Jump starting a 'plane with a battery pack

Katamarino

Katamarino

Pattern Altitude
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
2,098
Location
YPJT
Display Name
Display name:
Katamarino
12V car jump start battery packs have been around a while. It turns out that there are 24V versions as well. In some of the locations I fly to, ground power is not available so I've been thinking about other options.

The below looks like an interesting option for my 24V 182:

It can be easily charged anywhere (which is not true of an aircraft battery) and is pretty portable. It' would not be a problem to carry this in the aircraft on my more remote trips.

One could connect it directly to the battery, which sits behind the rear baggage compartment and is quite easy to access, or one could connect it through the ground power connection using something like this: https://www.aircraftspruce.com.au/catalog/elpages/plugnjump.php

I can't think of any particular arguments against this. What think the assembled masses?
 
I carry an external 12V lithium battery. Apparently, if my battery dies, I can just connect this one to the main battery leads and it will start the plane. Have never used it, so not sure how well it would work.
Not sure what the advantage of using the ground power plug would be, so I did not spend $160.
 
Last edited:
Ground power plug keeps you from having to unload your baggage compartment, unscrewing the rear bulkhead-hat shelf and removing it, and undoing and removing the battery box top. On 182s at least.

It’s a little bit “un-fun” trying to re-install everything and reload the baggage compartment while the engine is running and the prop is blowing at ya (or trying to blow your stuff away.

For the ground power plug - give it a test start once to make sure the ship’s system is operational. 182 again.
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
For the ground power plug - give it a test start once to make sure the ship’s system is operational. 182 again.
Click to expand...

Am I correct in thinking that I should be able to start the engine with battery switch off, and start pack connected, if using the ground power connector?
 
If practical (and if you don't suspect a battery contactor problem) connect the pack to the battery. It's a known good electrical path (design-wise) to crank the engine. Ground power connections usually have longer cables and additional sources of resistance that might make starting more difficult.

I have no 24V experience, but I used a 12V 400 cranking amps pack to start the plane when a battery cell failed. Plus, with my battery being under the rear seat, the whole operation happened without leaving the pilot's seat.
That pack (and a tire inflator) are part of my XC fly-away kit.
 
Katamarino said:
Am I correct in thinking that I should be able to start the engine with battery switch off, and start pack connected, if using the ground power connector?
Click to expand...
In general, yes. But it will depend on how your aircraft is wired. However, if it is wired that way you could run into a secondary problem if your aircraft battery is not strong enough to latch the master relay once you've started the aircraft and turn the battery switch on.

As to battery packs, if you plan to buy a non-aviation spec'd one, at least compare the performance of the one you buy to one that is purpose built for aircraft. While it doesnt make as much difference for small recips, its something to keep in mind with turbines and large recips.

Also ensure your EPU recepticle is up to spec and the plug you use to connect to the aircraft proves a solid connection with minimal loss.
 
Katamarino said:
Am I correct in thinking that I should be able to start the engine with battery switch off, and start pack connected, if using the ground power connector?
Click to expand...
Probably not...like said depends on how it is wired.
It won't on my 1980 C172 24 volt.
The ground power connector only provides power to the bus bar and not to the battery for jump starts, on my aircraft.
When my battery is dead like Bell206 said it is dead and the contactor won't pull in to be able to even get the bus bar energized.
I have to connect the charger directly to the battery.
 
I like the idea.
That is a lot of lithium to carry around.
The first thing I’d assess is ‘how often do these melt down’ (catch fire) and under what circumstances?
Are there containment bags for it, can I get it out of the airplane quickly if needed?
Maybe this concern is for older models, I haven’t kept up.
 
My plane has no electrical system. Also no starter, so my needs are different.
I carry a 14.4 v 4000 20C Radio Control lithium battery with a 2 port USB socket.
It keeps my phone (Avare Nav device) and my handheld radio running for up to 6 hours.
 
Shepherd said:
My plane has no electrical system. Also no starter, so my needs are different.
I carry a 14.4 v 4000 20C Radio Control lithium battery with a 2 port USB socket.
It keeps my phone (Avare Nav device) and my handheld radio running for up to 6 hours.
Click to expand...
Do you carry one of these?
1725891573594.jpeg
 
Katamarino said:
Am I correct in thinking that I should be able to start the engine with battery switch off, and start pack connected, if using the ground power connector?
Click to expand...
Yes, I’ve done it. We have the same airplane, so I assume yours is the same
 
I have a set of the top ones. Tried starting the plane when the battery was acting up. Didn't work. Too much contact resistance or voltage drop in the wires. Those alligator clips don't have a lot of surface area to make contact.
Jumpstart pack across the battery worked first time, felt better than a brand new battery.
 
mandm said:
Something like this? Then you could connect it to a battery outside when needed.

Also wondering if you could use this port to connect a battery minder as well.
Click to expand...

@mandm I don’t know about Cessna, but I believe that the Piper plug takes the battery out of the circuit when it is used. So the answer to your question is “No” for Brand P.

-Skip
 
Last edited:
Katamarino said:
Am I correct in thinking that I should be able to start the engine with battery switch off, and start pack connected, if using the ground power connector?
Click to expand...
As mentioned above, it depends. Your POH should spell this out. For my 182 P, external power doesn't connect to the battery directly. So if I want to jump start it, I have to have the external power AND the battery switch on, or it won't charge the battery or crank the engine. Or just jump start it with cables connected directly to the battery. ( I had a bit of help from the POA on figuring this out ).

For me, I have a pair of regular car battery jumper cables in the plane that I'll put directly on the battery if I need a jump.
 
Some of the jumpstarter packs have electronics that shut them down if power is drawn abruptly; they have to be connected to a battery (weak or dead) first. Mine works like that.

I started my Hatz by clipping the jumpstarter to the battery side of the master relay (which was in the cockpit so easily accessible) and to ground.
 
I have an Earth X cable under the dash. Then a small lithium jump pack that will connect to the cable. I once jumped my Sportsman with it after a little too much time using the avionics on the ground. It allowed me to start it then remove the jump pack without getting out of my seat. Pretty cool.
 
Katamarino said:
Am I correct in thinking that I should be able to start the engine with battery switch off, and start pack connected, if using the ground power connector?
Click to expand...
As others have mentioned, I think most of them need the battery to be connected and to be a little bit hot, and they kinda want to be connected close to the battery. But if you can do that, I think they'd work fine. As far as fire risk goes, my experience with lithiums flying RC is that they are dangerous under 3 circumstances - 1) overcharging, 2) very heavy load or dead short, 3) puncturing the battery envelope. I've not heard of a battery bursting into flame by itself that wasn't damaged. (I don't know if 3 is caused by exposure to air, or the puncture shorting the internal plates, come to think of it.)

That said, if you're in a serious accident and the battery gets punctured, I'd absolutely expect it to catch fire and to be impossible to put out. I don't know how well they're protected against being punctured.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top