Please.
Don't move south.
We have too many Damn Yankees already. For some reason they like to retire to here.
More BBQ for us.
Thanks Steve, you're a good friend.
Wow. Not much of a competition so far! I think we're going to have to start talking about high wing vs. low wing in Denver or something.
Oh please no! How about LOP/ROP for runup operations at sea level vs. 5K ft.
OK, Houston.
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Actually, I'd choose Houston over Denver, but that's because I agree with a good friend and client who grew up in Wisconsin, but has lived in Texas for about 45 years - says, "I never had to shovel heat."
There are a lot of great places to live in a reasonable drive from Houston, and your buck goes a very long way there. I would not move to Houston to live in the immediate area (city or its suburbs) - then again, I remember the first time I went to Denver, looked around and said, "where's the pretty stuff?"
'Course, if you allow up to two hours driving from Denver, you can get to some of the most appealing countryside that can be found.
I know there's a lot to be said for the Phoenix area, but I am not gonna be the one to say it.
The cost of living, as you mentioned, is one of the biggest draws of Houston, but with y'all's summer...man, I don't know.
Check out Brighton and the area north of DIA unless you really want the city. Nicer commute to the airport than Aurora and the Denver area. In fact, I live is Central Fort Collins and am right at 1 hour from the airport.
We have shifted our focus north. For Collins looks very nice, and if my wife ends up at the university that will probably be our primary area of interest. The northern 'burbs will probably be what we look at for now, though.
Houston, for all of the interesting industries in the area, is the pits. The heat and humidity in summer is mind-numbing.
Phoenix... no opinion, except that I don't think AZ as a state is in very good straits.
Denver? Nice people, nice area, interesting things to see.
Give me a heads up as to when you are leaving -- Jessie and I will come down to VAB and we'll get dinner!
Cheers,
-Andrew
I'll certainly let you know, Andrew. Things are very fluid right now, but hopefully I'll have some answers soon! I'm working Fri-Mon this month and Thur-Sun next, if you ever happen to be down south mid-week.
Houston? NFW.
Phoenix? I'm going there in a week, and staying for nigh on 3 weeks. I'll give you a pirep on my return.
Denver? Well, frankly, I wouldn't really even bother waiting for the PIREP, personally, because I'd jump on Denver like a carjacker on a brand new Escalade.
HA! Well said, Andrew; very nice simile.
Which airport is it easiest to get to the FlyBQ from? :wink2:
I like Scottsdale area it is hot as hell in the summer. But that didn't bother me. l love the desert. I think however ironically I'd miss the winter. I've never been anywhere in the Denver area other than the old Stapleton Airport. But I like the change of seasons and Love to ski. There are lots of outdoor activies in both areas but because of the Seasons I'd probably go with the Denver area but would not be disappointed if I was transfered to The Phoenix area.
That's kind of my take on it, Adam. I spent about four months in PHX and LOVED it, but it was Jan-April, so I think I might have had a slightly skewed view of the weather. For two kids from the midwest, that might be an abrupt change.
PHX would probably be easier for the FlyBQ (PHX D-> PHL on AWE), but I'm guessing getting out of DEN wouldn't be too tough either. This year might be in question, though, I'm affraid...
I already did. I spent 11 years in Texas, 7 of them in Houston. Parents lived in Phoenix and I "kinda" grew up there. I live in Denver and have turned down multiple offers (new jobs, all expenses paid) to leave.
I'd rather be unemployed in Denver that unemployed just about anywhere else.
Suscbribe to the Sunday papers of each of the cities for a few months then make a decision.
First question - how do you plan to make a living or are you already retired?
I love that newspaper idea, that had never occurred to me. Reading stats on city-data only tells part of the story, so to speak. Definitely not retired (I wish, but I'm only 26)! I'm a pilot by trade, so as long as I'm within 2 hrs of KDEN, I'm good to go.
Denver. NOT Saudi Aurora. Go west. To the mtns. Or, barring that south to Castle Rock area. Aurora is just far western Kansas, you'd hate it.
HA. Considering I grew up in actual Kansas...ya, I'd probably hate it. And my wife would hate it more!!
Where to live? First, "Denver" is the generic name for everything around the state capitol with the exception of Boulder (Colorado's answer to Marin County...). Denver itself is very small geographically. But the "Denver Metropolitan Statistical Area" (the official name for Denver & 'burbs) is about 2.5M people. Whatever you want, you can find it somewhere.
- High rise condo close to theatre, opera, all the sports arenas? Then it's downtown or close to downtown Denver.
- McMansion with lots of land? North of DIA or south of town (Castle Rock, west of I-25).
- Nice patio home, garage, good schools - southern Aurora (SE), Highlands Ranch (SW), Parker (further SE), etc.
- Airpark? We got 4 of them locally. Two NW (Parkland & Van Aire) and 2 SE (Kelly and I forget the name, it's due east of KAPA), and a 5th that's "kinda" an airpark (Platte Valley)
I live in Aurora (just to the right of Atilla the Hun and Rush Limbaugh), due north of KAPA but base the cherokee at KFTG. It's never taken me more than 30 min to FTG, a bit more to DIA (ok, ok, ok, KDEN). From downtown Denver to DIA, 45 min with little or no traffic, 2 hours during rush hour.
Real estate is cheap around here right now. There are some great deals on new housing east of Denver/Aurora but not as far out as Bennett. On the other hand, if you're interested in rural, but still within 30 min of DIA, look into Bennett or Strasburg - due east on I-70.
But if you want close to the mountains, look into Longmont, just a bit further north than Eric in Brighton but without the aggravation of Boulder (and the university).
All these locations are easily accessible by interstates (I-70, I-25, I-470) to get you to DIA.
I'm in a 25 yr old patio home with garage, basement, small yard, HOA worries about the roofs, siding, etc. 3 bdrm and 2 1/2 bath. Just got my property tax bill for appraised value of $148K. There are a number of units here for sale, going price is $130-165 depending on the 3 or 4 bdrm model.
Do you need to worry about schools for kids? That's another topic entirely.
Why not come out for a few days and look around. I can put you in contact with a real estate agent in advance and you can chat (I get nothing, no birddog fee, no kickback)
Downside - like most states, Colorado is having financial pains. I used to teach part-time at a local college. Due to severe reductions in state funding to state higher-ed, most of the part-timers are gone.
The football team is the butt of most jokes these days, the basketball team is in the midst of the ugly trade talks, the hockey team is the hockey team, and the baseball team is just plain fun. Soccer team isn't bad (and they have their own stadium which is fantastic and NOT in Denver!).
Fantastic, intel, THANK YOU! We're both suburban kids ourselves, so I think that's kind of what we're looking for. Brighton, perhaps, sounds nice. I'll have to chat with the wife, but I may very well take you up on the real estate agent contact. Coming from the east coast, those prices aren't bad at all! We don't have kids YET, but we hope to at some point. That is a big part of my concern, though it's several years off, I want to make sure that good schools are an option. For that matter, good hospitals, too.
Oh and the airpark...I would LOVE to, but as Mari pointed out, that's
wayyyy out of the price range. Nice idea, though!
Denver.
The area of 104th Ave and Tower Rd has a 15 minute drive time to the airport.
That's where I live, in a master planned community called Reunion. The area has built up over the last 7 years. Nice houses from the $150s (for a 2br ranch), townhouses, a couple apartment buildings. Lots of airline staff live over here.
Lots of open space, easy cost of living. Great neighbors. My neighbor is a ground ops manager for Southwest, a Customs inspector lives next to him, a pilot a block back, and the DIA Operations Manager a block the other way.
Easy access to everywhere. I can be downtown at rush hour in 30 minutes. This morning I left my house at 0815 and was in west Golden (in the foothills) by 0845.
Easy access to I-76, E-470, I-70, I-25, and US-36.
Here you can see the proximity to DIA.
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...9.86179,-104.733696&spn=0.13361,0.308647&z=12
Terrific, Alan, that neighborhood sounds a lot like what we want. Neither of us are the "downtown nightlife" type; a nice family oriented neighborhood would be great.
2 hour commute? Psh, forget Arizona and the illegal immigrants/crime, forget Texas and the humidity/crime, and Denver and the awesomeness and lack of crime.
Go 2 hours to the west of DEN. You'll be in the heart of the most gorgeous area in the entire country. Or go 2 hours to the north of DEN, you're looking at Cheyenne, Fort Collins, Loveland, etc. Gorgeous and fun. Go 2 hours south, and you're in Pueblo...on second thought, don't go south. Go 2 hours east and you're in the plains of Colorado.
But go 2 hours in any direction from Phoenix, and you're still in the ugliest desert you'll ever see.
Go 2 hours in any direction from Houston, and you're either in the Gulf of Mexico, or wishing you were.
As for Mexican Food? You're not moving to New Mexico, so you're stuck with some replica of the best food ever made, minus green chile and probably loaded with beans and taco meat (Tex-Mex).
Much of a Mexican food snob, are we? Denver and its awesomeness sounds like it's pulling into the lead.
Obviously I'll say Denver. Not a big fan of Aurora though.
Alan mentioned Reunion. Nice community, prices depressed right now. Good time to buy out there.
Also consider Stapleton, the neighborhood that was built right on the old airport property.
Easier yet, if you're likely to be buying just call Christopher and tell him Nate sent ya. He's really good at matching people to their needs, real-estate-wise. And no, I get nothing for the referral. He's a friend who wasn't in the realty biz when I bought my house in Centennial.
http://homes.denverboulder.com/idx/7867/bio.php?id=1
He's one of those folks who worked in various roles in companies from worker-bee to upper management, then got the courage to follow his dreams since he always loved real-estate. Never met any of his clients who didn't like his work. Nice to deal with someone passionate about their work.
As far as Houston goes, family still living there but most of them jumped at the opportunity to come back to Colorado. Housing was similarly priced but you got a freakin' mansion for the same money as Denver in the 90s back then. I boggled at my folks having a swimming pool and enormous house when they shared how little they paid for it there. The problem was, they were in Spring, TX near KDWH and had an hour drive to everything without traffic. Sprawl is enormous there. Humidity is awful.
A good friend lives in KPHX as well as my Wife's folks. I like visiting and I could live there, but the summer heat is insane. Good for a night-owl like me though, outdoor dinners in summer are commonly 9PM just to let things cool off.
Back to Denver... Budget issues and other things make school districts vary wildly in quality. If you have kids, there's some "homework" to be done on the schools.
Someone mentioned it but let's state it clearly. Learn to drive in snow. And it's really not a bad idea to have at least one AWD/4WD vehicle in the family. We don't get continuous bad winter weather, but when we do take a March/April pounding it'll hang around on the roads and ground for a few days. Worst I've seen was 1982 Christmas blizzard that lasted roughly a week, and March '03 that collapsed my awning that's 43' X 13' over the back porch.
Holler if you have other Denver questions. It's hard to know what to offer up but I've lived here since my dad was discharged from the Navy in the late 1970's and both sides of the family have been here for three or four generations.
A great many people like KDEN, if jobs weren't a problem and my Wife's activities and my airplane weren't down here, mountain living would suit me better. Too many people down here in the "Queen City of the Plains" for my taste, anymore. But I also watched it grow from 1.2 million to the size it is today... So I'm a little biased.
Great grandma homesteaded in South Park and walked 1/4 mile each day for water in the late 1800s with a wooden pail. Most folks think South Park is a town, from watching Comedy Central. It's a high valley that runs about half the length of the State. Colorado history lesson #1!
Fantastic, Nate, thanks! I'll tell my wife about your RE agent friend; I'm sure we're going to need some help, as it's going to be tough for us to get out there before we have to move. The snow driving isn't TOO much of an issue; I'm from Kansas and she's from MSP (and we did a winter in Maine), so we're both fairly used to the snow. The 4WD/AWD will be a priority, though. We both have FWD sedans. Probably not the best choice.
I think my wife was most excited about seeing South Park, way to kill that!
Do NOT go 2 hours west of DEN in your situation, Matt - Or you're gonna have to get a crash pad in town for any Sundays that you happen to be on call. Swear to god the entire Denver metro area goes up into the mountains on the weekends, and the traffic coming back into Denver from the west on Sundays is hellacious. If you need to be able to get to the airport within two hours ANY time, I'd say Golden is about as far west as you want to go. In addition, when you go too far west you run into problems with passes closing, and... I can't remember if Colorado makes cars throw chains on or if they just close the roads when it gets that bad, but if you need to get to the airport in a reasonable amount of time all the time, mountain living is not for you. Sorry.
Nick's right, though, it shore is purty up there... But save it for your days off. Based purely on the fact that I hate traffic with a passion, I'd go looking for something to the northeast on I-76, anywhere between KDEN and Fort Morgan.
I'm sure I'd love the scenery of the mountain living, but having done a year of driving between Virginia Beach and DC/Dulles every week, I've had enough of traffic! I'm ready to live closer to work, or at least somewhere that it's a straight shot home.
So, I'm thinking that Matt is moving to Denver - we had a PoA vote on it.
And so it shall be!
That one is called
Rocky Mountain Airpark. The lots there are very expensive, though. You're not getting a house for $1,500/month. The good news is that it's in Elbert County where the taxes are low. The county is not exactly in good financial health, however, and the services have always been minimal. I live in Elbert County and pay $1,700/year on a 3 br (4 counting the now finished basement) house on 3 acres that they say is worth $260,000. I think that's being very overoptimistic now, though, but I have no idea since I've never had it appraised in the 19 years I've lived here. If you want to live in the "country" you could consider the NW corner of Elbert County. It's not all that far from DIA (which I assume would be your base). I live about an hour away but there are parts of the county such as Rocky Mountain Airpark which are closer.
DIA (DEN, whatever) will, indeed, be my base. I don't know that we're quite ready for an acreage; neither of us have ever lived outside of a city/suburban atmosphere. That said, I'm sure we could learn to love it for the right price and proximity to work.
