how to find single engine planes with electronic flaps

[Dan Thomas]

But the inside of my 1981 Cessna 185 wing had brackets for a flap motor.

It probably had a converted 182 wing. They're out there. Seen that several times.

 

[Sac Arrow]

I don't understand what the flap is about.

 

[flyingron]

There are more failure modes than the motor on Cessna electric flaps. There are position sensing micro switches and a bunch of piano wire and pulleys that move the back of the switch to stop the flaps at the desired position. I'm a fan of manual flaps.

Depends on which Cessna you are talking about. Some of them just have a switch that runs the flaps up when pushed up or down when pushed down.

Of course, on my plane, the flaps are hydraulic.

 

[labbadabba]

It's jarring to go to the Johnson Bar after having electric flaps, I went thru the same thing. But I've gotta say that I prefer the manual flaps. They deploy so much more quickly and you have a real tactile sense as to how your flaps are deployed.

 

[Jaybird180]

Electric, not electronic. And I like the Johnson Bar a lot! If I am correct, some early Mooneys had a Johnson Bar to raise/lower the landing gear!

-Skip

Yup, the "C" has Johnson bar gear. If ya have big hands be a little careful to prevent getting bitten by the seat-frame as you move the lever. I gave blood just to lower the gear.

Electric flaps became standard on the J model and afterwards.

 

[classicrock]

I rather like my electric flaps. Push the little switch down, the flaps go down; let to and they obediently stop. Pull the little switch up, they start back up; let go and they stop. It's easy to get exactly the amount of flaps that I want, and I tweak them on final as needed to nail the glideslope and speed.

Another great thing, they are easy to reach with a finger to raise while holding the throttle at Idle. No chance to accidentally raise the gear, it's way up at the top of the panel. On gusty days, or with strong crosswinds, flaps up after touchdown is the smart thing to do.

the above states very well why I like Electric flaps. does it mean I will make electric vs manual the primary criteria for renting/buying a plane? NO

 

[ejensen]

Electric, not electronic. And I like the Johnson Bar a lot! If I am correct, some early Mooneys had a Johnson Bar to raise/lower the landing gear!

-Skip

Liked my M20F with manual gear and manual hydraulic flaps. Two pumps for half flaps, four for all the way down.

 

[classicrock]

several individuals in this thread have talked about the electric flap switch not working in flight. now I have been trained with the Cessna 172 in PPL training to lower the flaps during preflight on the ground, then bring them up before taxing(its part of the checklist) so I am curious-is noone checking them during pre flight?or have several people just had the experience of their electric switch malfunctioning suddenly sometime after takeoff and in flight?

 

[MAKG1]

Well, to be fair, I caught an intermittent flap switch problem in a 182 during preflight, that could have happened in flight. It was a loose crimp that got jiggled just the right way in preflight.

The symptom was that it wouldn't go below 20 deg. Obvious what to do if it happens in flight. 182s can fly just fine with 20 deg flaps even on takeoff at high DA. It's an "approved" takeoff configuration.

The local A&P got his crimper and fixed in in 30 seconds, 28 of which consisted of contorting himself under the panel.

Keep in mind that more than 90% of my flight hours are with electric flaps. They serve their purpose. I don't care for the momentary 172M design, but the rest of them work well, if slow. It just means lifting the flaps on a short field landing is silly 'cause you'll be stopped before they have any effect.

 

[DesertNomad]

I am curious-is noone checking them during pre flight?or have several people just had the experience of their electric switch malfunctioning suddenly sometime after takeoff and in flight?

My Cessna flap failure was during an alternator failure so it didn't matter how well they worked during preflight. I went to an uncontrolled field with a 9000' runway and landed. That, and the slow deployment/retract time is why I prefer manual flaps.

 

[Pilawt]

is noone checking them during pre flight?or have several people just had the experience of their electric switch malfunctioning suddenly sometime after takeoff and in flight?

Assume the pilot cycles the flaps during preflight, then flies around making three landings at different airports. The chance of the failure occurring inflight instead of on the ground is still 75%. Maybe more, because the flap motor is working harder to extend the flaps with aerodynamic loads in flight, rather than in still air on the ground.

 

[Dan Thomas]

I don't care for the momentary 172M design, but the rest of them work well, if slow. It just means lifting the flaps on a short field landing is silly 'cause you'll be stopped before they have any effect.

Worse than that: the flaps generate mostly lift at 20° and mostly drag at 40°. It shows up in the stall speeds at those settings. If you retract them on landing to get more weight on the wheels, you'll actually get less as they pass through 20°. Useless. Give me manual flaps anytime.

 

[brian]]

Flaps on my Bo failed while retracted -- twice.

Mine had a limit switch fail with the flaps up. Just had to clean the 30 years or so of gunk out to restore to fling status.

Flew a piper 140 once with a Johnson bar flaps- what a hoot! I would likely wear out the bearings playing with the flaps. Thought I was a good candidate for an early mooney with the Johnson bar gear. But my eye caught an old bo....

My flaps take about 10 seconds or so to go one direction or another. Forever on final. What is nice is I can hit the switch and slowly re trim the pressure off...

 

[brian]]

Worse than that: the flaps generate mostly lift at 20° and mostly drag at 40°. It shows up in the stall speeds at those settings. If you retract them on landing to get more weight on the wheels, you'll actually get less as they pass through 20°. Useless. Give me manual flaps anytime.

Agreed. 4 Mississippis or so is mostly lift. At 10 Mississippis or so, I drop like a 172...

 

[mkosmo]

Worse than that: the flaps generate mostly lift at 20° and mostly drag at 40°. It shows up in the stall speeds at those settings. If you retract them on landing to get more weight on the wheels, you'll actually get less as they pass through 20°. Useless. Give me manual flaps anytime.

From the data I recall seeing, it was more like the increase in lift dropped off significantly past 20 while the drag spiked. It showed effectively same lift with less drag retracting through 20.

 

[Tarheelpilot]

I don't understand what the flap is about.

Funny

And I don't get it either. Hell all airplanes don't have flaps.

 

[Sluggo63]

If you retract them on landing to get more weight on the wheels, you'll actually get less as they pass through 20°. Useless. Give me manual flaps anytime.

That's not true. You'll still have less lift at 20° than you will at 40°, therefore you will still be adding weight on wheels, just not as much in proportion to the drag that you're losing.