mtuomi
En-Route
Pilot careers progress much faster nowadays. If I wanted, I could've done CP->regional in a year. My first job was flying passengers.
Looong XC flight for Commercial Pilot.... DONE!
- Thread starter AggieMike88
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Pilot careers progress much faster nowadays. If I wanted, I could've done CP->regional in a year. My first job was flying passengers.
Raymo
Pre-takeoff checklist
My logbook has a column for Solo flights. Not sure why.
CC268
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CC268
Mine does too. I use the ForeFlight logbook...
CC268
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There’s an endorsements section. It’s very easy. Instructor digitally signs with finger
BrianNC
En-Route
They wouldn't.
RussR
En-Route
Absolutely this. Any CFI who's been teaching a while has seen pilots who almost never fly without somebody else there to help, to give them confidence, to offer advice, etc. I know people who will hire a CFI to fly with them or bring a proficient pilot-friend on regular, routine flights because they don't have the confidence to do it themselves.
IMO, the regulation allowing "supervised PIC" for single-engine commercial requirements is one of the worst ideas ever.
Juliet Hotel
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I've spent lots of time in the right seat riding along with friends making flights they were afraid to attempt on their own. I knew a CFI who did not allow any of his students to do their own XC flight planning. He would decide where they were going on their XC's and do all the flight planning and prep work for them without them being involved in the process at all. I was friendly with a couple guys that got their private with him. They could fly just fine but were really scared to fly anywhere beyond about 100 miles from their home airport without another pilot with them. If they went further than that and lost the GPS, they'd have absolutely no idea how to find their way back.
That boggles my mind. My first flight after my PPL was a cross country from IL to Pittsburgh. I was ready to fly!
labbadabba
Pattern Altitude
Wait, you can have a CFI along and count it as a solo flight??? If that's the case, I need to massively revise my Solo PIC column...
dmspilot
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No.
RussR
En-Route
No, it's a specific exception for the commercial training that takes place of the solo requirement. But it has to be logged as such and, theoretically, the CFI is supposed to sit there and do nothing.
I have done this only once or twice, and yeah, I can't sit there and not say anything.
I have done this only once or twice, and yeah, I can't sit there and not say anything.
RussR
En-Route
Why would a CFI even want to do that? I am amazed, and appalled.
midwestpa24
Final Approach
I think this allowance was to facilitate those that pursue their multi-engine commercial and skip the single engine commercial. Kind of hard to find somewhere to rent a twin solo without a multi-engine license and experience.
labbadabba
Pattern Altitude
So, for my long instrument X/C it was over 250nm straight line with landings at 4 separate airports, and well over 300nm total. Would that count then even with a CFII on board?
RussR
En-Route
That is the case. And I have no inherent problem with the realities of twin rental. It works well for that purpose. But then it was added to the single-engine requirements as an option, and THAT is ridiculous. How many people are unable to rent a single-engine airplane solo?
midwestpa24
Final Approach
Probably an unintended consequence would be my guess.
RussR
En-Route
No, it was if I recall correctly, first added into the multiengine experience requirements for insurance reasons. Then later was specifically added into the single-engine requirements to match, although it didn't need to (no insurance reasons).
No.
If your CFI logged it as dual received and he was instructing you, you were not making all the decisions related to the flight and the requirements were not satisfied.
As has been mentioned already, the only reason the CFI is allowed to be on board is for satisfying insurance requirements when dealing with hard to insure airplanes (twins). If you are making this solo flight with the CFI onboard he cannot give you instruction, he can only sit there to satisfy the insurance company and say nothing.
Jim_CAK
Line Up and Wait
I was following this thread and reading 61.129 and now I am confused on the 100 nm day and night cross countries - 3(iii) and 3(iv). They are listed under the “20 hours of training that includes . . “
Does that mean an instructor has to be on board for each flight?
From 61.129
“(3) 20 hours of training on the areas of operation listed in §61.127(b)(1) of this part that includes at least—
(i) Ten hours of instrument training using a view-limiting device including attitude instrument flying, partial panel skills, recovery from unusual flight attitudes, and intercepting and tracking navigational systems. Five hours of the 10 hours required on instrument training must be in a single engine airplane;
(ii) 10 hours of training in an airplane that has a retractable landing gear, flaps, and a controllable pitch propeller, or is turbine-powered, or for an applicant seeking a single-engine seaplane rating, 10 hours of training in a seaplane that has flaps and a controllable pitch propeller;
(iii) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in daytime conditions that consists of a total straight-line distance of more than 100 nautical miles from the original point of departure;
(iv) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in nighttime conditions that consists of a total straight-line distance of more than 100 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(v) Three hours in a single-engine airplane with an authorized instructor in preparation for the practical test within the preceding 2 calendar months from the month of the test.”
Does that mean an instructor has to be on board for each flight?
From 61.129
“(3) 20 hours of training on the areas of operation listed in §61.127(b)(1) of this part that includes at least—
(i) Ten hours of instrument training using a view-limiting device including attitude instrument flying, partial panel skills, recovery from unusual flight attitudes, and intercepting and tracking navigational systems. Five hours of the 10 hours required on instrument training must be in a single engine airplane;
(ii) 10 hours of training in an airplane that has a retractable landing gear, flaps, and a controllable pitch propeller, or is turbine-powered, or for an applicant seeking a single-engine seaplane rating, 10 hours of training in a seaplane that has flaps and a controllable pitch propeller;
(iii) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in daytime conditions that consists of a total straight-line distance of more than 100 nautical miles from the original point of departure;
(iv) One 2-hour cross country flight in a single engine airplane in nighttime conditions that consists of a total straight-line distance of more than 100 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(v) Three hours in a single-engine airplane with an authorized instructor in preparation for the practical test within the preceding 2 calendar months from the month of the test.”
Yes, and they need to be giving you instruction.
woodchucker
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First off that seems ridiculous. The whole point in learning how to fly is to go somewhere! My first XC after getting my PPL was a $500 hamburger run to meet a friend 300 nm away. To an airport (KBOI) I had never been to, and on approach had radio difficulties such that another pilot was relaying tower transmissions. Flying XC is where you learn stuff through mistakes. It’s natural.
But in reality I think the FAA should encourage the long XC to be with a passenger. Not require but promote it. Probably a liability issue which I get. But flying with a non-pilot passenger adds realism and mission to the requirement.
Grum.Man
En-Route
The ones I don't get are the 2 hour cross countries with an instructor. I mean, I am an instrument rated private pilot and still need my instructor to do a 2 hour cross country in the day and night?? Either way I got it done over the weekend!
Jim_CAK
Line Up and Wait
I had read 61.129 a dozen times and did not realize that the instructor had to be on board until yesterday. I had those crossed off my list. I will re-do them but it does seem odd to require a CFI on board at this stage. I guess they want the CFI to validate your cross country planning and execution.
Juliet Hotel
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Not sure this was the intention of the requirement but IIRC when I did mine, we decided to do the trip with no navigation radios. GPS off, no VOR, no NDB. Just a windshield and a finger on a VFR chart. It's definitely a skill worth practicing if you haven't done it. Especially if you're going to be a commercial pilot working at the bottom end of the industry ladder where functioning nav radios are sometimes a bit of a luxury.
You need to re read it a few more times. You do not need an instructor onboard as long as you are solo. If you take anyone else with you, one of them must be an instructor.
Jim_CAK
Line Up and Wait
I am not talking about the long XC - 250 mile. I get that is solo or with an instructor and the student performs all PIC duties. What I am confused about is the day 100 nm and the 100 nm night XC. Those are listed under the 20 hours of training requirement.
Grum.Man
En-Route
You do in fact need an instructor on board for the day and night 2 hour cross country. You do not need one for the long cross country.
sorry, I was confusing your comment just as you point out.
Grum.Man
En-Route
Unless you are doing the flight at 50kts they will need to be longer than 100 nm.
Jim_CAK
Line Up and Wait
Yes - But I will do the return leg as well and plan each flight to be over 2 hours.
Kenny Phillips
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Think about the guy who buys a Pilatus or TBM; his insurance company may not allow him to fly it alone for fifty hours, or some other such restriction. The silent CFI then becomes worth every penny.