[NA] Toyota Tundras

FastEddieB

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Fast Eddie B
I’m starting this thread to avoid further derailing of the solar eclipse thread by discussion about our new-to-us Toyota Tundra.

As background, in 2014 we bought a 21’ aluminum travel trailer with the intent of towing it with an SUV. To that end, we bought a lightly used 2011 Ford Flex with an EcoBoost twin-turbo V6 putting out about 365 hp. Towed with that combo over 20,000 miles and it worked quite well.

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A few years back, the transmission started lurching a bit when under load, progressively getting worse. The cost of either repair or replacement didn’t seem to make sense on a 13 year old car that was starting to have other minor but annoying issues as well.

So, we started thinking about a pickup, that could replace the Flex as a tow vehicle and our equally aging 2006 Honda Ridgeline for around town pickup stuff. We focused on the Tundra, having had good luck with 2 prior Toyotas, and Japanese vehicles in general.

We went in knowing nothing about Tundras, stopping first at a local CarMax after viewing their selections online:

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The first 2 were OK, but we learned that in 2022 the Tundras got a major update with a twin-turbo V6 that had both more power and better gas mileage and newer tech so we focused on those. The 2022 in Chattanooga was sold before we could drive over to check it out. Another similar one came up in Lexington, KY, but it was also gone the next day.

We ended up finding one very close by at a dealer in Maryville, TN and ended up buying it:

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This went kinda long, so to be continued…
 
Currently driving a 2014 silverado I bought new. Starting to think about replacement and I have been eyeing the Tundra. I'm interested to here your feedback. I have heard frustrations with the mpg and the fuel tank size. That's about it so far for issues after they got past the first hiccup on a bad batch of turbo valves or something. We bought a honda accord back in 2018 and it has been a great car. I am leaning towards not buying another American vehicle at this point.
 
I've owned a 2007 5.7L V8 Tundra since new, 2nd Gen, 220K miles, no issues, but I'm ready to replace it. The paint after 13 years in the Desert Southwest has taken a hit. I've not heard good things about the 3rd Gen Tundras with the V6 turbo. Sure they may have the power, but the software running the engine and the controls are still having issues. I was getting my '07 serviced last summer and talking to the Service Manager, his comment was, if you are looking for a new 3rd Gen Tundra, I'd wait a couple of more years. They are still debugging the software.

I can't bring myself to spend $60-70K on a new truck that is still having issues. Check out the youtube videos on the 3rd Gen Tundra. Oh, the V6 turbo may have more HP, but they did not improve the mpg.
 
Oh, the V6 turbo may have more HP, but they did not improve the mpg.

Not sure about that. Gen 2 V8’s are notoriously bad on gas - I believe 17 highway is what they specify, but most owners don’t seem to get that. So far, we’ve seen 22 mpg in ours when not towing, on par with our Flex. On our recent FL trip towing our travel trailer we got between 11.5 and 14 mpg calculated, settling in between 12 and 13 mpg. Incidentally, that’s slightly better than our Flex did with the same trailer.
 
Did you look at the hybrid?
 
Curious ... what's the weight of the loaded trailer? I've got a Frontier that will tow ~ 6800 lbs but I'd want to keep the trailer weight (loaded) to <3500 lbs. Been looking at travel trailers recently and thinking 18' is about as long as I want to go (but that's another subject).
 
Curious ... what's the weight of the loaded trailer? I've got a Frontier that will tow ~ 6800 lbs but I'd want to keep the trailer weight (loaded) to <3500 lbs. Been looking at travel trailers recently and thinking 18' is about as long as I want to go (but that's another subject).

I had to look it up. The max gross is 5,800 lbs, and I’ll bet loaded we’re probably close to that. Another trip to the scales is likely in order.
 
I've had four trucks since 1994: 1994 Suburban, 2004 Avalanche, 2005 Toyota Tundra, and a 2020 Ram 1500 Limited. I like my Ram the best but the others were all fine. The 'burban and the Tundra were wiped by other things. The Avalanche was beginning to lose its freaking mind. I like the RAM. The only downside was the dealership I got it from was pretty corrupt. They baited and switched me on models so I have a towing package I can't stand which loses the all around vision which I really wanted. The service department outrlight lied to me and tried to charge me $300 to install something that was supposed to be on the truck when I got it. I installed it myself in the parking lot in about 10 minutes. Never went back to those crooks. The nominally closer dealership has a much more reasonable service department.
 
2003 Tundra 250K mi, zero major problems, put it in use as secondary/spare vehicle but the darned thing just keeps going; it’s an old friend now.
Decided to go bigger, now driving a
2020 Tundra 2.5gen 5.7L 80K mi, the new Tundras are full size trucks. 4WD. It can tow; it can do 85moh all day long, lots of room, has adaptive cruise control very nice, other amenities I don’t need.
Major complaint is the cockpit warnings…. every DAMN thing gets a beep—beep—beep which cannot be disabled by the dealer.
Also, it is programmed to use engine braking on downhills but has not mastered that smoothly. Also the new Tundras have lost the 2nd visor on the driver side, that used to be very handy here. Otherwise, I expect it will last forever.
 
For the short time I owned a Tundra, I belonged to some Tundra chat boards. I think I was literally the only person there having problems. I stopped going to the boards very quickly, because every time I posted about a new problem, I was constantly accused of being a troll. The Tundra was not only the worst vehicle I've ever owned, it was so bad, I came to realize that the vehicles before the Tundra that I thought were bad, I had to admit were not that bad...at least compared to the Tundra. I wrote this on another post (and someone messaged me and said I was derailing the thread) so I copied that post to post here, then deleted it from the other thread (sorry, this is somewhat long):

God, where do I start? Well, at the beginning I guess lol, but a very long painful story! I'm a pathologist, but I also run a side hustle where I need a truck that can tow. Years ago, I bought a new Ram 2500 for this, and it worked well with one exception: the Hemi motor got HORRIBLE gas mileage when not towing (like 10 city, 15 highway) and I don't really like the idea of owning multiple vehicles. Probably didn't help that I had that truck decked out with bling, oversized tires, etc. After 150k miles on the Ram, the commercials for the Tundra being able to tow while ALSO getting exceptional gas mileage caught my eye, so I priced one out and traded in the Ram.
First day: drove the truck home in a light snow storm, the next day, I took it to the quarter wash to get the salt off, 35 miles on the odometer...as I'm spraying the truck, I'm noticing NUMEROUS, LARGE black spots all over the hood. The black spots are getting larger and larger as I wash...before I realize what was happening, one spot is almost the size of a dinner plate...IT WAS THE PAINT COMING OFF THE HOOD!!! Back to the dealership for a new paint job after 2 days of ownership!
A week later the paint job is done, I had just left the dealership, and only a couple miles away when suddenly my brakes give out! Thankfully, I pull to the side of the road without hitting anything, and back to the dealer the truck goes. Some rear brake sensor was faulty. 2 days later, I'm again leaving the dealership, when the trans light goes on...truck goes in limp mode...back to the dealership with less than 100 miles, and at this point it's been in my garage just 1 night. This time, they can't figure out what the problem is, and they had to fly in some Toyota expert from Texas. Replaced the entire trans. I had yet to tow anything with the dang thing (thankfully, this was occuring in winter, when my side hustle is dormant).
Got the truck back after over 2 weeks. I went about 2 more weeks when I went to close the driver's door, and the entire door interior trim came off! Back to the dealership. I get the truck back, and after a week or so, I happened to jump up on the tailgate (and btw, I'm 5'7" 160 lbs), AND THE ENTIRE TAILGATE CAVES IN!!! At this point, the dealership starts accusing me of "abusing the truck", and they point to the owner's manual that says the tailgate can only support 150 lbs!!! Seriously, look it up...Toyota made a, ahem, 'truck', with a tailgate rated for 150 lbs. As they are accusing me of "abusing the truck" I look out on their used car lot, and their premier vehicle (you know the one sitting up on elevated ramps) is MY PAST RAM TRUCK! I point out to them that my last truck looked brand new after 150,000 miles...so new, it was now their "premier" used truck! At least they stopped accusing me of "truck abuse". LOL.
For three months I endured problem after problem...the truck was literally at the dealer way more than it was in my garage (my wife made a sign in the garage that read, "Its been XXX days without a problem with the Tundra" and she had a piece of paper with "0" on it stuck over the XXX)...after about 90 days of ownership, I consulted with a lemon law attorney. But, a few days later and before I pulled the trigger with the attorney, a lady driving an SUV turned left in front of me on a 55 mph road. Buh bye Tundra POS! I should mention that this was all in 2015, btw. Maybe they are better now.

BTW, I've never worked for anything automotive, and I have no horse in the automotive race. I had good luck with that RAM 2500 maintenance-wise so I bought another one after the Tundra, but this new Ram is now a diesel. I still own this Ram, it just turned 106k miles this week, and it has not been back to the dealer once! Not.One.Single.Time. There are actually a couple of recalls on the truck, but I've decided the possibility of a "maintenance induced failure" is a greater risk than the risk of having problems for not having the recall done. It actually gets pretty good gas mileage too. I'm glad to hear the OP is liking it...I wouldn't wish my Tundra experience on my worst enemy!
 
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I can certainly see why you’re disillusioned with Tundras. You had an inexcusably bad experIence.

We’ve only had ours for a few months and a few thousand miles. No problems at all so far, but too soon to come to any conclusions. Ours had 48k miles on it when we bought it, and it seems like it was a fleet vehicle before that. Only a few minor dings and no mechanical issues we’ve noticed. Paint seems perfect. As mentioned, the first year of the new powertrain did seem to have teething problems, though it’s unclear how widespread those problems were, and if they’ve been adequately dealt with on newer models. We’re outside the standard warranty, but have about 9,000 miles left on the powertrain warranty if something goes terribly wrong there.

We had no idea going in on the trim levels of Tundras, of which there are many. Our SR5 is one up from the even more basic SR. It lacks some features we’ve become used to: electrically adjustable seats, heated seats and/or steering wheel - that sort of thing. None of those are a big deal, and don’t really affect functionality as a tow vehicle. We would have liked 120v outlets and more USB and 12v outlets throughout the cab and truck bed. We also miss the two-way tailgate of the Ridgeline. Many of these become available on higher trim levels. We’re happy with the stock wheel/tire - many of the higher trim levels come with bigger wheel/tire combos which for us just cost more and adversely affect fuel economy. If we replace our Tundra with another someday, we might go up one or more trim levels, but not go crazy - these things ain’t cheap.

On the plus side, wireless Apple CarPlay works seamlessly, and the traffic-aware cruise control works quite well. The sound system sounds quite good to us. Lanekeep assist is jerkier than on our Tesla, and not available at all when towing. The ride is a bit jouncier and truck-like than our Flex, but that’s only logical, and not bad overall.

Like I said, so far, so good and fingers crossed.
 
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I remember when the second generation Tundra came out. The local airport manager had bought one and got heckled relentlessly in our small town full of Ford and GM trucks. He let me drive it shortly after getting it and I'll be honest, I was blown away. It had so much power and the 6 speed auto made it feel like a sportscar compared to the domestic trucks of the time. I never loved the looks of them but it was a game changer. I glanced at a friends latest model and admit it is nice.

If I were to buy a newer truck to replace my 05 Silverado I'm not sure what I would get. I would skip over all the 1/2 ton trucks and go straight to a 3/4 or 1 ton. The new ones ride so nice, they aren't that much more expensive if at all, and the engines aren't full of fuel saving gimmicks that will break. I am anti diesel due to how unreliable and expensive to repair they have become but they do hold their resale and making towing/hauling a much more relaxed experience. I'd probably splurge for the diesel and get the longest possible warranty offered.
 
I remember when the second generation Tundra came out. The local airport manager had bought one and got heckled relentlessly in our small town full of Ford and GM trucks. He let me drive it shortly after getting it and I'll be honest, I was blown away. It had so much power and the 6 speed auto made it feel like a sportscar compared to the domestic trucks of the time. I never loved the looks of them but it was a game changer. I glanced at a friends latest model and admit it is nice.

If I were to buy a newer truck to replace my 05 Silverado I'm not sure what I would get. I would skip over all the 1/2 ton trucks and go straight to a 3/4 or 1 ton. The new ones ride so nice, they aren't that much more expensive if at all, and the engines aren't full of fuel saving gimmicks that will break. I am anti diesel due to how unreliable and expensive to repair they have become but they do hold their resale and making towing/hauling a much more relaxed experience. I'd probably splurge for the diesel and get the longest possible warranty offered.
Honestly, unless you were towing heavy/often-enough to justify it, I'd just find a gasser 3/4 ton. The cost for the diesel models is crazy, the fuel is more expensive, and the repair bills are out of this world when something goes sideways. The resale is good, but that's largely because you're paying out the nose on the front end. I've seen repair bills for several people with modern Ram and Ford diesels (like the heater grid nut issue on the Cummins or the CP4-failure on Ram/Ford) and it's quickly $12K+ in parts and labor. The headaches with DEF/DPF are even more reason to abstain from the platform. If I were buying new or almost-new, I'd be looking at something like the F-250 w/7.3L "Godzilla" gasser, or the Ram 2500 w/6.4L Hemi. You can buy them $20K cheaper than the diesel versions, and while they won't have the outright pulling power of a 1000+ft-lbs diesel, they are more than adequate for most anything you'll want to throw at it.
 
Honestly, unless you were towing heavy/often-enough to justify it, I'd just find a gasser 3/4 ton. The cost for the diesel models is crazy, the fuel is more expensive, and the repair bills are out of this world when something goes sideways. The resale is good, but that's largely because you're paying out the nose on the front end. I've seen repair bills for several people with modern Ram and Ford diesels (like the heater grid nut issue on the Cummins or the CP4-failure on Ram/Ford) and it's quickly $12K+ in parts and labor. The headaches with DEF/DPF are even more reason to abstain from the platform. If I were buying new or almost-new, I'd be looking at something like the F-250 w/7.3L "Godzilla" gasser, or the Ram 2500 w/6.4L Hemi. You can buy them $20K cheaper than the diesel versions, and while they won't have the outright pulling power of a 1000+ft-lbs diesel, they are more than adequate for most anything you'll want to throw at it.
I'm fully aware which is why my current truck is a gas 3500. I can get parts for it anywhere and I can fix pretty much anything that could go wrong in a parking lot with a basic socket set. That said, the few times I go through the mountains with a load I dream about how much nicer it would be with a diesel. Truth is if I can afford a 75k truck I'm probably not going to be too concerned about a repair bill. The horror stories of being broke down on the side of the road and having to wait weeks for repairs lives rent free in the back of my head though. Probably an issue I will never face though since a truck is a tool for me and not something I would ever daily drive. Yea the gas bill hurts but when I do the math, a diesel wouldn't save much if any by the time you factor in the fuel cost, oil changes, and DEF. If I ever switch it will be to a pre emissions truck.
 
Honestly, unless you were towing heavy/often-enough to justify it, I'd just find a gasser 3/4 ton. ….
When my F150KR was stolen last summer, I replaced it with an F250KR gasser. It’s definitely the sweet spot if you’re towing anything that weighs as much as an F150 does.

While the 1/2 tons have the capacity to do a lot, at the top end of the range you’re towing something that’s twice as long and twice as heavy as the TV. That’s just not a good recipe. Between the extra weight and beefier brakes, the 7k lb travel tailer we tow is a noticeably easier tow behind the F250 than the F150SCrew.
 
It’s taken very little to make this truck “our own”.

1) Getting it ready to tow required getting a longer shank for our w/d hitch so the trailer could ride level.

2) It’s a long step up into even a stock Tundra. Especially for Karen. I bought these on Amazon for roughly 1/3 the cost of the Toyota items, and the installation was straightforward and they seem well made and rugged:

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3) I needed a bed cover since I wanted to carry tools in the bed. After watching YouTube videos, ended up with this:

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Well designed, well made a fairly easy install. Not as waterproof as I might have liked, but the reviews did warn of that.

And that should do it for now. As an aside, I’m gradually come to see doing things to vehicles for purely cosmetic reasons as just kind of silly. Lots of the mods done to Tundras - and not just Tundras, of course - seem to fall into that category. I guess I just no longer care about looks for look’s sake.
 
When my F150KR was stolen last summer, I replaced it with an F250KR gasser. It’s definitely the sweet spot if you’re towing anything that weighs as much as an F150 does.

While the 1/2 tons have the capacity to do a lot, at the top end of the range you’re towing something that’s twice as long and twice as heavy as the TV. That’s just not a good recipe. Between the extra weight and beefier brakes, the 7k lb travel tailer we tow is a noticeably easier tow behind the F250 than the F150SCrew.
I daily a diesel Excursion after having towed with an '08 F-150 for over a decade. Towing 5-7K is night/day easier with the diesel and heavier duty frame/suspension. It was never difficult with the F-150 except the one time I had about 8K on the trailer, the F-150 was at its limit there. It's just that the HD trucks handle the load without any fuss. I always dislike when people say "I can't even feel the trailer back there", but it certainly is much smoother when the tow vehicle is better-matched to the trailer weight.
 
I'm fully aware which is why my current truck is a gas 3500. I can get parts for it anywhere and I can fix pretty much anything that could go wrong in a parking lot with a basic socket set. That said, the few times I go through the mountains with a load I dream about how much nicer it would be with a diesel. Truth is if I can afford a 75k truck I'm probably not going to be too concerned about a repair bill. The horror stories of being broke down on the side of the road and having to wait weeks for repairs lives rent free in the back of my head though. Probably an issue I will never face though since a truck is a tool for me and not something I would ever daily drive. Yea the gas bill hurts but when I do the math, a diesel wouldn't save much if any by the time you factor in the fuel cost, oil changes, and DEF. If I ever switch it will be to a pre emissions truck.
That's why my diesel is deleted, lol. Things can still be expensive, but I can do most of the repairs fairly easily and parts are still plentiful for the 6.0L Powerstroke since they made a ton of them in the '03-'07 time period. My co-worker had his CP4 fuel pump go while towing his travel trailer. Sent bits throughout the whole fuel system and required replacement of most everything downstream from the tank. It is a known failure mode that resulted in Ram going back to the CP3 fuel pump, but Ford has stuck with it. Nothing like having to leave your truck and camper trailer a state away from home for a month while some random local shop does the repairs. Not a ton of fun, even without the expense-side of the equation.
 
Good choice and congrats!

I love the new F150 I have as a work truck, but if I were to buy for personal use, it would be a Toyota for sure. My only concern is longevity with the new generation compared to the outgoing. Twin turbo anything always gives me caution, especially when it’s going to be pulling/hauling a lot. Time will tell, but I hope they’ll be able to get 400k like the old ones with basic maintenance.
 
... but I hope they’ll be able to get 400k like the old ones with basic maintenance.

What little I've seen suggests that they can, but deferred maintenance will kill them. Don't wait for oil changes, better early than late.
 
What have you seen?

Same goes for everything.

The shop that works on my cars said (maybe I should said, "heard" instead of seen...) that they replaced head gaskets on Eco-Boost Fords and other turbo'ed vehicles that go much past 6,000 mile oil changes.

There was one ford engine they had a low opinion of. Think is was a small eco-boost, below 2 liters?
 
The shop that works on my cars said (maybe I should said, "heard" instead of seen...) that they replaced head gaskets on Eco-Boost Fords and other turbo'ed vehicles that go much past 6,000 mile oil changes.

There was one ford engine they had a low opinion of. Think is was a small eco-boost, below 2 liters?

I'm confused. What mechanically links delayed oil changes to blown head gaskets?
 
Two more points:

Gas tank size; I had a choice - and b/c I live sort of remote, I got the larger, 32gal tank. Nice to tanker fuel from the cheap stations.
460mi range.

Do we still refer to vehicles as “US” vs “Foreign”?
Wife’s 4Runner (which we also love) was indeed build in Japan. My Tundra was at least assembled in San Antonio, (someone else will have to say where the components were made.). And aren’t some of these companies part US/part foreign ownership?
My understanding is there is considerable blurring in “vehicle nationality” these days.
 
For the short time I owned a Tundra, I belonged to some Tundra chat boards. I think I was literally the only person there having problems. I stopped going to the boards very quickly, because every time I posted about a new problem, I was constantly accused of being a troll. The Tundra was not only the worst vehicle I've ever owned, it was so bad, I came to realize that the vehicles before the Tundra that I thought were bad, I had to admit were not that bad...at least compared to the Tundra. I wrote this on another post (and someone messaged me and said I was derailing the thread) so I copied that post to post here, then deleted it from the other thread (sorry, this is somewhat long):

God, where do I start? Well, at the beginning I guess lol, but a very long painful story! I'm a pathologist, but I also run a side hustle where I need a truck that can tow. Years ago, I bought a new Ram 2500 for this, and it worked well with one exception: the Hemi motor got HORRIBLE gas mileage when not towing (like 10 city, 15 highway) and I don't really like the idea of owning multiple vehicles. Probably didn't help that I had that truck decked out with bling, oversized tires, etc. After 150k miles on the Ram, the commercials for the Tundra being able to tow while ALSO getting exceptional gas mileage caught my eye, so I priced one out and traded in the Ram.
First day: drove the truck home in a light snow storm, the next day, I took it to the quarter wash to get the salt off, 35 miles on the odometer...as I'm spraying the truck, I'm noticing NUMEROUS, LARGE black spots all over the hood. The black spots are getting larger and larger as I wash...before I realize what was happening, one spot is almost the size of a dinner plate...IT WAS THE PAINT COMING OFF THE HOOD!!! Back to the dealership for a new paint job after 2 days of ownership!
A week later the paint job is done, I had just left the dealership, and only a couple miles away when suddenly my brakes give out! Thankfully, I pull to the side of the road without hitting anything, and back to the dealer the truck goes. Some rear brake sensor was faulty. 2 days later, I'm again leaving the dealership, when the trans light goes on...truck goes in limp mode...back to the dealership with less than 100 miles, and at this point it's been in my garage just 1 night. This time, they can't figure out what the problem is, and they had to fly in some Toyota expert from Texas. Replaced the entire trans. I had yet to tow anything with the dang thing (thankfully, this was occuring in winter, when my side hustle is dormant).
Got the truck back after over 2 weeks. I went about 2 more weeks when I went to close the driver's door, and the entire door interior trim came off! Back to the dealership. I get the truck back, and after a week or so, I happened to jump up on the tailgate (and btw, I'm 5'7" 160 lbs), AND THE ENTIRE TAILGATE CAVES IN!!! At this point, the dealership starts accusing me of "abusing the truck", and they point to the owner's manual that says the tailgate can only support 150 lbs!!! Seriously, look it up...Toyota made a, ahem, 'truck', with a tailgate rated for 150 lbs. As they are accusing me of "abusing the truck" I look out on their used car lot, and their premier vehicle (you know the one sitting up on elevated ramps) is MY PAST RAM TRUCK! I point out to them that my last truck looked brand new after 150,000 miles...so new, it was now their "premier" used truck! At least they stopped accusing me of "truck abuse". LOL.
For three months I endured problem after problem...the truck was literally at the dealer way more than it was in my garage (my wife made a sign in the garage that read, "Its been XXX days without a problem with the Tundra" and she had a piece of paper with "0" on it stuck over the XXX)...after about 90 days of ownership, I consulted with a lemon law attorney. But, a few days later and before I pulled the trigger with the attorney, a lady driving an SUV turned left in front of me on a 55 mph road. Buh bye Tundra POS! I should mention that this was all in 2015, btw. Maybe they are better now.

BTW, I've never worked for anything automotive, and I have no horse in the automotive race. I had good luck with that RAM 2500 maintenance-wise so I bought another one after the Tundra, but this new Ram is now a diesel. I still own this Ram, it just turned 106k miles this week, and it has not been back to the dealer once! Not.One.Single.Time. There are actually a couple of recalls on the truck, but I've decided the possibility of a "maintenance induced failure" is a greater risk than the risk of having problems for not having the recall done. It actually gets pretty good gas mileage too. I'm glad to hear the OP is liking it...I wouldn't wish my Tundra experience on my worst enemy!
I believe every word you say - and that bad experience can have a huge impression on anyone.
However, we do have to weigh that one lemon experience against the thousands of Tundras that successfully went for 200,000 miles and no one ever posted their good experience, right?
 
My Tundra was at least assembled in San Antonio…

One of the upscale Tundra models is the “1794 Limited Edition”. I asked ChatGPT what that might be about:

The Toyota Tundra 1794 Edition is named after the ranch where the Tundra plant is located in San Antonio, Texas. The ranch, established in 1794, serves as the inspiration for the name of this special edition of the Toyota Tundra pickup truck. The 1794 Edition is designed to evoke a sense of ruggedness and Texas heritage, reflecting the history and culture of the region where it is manufactured.”

Clever way to emphasize the U.S. - and Texas - connection!
 
I believe every word you say - and that bad experience can have a huge impression on anyone.
However, we do have to weigh that one lemon experience against the thousands of Tundras that successfully went for 200,000 miles and no one ever posted their good experience, right?
Well, less the Gen 1 models that had the frame rust issue, or the Gen 3 issue with with the excessive frame flexing especially with a heavy trailer load. Several validated reports of guys with 2018 models that couldn't get the tailgate closed because of the frame/bed panels being tweaked from the weight of the travel trailer on the hitch (but within Toyota GCWR specs). I think one of them even had the bed smash the back window on a panic stop. Every brand has its issues.
 
When it comes to trucks they are all extremely reliable these days. Sure there will be a lemon get through occasionally but I wouldn't let reliability factor at all into which brand I purchased. Find the one that best fits your wish list and that you enjoy driving.
 
Did you look at the hybrid?

I was initially looking for a 2022 or newer for under about $40k. That turns out to be a rare bird. Those close to that seem to be base models - SR and SR5 - and those don’t come with the iForce hybrid option.

To my understanding, the primary advantage to the hybrid is increased performance - nice to have, but not really needed for our use case. Doesn’t seem to do much if anything to fuel efficiency, and I don’t see any mention of regen braking, which would be nice in the hilly country we often frequent. If and when we decide to upgrade to a newer, more fully featured model - new or more likely used - we would still consider it though.
 
I believe every word you say - and that bad experience can have a huge impression on anyone.
However, we do have to weigh that one lemon experience against the thousands of Tundras that successfully went for 200,000 miles and no one ever posted their good experience, right?
Sure, and I asked about the tundra experience more because I know I was (mainly) an outlier than the norm. I say “mainly” because I still can’t believe there weren’t more problems with things like the tailgate and the 150 lbs limit. It was a bad experience but I partially blame myself because it screamed “cheap” or at least “not truck” quality.
 
I didn’t read everything but I know someone who had their Flex bought back by the manufacture and they really didn’t want to. Toyotas are great trucks in my experience.
 
Sure, and I asked about the tundra experience more because I know I was (mainly) an outlier than the norm. I say “mainly” because I still can’t believe there weren’t more problems with things like the tailgate and the 150 lbs limit. It was a bad experience but I partially blame myself because it screamed “cheap” or at least “not truck” quality.
I wondered if that truck was before the Lemon Law I read about, can’t even recall if that was a federal thing or state thing. Certainly fit the bill.
 
My Tundra did get good mileage. Better than either of my Chevy's. The only recall I recall was for the tailgate. You don't get "lemon law" action in most places unless the thing goes to the shop multiple times for the same problem.
 
...You don't get "lemon law" action in most places unless the thing goes to the shop multiple times for the same problem.
I remember the attorney telling me that too, but he also felt I had a case (or maybe they just tell you that, IDK) because there was a recall on the door panel coming off, yet it came off and my truck was supposedly fixed from the recall before it came off. Either way, in the end it didn't matter.
 
I started looking at Toyota trucks some years back when I needed to tow a big trailer (the portable hangar for my ultralight) as I already had a smaller Toyota truck, but I ended up buying a Dodge Ram 1500 instead. We liked it a lot, sold the truck when I sold the ultralight. A buddy has a newer Ram and that's even nicer.
 
I have to admit, we use my truck a lot as a cruiser with four people in it. The RAM is hands down the most comfortable truck we've ever had over the years.
 
Congrats on the new truck! I think that's a great way to trailer tow. I also switched from mostly Ford to a Japanese brand made in the US, but Nissan rather than Toyota. For whatever reason I was nervous about that initially, but I've been very happy with the Xterra, and now that Nissan doesn't make a mid sized body on frame SUV, I might be going to Toyota next.
 
I have a friend who was “given” a Nissan Titan on indefinite loan and it seems like a very nice truck.

Never owned a Nissan. Logical or not, I have a certain “brand loyalty” to Toyota. I place Toyota, Honda and Nissan - along with their “luxury” nameplates - in my “top tier” for reliability, with the others - Mazda, Subaru, Mitsubishi, etc. - right below them. I’ve also heard lots of good things about the Korean brands as well.
 
I have a friend who was “given” a Nissan Titan on indefinite loan and it seems like a very nice truck.

Never owned a Nissan. Logical or not, I have a certain “brand loyalty” to Toyota. I place Toyota, Honda and Nissan - along with their “luxury” nameplates - in my “top tier” for reliability, with the others - Mazda, Subaru, Mitsubishi, etc. - right below them. I’ve also heard lots of good things about the Korean brands as well.
When I was looking at trucks in '08, it was between the Titan and the F-150. I liked the way the Titan looked on the exterior, but the interior was a bit more "plastic-ey" than the F-150. On top of that, it was in the middle of the housing crash and fuel prices were up, no one was buying full-size trucks and SUVs. I ended up buying the F-150 SuperCrew Lariat with just about every available option (would have been a Platinum had that trim level existed at the time), which I bought for $12K under sticker (MSRP was $42K). The Nissan dealers wouldn't come off of sticker at $38-39K, so I passed on the Titan simply because they weren't adjusting to the market. I really liked their UtiliTrack bed system and wider, sliding back glass on the Titan Pro4X, but oh well. Worked out better in the end since the Titan just never gained much market acceptance and their re-sale was tougher.
 
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