Daughter wants a fun car, dad wants something more practical.

[Grum.Man]

Honestly, I would be OK with that except she doesn't like how it looks. Says It looks like a shoe. She is a very picky person. I am actually thinking Ford Maverick. Tows up to 4000 pounds. All wheel drive. Has 5 seat belts. Gets 29 MPG but amazingly has 250 hp, 277 ft-lbs torque. 8 speed tranny. Well Under $30K. And I still have x-plan pricing.
As for the 'Vette, I don't think that I would fit in them and I am told that they are a bit$h to work on.

Well there is a plot twist! The Maverick is probably the best value out but it certainly isn't going to be fun! lol. I wanted one pretty bad when they first launched but you couldn't get one unless you paid 10k or more above sticker. The only reason I wanted one was because it was a cheap practical car so wasn't willing to pay more. If we are taking fun off the table the new Chevrolet Trax is hard to beat value wise. They are very nice looking and well equipped cars for the money.

 

[Morgan3820]

If she doesn't need a ton of space, get a Ford Mustang. Plenty of those available used under $20K, with manual trans (if desired), and the EB 4-banger is no slouch with over 300HP. No reason one wouldnt last for 200K with proper maintenance.

Camaro is a competing option, but the blind spots/visibility is terrible compared to the Mustang, imo.

I just sent her a link to one. We’ll see how that’s received. But I have to admit maybe I’ll go get one for myself. There are lots of them with manual transmissions and 300 hp out of the V6. It is pretty sweet. Plus it’ll fit my larger frame. Much better than a Miata will

 

[Cricket1]

While Honda and Toyota's CVT's are probably better than Nissans (a VERY low bar to hurdle), the issue with an older used car with a CVT rears its ugly head when it needs fixed. Nissan CVT's are not repairable in any way, the only option is a brand new one, so $4k+. While I bet the Honda and Toyota CVT's will last longer than the Nissans, when they go poof, they go poof and set your wallet on fire.

 

[FormerHangie]

She rejected that as ugly also. Which it is

So, maybe you should be asking her instead of us.

 

[FormerHangie]

I just sent her a link to one. We’ll see how that’s received. But I have to admit maybe I’ll go get one for myself. There are lots of them with manual transmissions and 300 hp out of the V6. It is pretty sweet. Plus it’ll fit my larger frame. Much better than a Miata will

I rented a V6 Camaro from Budget and took it to a track day. The visibility out of it isn't great, but it drives wonderfully, that V6 engine sings at 6500 rpm, and it feels very planted on the track.

 

[Baked Potato]

I rented a V6 Camaro from Budget and took it to a track day. The visibility out of it isn't great, but it drives wonderfully, that V6 engine sings at 6500 rpm, and it feels very planted on the track.

Is it normal to see rental cars on the track?

 

[FormerHangie]

Is it normal to see rental cars on the track?

It's not common, but when you get the need for speed and you don't have a suitable car of your own, you do what you have to do.

It's much better to have your own car, with upgraded brake pads and fresh brake fluid, but you can make a rental car work if you don't push it too hard. I once got a rental Mustang GT that had terrible rear tires, could only use the throttle in a straight line, which was frustrating.

 

[FastEddieB]

Just remember:

Miata
Is
Always
The
Answer

Even better if your can find one with a V8!

 

[Daleandee]

Even better if your can find one with a V8!

The problem with that one is that it would keep me standing in front of a judge ...

 

[Grum.Man]

I rented a V6 Camaro from Budget and took it to a track day. The visibility out of it isn't great, but it drives wonderfully, that V6 engine sings at 6500 rpm, and it feels very planted on the track.

I had a V6 Camaro for a loaner car once. You get used to the visibility pretty quickly, it's not really much worse than most other coupes. The high belt line makes it feel worse than it actually is. After a day it was a non issue. I had a 95 Z28 in high school and that V6 would spank it and even better with the 1le package. Reality is I would rather save a bit longer and get the V8. The car is a toy after all so if you are getting an impractical toy it might as well be the ultimate one.

 

[Lowflynjack]

I had a V6 Camaro for a loaner car once. You get used to the visibility pretty quickly, it's not really much worse than most other coupes. The high belt line makes it feel worse than it actually is. After a day it was a non issue. I had a 95 Z28 in high school and that V6 would spank it and even better with the 1le package. Reality is I would rather save a bit longer and get the V8. The car is a toy after all so if you are getting an impractical toy it might as well be the ultimate one.

I do love my impractical toys!! I had a Camaro SS and it was a blast. I know have a Corvette and it's even more fun! Always wanted one, but I miss having a truck sometimes.

 

[Grum.Man]

I do love my impractical toys!! I had a Camaro SS and it was a blast. I know have a Corvette and it's even more fun! Always wanted one, but I miss having a truck sometimes.

I still like the C5 Zo6. Every now and then one pops up for sale near me in the color I like and I get sorely tempted to buy it. Then my practical side kicks in and talks me out of it. Maybe one day!

 

[Lowflynjack]

I still like the C5 Zo6. Every now and then one pops up for sale near me in the color I like and I get sorely tempted to buy it. Then my practical side kicks in and talks me out of it. Maybe one day!

I'm glad I bought mine and I do love it, but doesn't make a whole lot of sense! I'll get it out of my system and go back to a truck.

 

[Half Fast]

I had a V6 Camaro for a loaner car once. You get used to the visibility pretty quickly, it's not really much worse than most other coupes. The high belt line makes it feel worse than it actually is. After a day it was a non issue. I had a 95 Z28 in high school and that V6 would spank it and even better with the 1le package. Reality is I would rather save a bit longer and get the V8. The car is a toy after all so if you are getting an impractical toy it might as well be the ultimate one.

When my job had me traveling to Dallas twice a month, I got to know the guy who ran the airport Avis. I'd give him a heads up whenever I was coming and he'd fix me up with a Camaro or a Mustang or a Challenger or a Charger. I liked them all, but the hemi V8 Dodges were my favorites.

I do love V8s, but I ended up buying a V6 Challenger as a daily commuter, and while it's not quite as quick as the V8 version I think it handles a bit better; the heavier engines tend to create a bit of understeer. And even that little V6 is plenty quick. When I was doing a 40-mile one way commute, I wanted the better fuel economy. When I stopped doing that long drive, I put on wider rims with a set of Mickey Thompsons and now it corners like it's on a rail.

The key that's made all these cars better than their predecessors is the electronic transmission. Having 8 speeds lets the engine stay near max HP when accelerating.

 

[Ted]

Even better if your can find one with a V8!

I'd considered a V8 Miata instead of building the Cobra (that would've been done quicker) but the 302 seemed like it'd upset the balance vs. the 4-cylinder. The 4.0L out of the Land Rover would be a better fit and wouldn't add much weight in the front.

Incidentally, if I could do the Cobra over again, I think I would've made a 302-based block instead of 351 based, and a T-5 instead of a TKO. That combo would've saved about 80 lbs, with most of that towards the front. Bonus points for an aluminum block 302.

When my job had me traveling to Dallas twice a month, I got to know the guy who ran the airport Avis. I'd give him a heads up whenever I was coming and he'd fix me up with a Camaro or a Mustang or a Challenger or a Charger. I liked them all, but the hemi V8 Dodges were my favorites.

I do love V8s, but I ended up buying a V6 Challenger as a daily commuter, and while it's not quite as quick as the V8 version I think it handles a bit better; the heavier engines tend to create a bit of understeer. And even that little V6 is plenty quick. When I was doing a 40-mile one way commute, I wanted the better fuel economy. When I stopped doing that long drive, I put on wider rims with a set of Mickey Thompsons and now it corners like it's on a rail.

The key that's made all these cars better than their predecessors is the electronic transmission. Having 8 speeds lets the engine stay near max HP when accelerating.

This is a huge point, and something that I appreciate more as I get older. Back in my Jaguar days, there was a strong divide between the V12 and the 4.0L I6 fans for exactly this reason. Both of the engines were heavy, but the 4.0L was something around 200 lbs lighter, and actually had a really nice torque curve with its undersquare, long stroke configuration (both engines had the same bore). End result with gearing differences was the 4.0L would tend to be a little faster off the line and turn better, but the V12 would pull away at highway speeds.

For the kind of driving I was doing at the time (lots of long highway trips) the V12 was a real joy, and I'm glad that I owned those cars especially as they get rarer and more expensive. I still miss them and never got to build one variation I wanted - a low boost twin supercharged variant with a fabricated criss-cross intake running on E85 with the stock 11.5:1 compression. But, that I6 would make a more balanced and better track machien - not that a 4,000 lb grand touring car with suspension out of the 70s is ever going to be that fantastic in turns.

 

[Half Fast]

This is a huge point, and something that I appreciate more as I get older.

Track days and road racing will make you much more sensitive to handling characteristics. You'll start to feel the difference in a 1 or 2 PSI change in a tire.

Doing anything with the RX over the winter?

 

[Ted]

Track days and road racing will make you much more sensitive to handling characteristics. You'll start to feel the difference in a 1 or 2 PSI change in a tire.

A lot of the appreciation also comes from looking at more than horsepower numbers, something that (like many kids) I did more of when I was a kid.

Doing anything with the RX over the winter?

Yes. I haven't gone through the carburetor yet, but that's the first thing on the list to try to get rid of the issue I'm having at the top of the primaries. At this point it is something fuel related, it's just a matter of tracking down what exactly - and the carb was really gunked up when I rebuilt it. It needs new rotors all around (and going through the calipers too). Functional but they're showing signs of hot (gee, wonder why? ).

The real goal is to get some Lemons races in this year (as has always been the plan), especially since the track where I was doing track nights is now shutdown permanently, and I'm not sure where or if Track Night in America will find a new home near me. So from there it will be the safety items that Lemons requires, which I'm still missing some of. I will probably also have to tilt the seat back a bit more to get my helmet low enough for the safety requirements relative to the roll bar and the roof - the RX being on the smaller size for someone my height.

I need a proper day to devote to the carb rebuild, which is usually Sundays when my wife's at work and I take the kids to the babysitter. That was going to be yesterday, but my son wanted to stay and have a shop day with dad. Rebuilding a Nikki carb is well above his capability at this point and would be boring, so when he wants to stay I accept less progress and enjoy the fact that he's there.

 

[Zeldman]

Found a little barebones Kia Rio sedan. took what we could get!

Back in the winter of '99-'00 I got stuck in Fairbanks without a job. I ended up working for a car rental agency working on the cars. The Kia Rio was the super cheap rental. One was parked and got hit by a running moose. The moose back up a couple steps and ran off. The car went to the junkyard, totaled.

But those cheap little cars were the only ones that started right up after being parked outside all night at -40 without being plugged in.!! Plus they handled the snowy roads better than the Kia Sportage 4WD.

 

[Salty]

I rented a V6 Camaro from Budget and took it to a track day. The visibility out of it isn't great, but it drives wonderfully, that V6 engine sings at 6500 rpm, and it feels very planted on the track.

Boy, that would have been bad had you wrecked it. Unlikely any of your insurance would have covered off road use.

 

[kmacht]

I had a 2009 MINI S. I will never own another BMW product. That thing began self destructing at about 80k and every repair was $1000 minimum. It finally broke the timing chain and punched a valve and I sold it for scrap.

Avoid MINIs unless you plan to unload it around 72,000 miles.

As I said in my post, if interested in a mini you need to avoid the earlier years and also be comfortable doing maintenance yourself. A 2009 R56 mini with either the turbo or super charger are not reliable at all. The newer Gen 3 minis (2016+) are completely different and just as reliable as any other car out there.

 

[Half Fast]

The newer Gen 3 minis (2016+) are completely different and just as reliable as any other car out there.

Maybe. Maybe not. I have zero faith in BMW / MINI designs based upon painful and expensive experience. I will never own another BMW product.

 

[Skip Miller]

If she doesn't need a ton of space, get a Ford Mustang.

Older Mustangs are absolutely crap in snow or other slippery weather. Caveat emptor!

-Skip

 

[MauleSkinner]

I mean, we took the Miata on our honeymoon and packed a week's worth of stuff in it, and I used to use it for my weekly grocery shop. It holds more than you'd expect but it is small for sure.

How much “stuff” does one need to pack for a honeymoon?

 

[Half Fast]

How much “stuff” does one need to pack for a honeymoon?

“A loaf of bread, a jug of wine, and thou.”

 

[Ted]

Maybe. Maybe not. I have zero faith in BMW / MINI designs based upon painful and expensive experience. I will never own another BMW product.

You’re missing out! BMWs are great, even in snow!



A good friend has a newer (I forget the exact year) 3-cylinder Mini. It’s been pretty reliable overall and it’s a hoot to drive. Like the RX-7, it’s well balanced, albeit not a powerhouse. But you can keep your right foot buried, and that turbo 3 is really a sweet little engine.

 

[FormerHangie]

Boy, that would have been bad had you wrecked it. Unlikely any of your insurance would have covered off road use.

You can buy track day insurance, which I did when I used a rental car. With my GTI, I don't, it's about an $19K car and I can cover that. When I take the Cayman out to the track I will insure it, that's too big of a hit.

I did four track night events (They're actually afternoons and evenings) last year, saw one car bend sheet metal, one side was badly scraped up, likely from a tirewall. Would it surprise you if I told you it was a Mustang?

 

[asicer]

Maybe. Maybe not. I have zero faith in BMW / MINI designs based upon painful and expensive experience. I will never own another BMW product.

Well if it makes you feel any better, your R56 Mini was part Peugeot as I recall.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Older Mustangs are absolutely crap in snow or other slippery weather. Caveat emptor!

-Skip

So is pretty much every RWD sports car, lol. At least the limited slip will be of a tiny amount of solace.

 

[SkyChaser]

How much “stuff” does one need to pack for a honeymoon?

We went to the mountains and rented a cabin. We had to go to the grocery store to pick up food and toilet paper, so we had to pack clothes and coats (heresy, I know. ). We also brought some games and other things and we even managed to bring a DVD player and some favorite movies. It was a tight fit but driving it on those mountain roads was beautiful...

 

[Ted]

So is pretty much every RWD sports car, lol. At least the limited slip will be of a tiny amount of solace.

See my previous post about how my old Jaguar did just fine in snow. Limited slip and the right tires.

 

[SoonerAviator]

See my previous post about how my old Jaguar did just fine in snow. Limited slip and the right tires.

The Excursion is the first 4WD vehicle I've ever owned, lol. Three RWD trucks, two 300ZX's ('88 and '95), an F-body Camaro, etc. The only Front-Wheel Drive vehicles I've ever had were a '91 Taurus SHO and an '07 Grand Prix GXP. I've only been prevented from driving in snow with a RWD one time in 25 years: In 2011 Tulsa got over 14" of snow and it was more than my truck could deal with on un-plowed roads.

 

[jsstevens]

I at least skimmed the whole thread here. I may have missed it but was it the Mazda 3 your daughter rejected on looks? Between my two daughters we've owned 3 and they are very fun to drive and reliable. If you can convince her to get a manual, even better. I couldn't convince either of mine to.

Between all of them we've probably put 300,000 miles on them and the two we still have are going just fine.

 

[Zeldman]

As a 20 something I had a full size Ford van. It was a blast, especially since it had couch in back that opened up into a bed. I had a lot of miles inside that van. I remember one night with these 2 girls I met at the Waffle House...

Wait...

Thinking back, parents should absolutely NOT get a full size van with a couch that opens up into a bed for your daughter.!!

Or son.

I have heard that vans may begat children...

And it would get stuck in wet grass...

 

[Bill]

As a 20 something I had a full size Ford van. It was a blast, especially since it had couch in back that opened up into a bed. I had a lot of miles inside that van. I remember one night with these 2 girls I met at the Waffle House...

Wait...

Thinking back, parents should absolutely NOT get a full size van with a couch that opens up into a bed for your daughter.!!

Or son.

I have heard that vans may begat children...

And it would get stuck in wet grass...

Gas, grass, or ass, nobody rides for free.

 

[Ted]

As a 20 something I had a full size Ford van. It was a blast, especially since it had couch in back that opened up into a bed. I had a lot of miles inside that van. I remember one night with these 2 girls I met at the Waffle House...

Wait...

Thinking back, parents should absolutely NOT get a full size van with a couch that opens up into a bed for your daughter.!!

Or son.

I have heard that vans may begat children...

And it would get stuck in wet grass...

Oh come on. Some of you are seriously unimaginative if you need that much space to get into trouble.

 

[flyingron]

I remember an old CarTalk episode where a mother of a new driver says her son has been offered two used cars from relatives. One was a fairly mundane Toyota Celica and the other was a LandRover. Click and clack pointed out that he'd learn a very important lesson if he had the LandRover: Never buy a British car.

 

[Daleandee]

See my previous post about how my old Jaguar did just fine in snow. Limited slip and the right tires.

If you want something to go in the snow (mine's a '74) ...

 

[Zeldman]

Think Subaru... safe, reliable, fun.

 

[schmookeeg]

Just give her the 10 grand you've committed and make it her problem. I can only go from my relationship with my parents but their idea of "fun" never aligned with my own when I was that age.

I strongly suspect, if she's clever, it will be spent on something un-fun and reliable like a corolla, and she pockets her half of the coin instead of using you to subsidize a fun bus.

 

[MauleSkinner]

As a 20 something I had a full size Ford van. It was a blast, especially since it had couch in back that opened up into a bed. I had a lot of miles inside that van. I remember one night with these 2 girls I met at the Waffle House...

Wait...

Thinking back, parents should absolutely NOT get a full size van with a couch that opens up into a bed for your daughter.!!

Or son.

I have heard that vans may begat children...

And it would get stuck in wet grass...

<looking for the Seinfeld episode where Kostanza catches his parents in the van…>