How hard would it be to do this?

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EchoKilo

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EchoKilo
From the outset, I just want to say that this is likely a wild and crazy idea that would probably be impractical and unfeasible, but I still wanted to throw it out there and get the opinions of seasoned pilots on it.

Okay so, I work in Nashville, right. I work in hospitality. For those who don't know, Nashville is a BOOMING city. The tourism is through the roof. People coming for vacations, bachelor/bachelorette parties, live music, etc etc... People are always taking trolley tours around town, riding in party busses, and just having a big old time touring the city.

So..... my brain just hatched the idea of having a special airplane tour where people could book half-hour/hour-long flights over the city and surrounding areas. I'm talking about starting a full-fledged business with a small fleet of aircraft. I know there are places that give helicopter tours, but this would be done in Cessnas. I was thinking it would be a big hit with rich people who are in town doing weddings, birthday parties, Vanderbilt graduates, and just tourists in general.

I suppose the first things I'd want you guys to comment on are the practicalities and issues of doing something like this. Weather would certainly be the biggest issue and make it less practical. Also staying out of BNA airspace (I'd likely fly out of John C Tune). The planes would also have to be able to comfortably carry the weight of the passengers, so it would probably have to be like 206s. My idea was to have a shuttle that would pick guests up in town and drive them to the airport (or maybe not).

Is this a stupid idea? Has it been done before? This is obviously something I'll almost certainly never do, but it's just a fun thought, and perhaps there's a chance it could work. What do you think?
 
I’m sure flight schools in the area already offer intro flights around the city. So no, the idea isn’t stupid or impractical.
 
jordane93 said:
I’m sure flight schools in the area already offer intro flights around the city. So no, the idea isn’t stupid or impractical.
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Yeah, but you're talking about lessons though right?
 
Also, if there were anything like this in Nashville, I would know about it. I work at the nexus of it all. There is no talk or hear of anything like this being done around town. I think it would work.
 
Anything's possible, but that seems like a tough way to make a profit. Overhead will be way huge, you can only operate on nice days, and you have to set up a relatively sophisticated logistics operation to keep it running smoothly. You'd likely have to invest a quarter million and try to pay that back selling a product that costs a few hundred dollars.

I'm not suggesting that you don't do it, but you'll need one hell of a tight business plan to make a go of it. You'd do well to pick the ear of someone running an aerial tour business, and if you're really serious, maybe go work for one in the office for a year so you can learn the trade.
 
I looked at a similar venture years ago, sightseeing flights out of Marathon in the Keys. My research told me that not nearly as many people are interested in this kind of thing as I'd expected. A fleet of airplanes will likely not be necessary. One will do at first, and even at that the margins will be tight. Remember that to a large part of the population, small planes are dangerous puke buckets.

Just having the right product is not enough. You also have to have an outstanding marketing plan. That's where most entrepreneurs fail.
 
Knew of an operation in Atlanta that gave Stearman rides, and there was another one here in Birmingham. But then you're talking open cockpit and fair weather. I'd guess a couple FBOs/flight schools offer rides already. Most do.
 
Do the open biplane with two together under the blanket in the back seat tour
 
EchoKilo said:
I'm pretty sure there are helicopter tours. But I think planes would be better.
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Why do you believe planes would be better? Outside of cost savings, I don’t see any advantage.
 
Having lived in Nashville for three years, I'd guess this business would be very seasonal, as well as being weather dependent. It's been my observation that something like this tends to be most successful in areas that have spectacular scenery, and that does not describe Nashville.
 
EchoKilo said:
Yeah, but you're talking about lessons though right?
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Yea but it’s essentially the same thing. Take a Cessna up and give instruction around Nashville. What would you be offering that other schools don’t already offer?
 
Good luck,you need to do more research,of the area,airspace,and operating costs. The old saying is ,if you want to make a million in aviation start with two million. Again good luck.
 
FormerHangie said:
Having lived in Nashville for three years, I'd guess this business would be very seasonal, as well as being weather dependent. It's been my observation that something like this tends to be most successful in areas that have spectacular scenery, and that does not describe Nashville.
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Because flight schools don't just put out ads that say "Hey, we offer scenic aerial tours of the city". That's not what their business is for, and that's not what they do. And no tourist shows up to the city and says "hey, lets contact the local flight school and schedule an introductory lesson so we can see the city from the air". My business would literally put out brochures and flyers around town, in hotels, restaurants, etc. advertising our scenic aerial tours. We would take large parties, and would allow them to have some say as to where they want to fly and what they want to see.
jordane93 said:
Yea but it’s essentially the same thing. Take a Cessna up and give instruction around Nashville. What would you be offering that other schools don’t already offer?
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I agree. Which is why I get puzzled when tourists keep saying "Oh, Nashville is such a beautiful city." I've lived in middle TN all my life and I still can't see what the big deal about Nashville is. But...BUT!!..... People seem to love it, and love to party in it. It's the new "it" city. People are already partying on pedal taverns, buses, trolleys, and all sorts of other stuff. Why not offer a plane they could buzz over town in for an hour or so?
 
frfly172 said:
Good luck,you need to do more research,of the area,airspace,and operating costs. The old saying is ,if you want to make a million in aviation start with two million. Again good luck.
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I know. Like I said from the outset, this is something that will almost certain never happen. I'm just kind of spectulating and seeing how good of an idea it is, and how feasible it is. Seems like, according to the skepticism here, a business that's likely not to go far.
 
EchoKilo said:
People seem to love it, and love to party in it. It's the new "it" city. People are already partying on pedal taverns, buses, trolleys, and all sorts of other stuff. Why not offer a plane they could buzz over town in for an hour or so?
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Keep in mind that these things are kind of a fad and pass quickly, and the key aspect is "party." You can sell damned near anything if you can make it a party, but how much partying are you really going to get people to do in a 206?
 
Eric Gleason said:
Keep in mind that these things are kind of a fad and pass quickly, and the key aspect is "party." You can sell damned near anything if you can make it a party, but how much partying are you really going to get people to do in a 206?
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I don't know. I think people could dig it for 30 mins to an hour. I guess I wasn't necessarily gearing it towards partying people. Mainly just anyone who wants to go up. They walk through the hotel lobby and see a brochure that offers aerial tours of their favorite city. "Hey honey, we should do this while we're here!"

I guess you're right. Damn. Thought I had a good odea for a sec.
 
The legal stuff:
Aircraft on 100 hour inspection cycle - pilot offering their aircraft for commercial use.
Pilot required to be commercial certificate. - flying for hire
and possibly a 135 single pilot operator certificate. - I'm not certain ?

OK no,
91.147 (b) a letter of authorization is required. I do not know how difficult it is to get.
 
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EchoKilo said:
I'm pretty sure there are helicopter tours. But I think planes would be better.
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I think helicopters are actually better for sight seeing tours. They fly low and slow and have good outward visibility. All of that translates to great sight seeing. Look at this video and you will see what I mean.

 
As I am reading this, I get a call from the biplane rides over Atlanta company, I maintain the biplanes, they had 4 people buckled up for a ride, he taxis out and the push-to-talk switch quits working, so remember if trying to make a business of airplane rides, all of us here know things happen with airplanes when it is least wanted
 
Enough wet blankets.

How far along on the business case have you gotten? Figuring overhead should be easy. The FBO may or may not let you operate from the lobby. You may have to pay them. Hangar with an office would be ideal, as it would allow signage. You do NOT want to "meet them in the parking lot" as you will not get repeat business. Did you get an insurance quote yet? If you borrow the money for the airplane the interest is deductible -- but you have to make a profit for that to matter. How would you budget marketing? A brochure in a hotel lobby would compete with a million different activities. Would you shuttle customers from downtown or expect them to find Tune on their own?

Is this a sideline business or do you expect to live off of it? Your biggest market, I am thinking, would be sunset/night flights late weeknights and possibly during the day on weekends. Give ATC a call and find out their stance on generating a letter of agreement that gives you a standard flight corridor.

Good luck! When I lived in Nashville I used to love seeing it from the air. Especially when I was leaving.

There used to be an outfit in South Florida, I think, that had a Cherokee 6 outfit with a curtain and a bed in back, and advertised mile high adventures. Ick.
 
I'd love to see this succeed and wish you the best. Lots to consider, especially demand.
Also, please remember the 'half-hour to hour' flight will be a three-hour plus experience. Pickup at hotel, drive to airport, paperwork, preflight, flight, landing, pack up, back to hotel.
This makes it a half-day event, and it is a harder sell than just an hour.
Hope we're all wrong and you're wildly successful!
 
coloradobluesky said:
Do the open biplane with two together under the blanket in the back seat tour
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Those are the only tour only operations I've seen that look like they make $$ sense.

Also as a tour you're going to need a LOA from the Feds and random drug testing, which IMO is BS but government is going to government.

See here
https://www.faa.gov/about/office_or..._defined_in_14_CFR_part_91_Section_91_147.pdf

And here
https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2007-02-13/pdf/07-580.pdf
 
The guy who founded Fedex started it as a project in business school, he got a C+ on it with some snarky comment about how an idea has to be feasible to get a good grade. So not sure if I would let the naysayers get you down. Seems to me that people are coming out of the womb nowadays with a Facebook account and for every 1 person who wants to go up in the flying death machine there are 6 of his drunk buds who want to be part of the experience but are either too cheap or too drunk or too scared to fly. So find out a way to monetize their experience and find out a way to monetize the Facebook tie-in. maybe offer a way to Facebook live the flight. Maybe have a ground support area where they can watch the fellow flying live and drink beer, charge those guys $50 a pop, all the beer they can drink, while their friend is flying.
 
mscard88 said:
Knew of an operation in Atlanta that gave Stearman rides, and there was another one here in Birmingham. But then you're talking open cockpit and fair weather.
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There are at least 3 of those operations in the Atlanta area. A good way (I think) to supplement your hobby if you happen to own an open-cockpit biplane.
 
I am sure you could make a small fortune.


Provided, of course, you start with a large one.
 
The difference with FedEx was that it was a new model on an old business. This isn't that.

@EchoKilo, Please don't take all of this as naysaying. I think you may indeed have the seed of a good idea for a viable business. The responses you're seeing here are raising the kinds of questions that you'll have to answer in order to make a go of it. Small businesses that don't start with a solid business plan usually fail in a couple of years. Small businesses with a solid business plan often succeed.

The business plan almost always helps identify costs and considerations you hadn't thought of. When properly identified and planned for, they're merely problems that have solutions. When that's not the case, they often become roadblocks that are insurmountable.

Also, keep in mind that a business plan for something like this that requires a significant capital investment will often show you don't turn a profit for several years.
 
EchoKilo said:
.....I've lived in middle TN all my life and I still can't see what the big deal about Nashville is. But...BUT!!..... People seem to love it, and love to party in it.....
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Any chance you have a predators ticket connection? :). If they’re in town the weekend of the KY Dam flyin it would be a pretty easy flight over there to catch a game.
 
I'm not being facetious, and I don't want to sound mean.
What exactly is there to see in Nashville, from the air?
I have to spend a week or two there every year (sigh... in-laws) and fly into Tune. The area is nice, but it's not visually striking, like NYC or Chicago or San Francisco.
Have I missed something all these years?
 
Shepherd said:
I'm not being facetious, and I don't want to sound mean.
What exactly is there to see in Nashville, from the air?
I have to spend a week or two there every year (sigh... in-laws) and fly into Tune. The area is nice, but it's not visually striking, like NYC or Chicago or San Francisco.
Have I missed something all these years?
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I think what he it trying to tap into is the tourist mentality. It's not so much that there is something unique about Nashville, other than the fact that you might be waiting in line at Home Depot behind Alan Jackson (but that's a different story). Some measure of tourists -- wherever they go -- want to do something they've never done before. And maybe a small plane ride is that thing.
 
I guess.
Since I'm not impressed by most entertainers, or sports people, it's not something I would think about trying to do to make a living.
Except Gloria Winters. She kissed me on the cheek when I was a kid. She was just about the prettiest thing I had ever seen.
I still remember how it felt.
 
Ken Ibold said:
There used to be an outfit in South Florida, I think, that had a Cherokee 6 outfit with a curtain and a bed in back, and advertised mile high adventures. Ick
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Got one at LUK doing that. That better be a thick curtain between the pilot and the back.
 
Shepherd said:
I'm not being facetious, and I don't want to sound mean.
What exactly is there to see in Nashville, from the air?
I have to spend a week or two there every year (sigh... in-laws) and fly into Tune. The area is nice, but it's not visually striking, like NYC or Chicago or San Francisco.
Have I missed something all these years?
Click to expand...
Ken Ibold said:
I think what he it trying to tap into is the tourist mentality. It's not so much that there is something unique about Nashville, other than the fact that you might be waiting in line at Home Depot behind Alan Jackson (but that's a different story). Some measure of tourists -- wherever they go -- want to do something they've never done before. And maybe a small plane ride is that thing.
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What he said ^^
 
Shepherd said:
I'm not being facetious, and I don't want to sound mean.
What exactly is there to see in Nashville, from the air?
I have to spend a week or two there every year (sigh... in-laws) and fly into Tune. The area is nice, but it's not visually striking, like NYC or Chicago or San Francisco.
Have I missed something all these years?
Click to expand...

One unique thing about Nashville is the musical talent, and all of them trying to make it big. Even a Holiday Inn will have a band playing, and they are usually very good. So music is the big attraction there, Grand Ole Opery, etc. South of Nashville the terrain becomes hilly a bit mountainous, so might be fun to fly in that area. If you have time you could fly south to Huntsville AL and visit the Space Museum there, or fly into Moontown airport, a grass strip east of town. Your kind of airport Shep, homebuilts, antique planes, etc.
 
I agree that Nashville is not a spectacular area to see from the air. I was mainly just trying to offer something to the party people who want to do something extra cool and fun. "Hey guys, instead of partying on a wagon pulled by a John Deere tractor, let's go up in a plane!" I suppose Gatlinburg would be a better place to do something like this. But they probably already have it, and it was the Nashville tourism that I had in mind when I came up with this idea. Maybe some of these bachelorette parties would wanna go up in a plane over Nashville.

Also keep in mind that I'm just an ignorant 20 something kid speculating about pipe dreams. I don't even have my PPL yet. But I will probably have it here in a couple of months. It would take a lot of time and money on my part to have everything in order to even be able to do this.
 
mscard88 said:
One unique thing about Nashville is the musical talent, and all of them trying to make it big. Even a Holiday Inn will have a band playing, and they are usually very good. So music is the big attraction there, Grand Ole Opery, etc. South of Nashville the terrain becomes hilly a bit mountainous, so might be fun to fly in that area. If you have time you could fly south to Huntsville AL and visit the Space Museum there, or fly into Moontown airport, a grass strip east of town. Your kind of airport Shep, homebuilts, antique planes, etc.
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So.... a good place to fly on instruments..????? :rolleyes:
 
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