Grounded for not talking

L J Donelson

L J Donelson

Pre-takeoff checklist
Joined
Jun 6, 2021
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366
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KHUA
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Display name:
L J Donelson
I won't be naming names or places, but two weeks ago, a business meeting with some important customers scheduled for today landed in my inbox. I accepted it and considered making the trip worthwhile without a hotel stay. It's a 4-hour drive one way, and the meeting was scheduled for at least 3 hours, ending just before lunch. An early rise, drive, meet, and then drive home would be a long day. What about flying? Sure enough, I log in to the club reservations calendar, and for the first time I can remember in ages, an A/C is available all day! I checked, and it's well within the 100 hours, and there are no visible squawks. I booked it!

Finally, all those lessons and hours have been building since my check-ride, and I'm going to get to do exactly what I said I was taking lessons for—flying to a business meeting! Life is good.

I've been watching the weather for the past week. All the forecasts looked great. Life is good, and the excitement is building!

I sat down Monday evening and worked out routes. I studied my notes on how to program the VORs and the GPS just so I could have the full x-ctry experience, just like during training. Life is good, and the excitement is building. I'm going to fly to KXXX on Wednesday!

I get up early this morning and I verify the weather - amazing! I load everything in the truck and while I drive out to the field I call 1-800-WXBrief for a full weather check. Winds at 055 are light and variable all day. I arrive 1/2 an hour before sunrise and get pre-flighted and ready. Life is good, the excitement is building, let's go flying!

I start up engine, fires right up first thing on a cool morning, and the fan on the front is spinning. It sounds fantastic! Power on the avionics master switch and start listening to AWOS while I program the flight plan into the 430. LIFE IS GOOD! The excitement is building. LET'S GO!

I key the mic for the tower, and I hear myself clearly, but they don't hear me. I recheck frequencies and press, and nothing happens. I change radios and press again, and nothing happens. I pressed a little harder, and when I pulled my thumb up...
PTT Switch.jpg


You know that moment when you realize all your dreams, hard work, planning, and preparation are for naught? Yep, that's me right there, realizing I ain't gonna fly today.

Of course, the shocking reality of not making the customer meeting struck pretty hard right after that first dream crusher. But dang, for a $20 switch, everything changed!

The customer understood, my team asked a few questions, but they got over me not being there pretty quickly - I've trained them well and they handled everything fine.

I'm still crushed I didn't get to fly today.
 
L J Donelson said:
I won't be naming names or places, but two weeks ago, a business meeting with some important customers scheduled for today landed in my inbox. I accepted it and considered making the trip worthwhile without a hotel stay. It's a 4-hour drive one way, and the meeting was scheduled for at least 3 hours, ending just before lunch. An early rise, drive, meet, and then drive home would be a long day. What about flying? Sure enough, I log in to the club reservations calendar, and for the first time I can remember in ages, an A/C is available all day! I checked, and it's well within the 100 hours, and there are no visible squawks. I booked it!

Finally, all those lessons and hours have been building since my check-ride, and I'm going to get to do exactly what I said I was taking lessons for—flying to a business meeting! Life is good.

I've been watching the weather for the past week. All the forecasts looked great. Life is good, and the excitement is building!

I sat down Monday evening and worked out routes. I studied my notes on how to program the VORs and the GPS just so I could have the full x-ctry experience, just like during training. Life is good, and the excitement is building. I'm going to fly to KXXX on Wednesday!

I get up early this morning and I verify the weather - amazing! I load everything in the truck and while I drive out to the field I call 1-800-WXBrief for a full weather check. Winds at 055 are light and variable all day. I arrive 1/2 an hour before sunrise and get pre-flighted and ready. Life is good, the excitement is building, let's go flying!

I start up engine, fires right up first thing on a cool morning, and the fan on the front is spinning. It sounds fantastic! Power on the avionics master switch and start listening to AWOS while I program the flight plan into the 430. LIFE IS GOOD! The excitement is building. LET'S GO!

I key the mic for the tower, and I hear myself clearly, but they don't hear me. I recheck frequencies and press, and nothing happens. I change radios and press again, and nothing happens. I pressed a little harder, and when I pulled my thumb up...
View attachment 132669


You know that moment when you realize all your dreams, hard work, planning, and preparation are for naught? Yep, that's me right there, realizing I ain't gonna fly today.

Of course, the shocking reality of not making the customer meeting struck pretty hard right after that first dream crusher. But dang, for a $20 switch, everything changed!

The customer understood, my team asked a few questions, but they got over me not being there pretty quickly - I've trained them well and they handled everything fine.

I'm still crushed I didn't get to fly today.
Click to expand...
That's a bummer after all the anticipation.
Did it not have dual PTT/jacks?
 
Good old hand mike ftw. I use it a lot when the intercom was on the fritz a few years ago.
 
While PTT can just go belly up, they usually provide some warning. Sounds like your club is a just fly it until it is broken operation - too bad.
 
Bummer. Thanks for sharing the story.

Always have an alternate (like extra time in this instance) so you’re not forced to miss an appointment or make a dangerous decision.
 
I’m surprised there were not jacks on the RHS

I picked up my plane once, afterhours from the avionics shop - and sure enough - they mucked up something and it went unnoticed. I flew it home with the headset plugged into the other side. Wasnt an issue. Fixed easily the next day when one of the “roaming” maintenance techs went by.
 
I still carry a hand mike,and I also carry a P2 from sportys. Was grounded a few times with a radio problem untill I got the portable.
 
One reason I like my uncontrolled field... radio on the fritz? Go NORDO. :)

But yeah, we've all had highly anticipated flights get cancelled at the last minute for maintenance issues.
 
frfly172 said:
I still carry a hand mike,and I also carry a P2 from sportys. Was grounded a few times with a radio problem untill I got the portable.
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Admittedly been looking at P2's for a while. Now it's moving up on the priority list.
 
Good choice on staying on the ground, but for the future, have the land line phone numbers written down for the appropriate airports and use the cell phone. That is todays option.
Not a bad idea for a regular preflight preparation, in case the electronics go bad in flight, that has happened to me before cell phones.

The club stores the handheld on the mike clip installed at the factory, cord looped and secured with a small rubber band. Unplug the PTT, remove the band or simply break it, and good to go.

A couple of us had shared ownership hand helds.
 
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Rgbeard said:
I’m surprised there were not jacks on the RHS

I picked up my plane once, afterhours from the avionics shop - and sure enough - they mucked up something and it went unnoticed. I flew it home with the headset plugged into the other side. Wasnt an issue. Fixed easily the next day when one of the “roaming” maintenance techs went by.
Click to expand...

Yes, there was a set on the other side. As PIC I deemed that not a good practice for a x-ctry passing thru several Class C and in ATL TRACON. If I had already departed and it broke then it would have been a backup for getting home, but having not even moved it was a no go for me.
 
Clip4 said:
While PTT can just go belly up, they usually provide some warning. Sounds like your club is a just fly it until it is broken operation - too bad.
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I flew same plane on the Thursday prior with zero issues.
 
L J Donelson said:
I flew same plane on the Thursday prior with zero issues.
Click to expand...
Ignore him. He likes to pretend like none of his equipment could possibly fail. He’s the one that’s wrong.
 
david.h said:
Good old hand mike ftw. I use it a lot when the intercom was on the fritz a few years ago.
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That's all I ever used "a few years ago", where "few" means about 50 years.
I don't recall seeing a hand mic for quite a while now. I"m sure they exist but not in any planes I have been in the past few decades.
 
L J Donelson said:
Yes, there was a set on the other side. As PIC I deemed that not a good practice for a x-ctry passing thru several Class C and in ATL TRACON. If I had already departed and it broke then it would have been a backup for getting home, but having not even moved it was a no go for me.
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Get some time in the right seat so you could just sit over there and fly.
 
donjohnston said:
I used my plane many times for work trips. My work did not allow for not being there on time. So I always had either a provisional airline ticket or left early enough that I could drive. Never missed a start time in 20 years.
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Been doing the same for years. We have a family wedding coming up. Airplane scheduled, refundable airfare purchased. Rental cars ready in both destinations.
 
frfly172 said:
I still carry a hand mike,and I also carry a P2 from sportys. Was grounded a few times with a radio problem untill I got the portable.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't admit that to the FAA, unless you do some paperwork before hand.

Think inoperative installed equipment.
 
I thought it was pretty standard to have a hand mic?? All of my planes have had them, but I can't recall if they are on the MMEL list. As to what I think per the OP is a lower time pilot, flying a plane in busy airspace with any degraded equipment is unnecessarily complicating the flight. Flying from the right seat without significant right seat time is a bad idea. It is not as easy as it looks. ALL the muscle memory is wrong. I think a good call flying another day, and a really good reason to get your own plane if life allows.

Mic.jpg
 
Rockymountain said:
I thought it was pretty standard to have a hand mic?? All of my planes have had them, but I can't recall if they are on the MMEL list. As to what I think per the OP is a lower time pilot, flying a plane in busy airspace with any degraded equipment is unnecessarily complicating the flight. Flying from the right seat without significant right seat time is a bad idea. It is not as easy as it looks. ALL the muscle memory is wrong. I think a good call flying another day, and a really good reason to get your own plane if life allows.

View attachment 132675
Click to expand...
 
yes for hand mic and also a backup radio, you can also use your mobile phone for both takeoff and landing too.
 
No way you can count on a rental for reliable transportation for work purposes, unfortunately. Just too many ways for availability to get derailed, and too many constraints on quick repair.
 
geezer said:
Good choice on staying on the ground, but for the future, have the land line phone numbers written down for the appropriate airports and use the cell phone. That is todays option.
Not a bad idea for a regular preflight preparation, in case the electronics go bad in flight, that has happened to me before cell phones.
Click to expand...
One of my students was on a cross country when his radio failed just before departure from a towered airport. I gave him the tower phone number, but when he called for take off clearance, it was denied. The tower operator said the cell phone was not legal for maintaining two-way radio communication inside the Class D.

We had to use another airplane to get him home.
 
Ed Haywood said:
No way you can count on a rental for reliable transportation for work purposes, unfortunately. Just too many ways for availability to get derailed, and too many constraints on quick repair.
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I believe he said it was a club airplane. You might expect it to be a bit more reliable than many rentals.
 
Squawk 7600 & launch ... I don't see the problem! :rockon:

:joke:
 
For want of a nail the shoe was lost;
For want of a shoe the horse was lost;
For want of a horse the battle was lost;
For the failure of battle the kingdom was lost—
All for the want of a horse-shoe nail.
 
mandm said:
yes for hand mic and also a backup radio, you can also use your mobile phone for both takeoff and landing too.
Click to expand...
Technically you can't. If the radio is "installed equipment" you can,however, do that with a logged entry (which the pilot can usually perform) and a placard labelling the radio as inop.

Ninety nine percent of the time you can get away with the shortcut, until you have an accident that was blamed on the faulty radio and then it can become a certificate action.
 
Gilbert Buettner said:
One of my students was on a cross country when his radio failed just before departure from a towered airport. I gave him the tower phone number, but when he called for take off clearance, it was denied. The tower operator said the cell phone was not legal for maintaining two-way radio communication inside the Class D.
Click to expand...
I think that is related to the need to have clearances, ATC communications and such recorded.
 
dbahn said:
Technically you can't. If the radio is "installed equipment" you can,however, do that with a logged entry (which the pilot can usually perform) and a placard labelling the radio as inop.

Ninety nine percent of the time you can get away with the shortcut, until you have an accident that was blamed on the faulty radio and then it can become a certificate action.
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I didn't know the radio caused the plane to fly or not fly under the laws of physics.
 
I bought one similar to this after my PTT switch failed after leg one of a multi leg/day trip at KIWS. I used hand mic for the rest of leg one. It is still in the plane in case the PTT fails again.
 
dbahn said:
Technically you can't. If the radio is "installed equipment" you can,however, do that with a logged entry (which the pilot can usually perform) and a placard labelling the radio as inop.
Click to expand...
I was flying from Kalamazoo to Central Wisconsin Airport when I realized I had lost my ability to transmit on either one of the installed radios. I could receive just fine. Over Muskegon, I was able to contact Muskegon Approach with my Icom handheld and advise them that I could receive, but not transmit with the installed radios, and would soon be out of range of the handheld. They advised me to acknowledge calls by squawking ID.

I was able to continue my trip over Lake Michigan by squawking ident to show I'd received ATC messages from Minneapolis Center, and when I was within range of CWA tower, I used the handheld for landing clearance.
 
We were flying from Ontario to Atlanta one night, probably 1998, wife and 3kids in the back of our 441. We had a late departure and customs was closed at FTY, our home base. We stopped in Toledo, I think, to clear customs. By then it was getting late, boys 3-4 are getting grumpy. We leave Toledo and climb out to the low flight levels. Clear pretty night, great night to fly! One of the boys came up front for some reason, and I later figured out he had stepped on the cord for the hand mic! I’m blissfully buzzing along on this lovely evening when I realized that the radios were unusually quiet. I could receive or transmit! I finally figured out the mic cord was pulled out ever so slightly and it was not allowing any radio communications.
Plugged it in firmly, contacted ATC, they were concerned, but no harm, no foul.
 
We were flying from the American side of Sault Ste.Marie to the Canadian side when our PTT stuck in the "talk" position.
I used a pocket knife to remove the button from the right hand yoke and move it to the pilot yoke while Leslie flew in circles. We continued on to Anchorage and then back to Florida like that.
 
You can use your telephone. Work out a plan with the tower before hand, then use and let them practice light signals. Unless of course you have that restriction on your medical. Worked to get a student out of a controlled field to uncontrolled home field. His was stuck in the transmit position. So had him select com 2 on the audio panel. There was no com 2 installed, so that kept him from blocking the frequency. Then he could hear on com 1.

Plan was to taxi A to runway 36. Point the airplane at tower and turn on landing light when ready to taxi. Green light from tower, and backup instruction on com1, taxi to 36. Do run up and point plane at tower when ready for take off and turn on landing light. Green light and good to take off. Headings worked out on phone conversation.
 
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