass today and I was not impressed. I didn't like the way it didn't shift gears. I guess they have a six speed transmission in some of the 2014s, but he couldn't find one for me to test drive. The Lincoln was unimaginative on the interior. I didn't like it that much. The seats were not comfortable at all. I drove the Ford Escape Titanium model with every option there is except a moon roof and the automatic parking. It had a turbo charged four cylinder. I drove it for quite a while. I couldn't get my wife off the touch screen. She is a high tech kind of girl. I have to say that of the three there was no comparison with the Escape Titanium. Maybe I'll drive the Toyota tomorrow.
 
The Mazda line deserves a look. We'd never considered one, but after trying Ford, Honda, and Hyundai.. we ended up with a 2014 CX5. It's got plenty of pep, great features, great gas mileage, and looks good too (really, they all look the same). The CX7 is bigger than I like, but it may float your boat (or pull your trailer). The CX5 is a finalist in the "2013 North American Truck/Utility of the Year"
 
Hmmm. Mazda.

Always seem to overlook those. Don't know why. Their vehicles always seem really nice when I drive them.

Friend of mine has a CX7, and it is very, very nice.
 
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