Career field salaries

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Timbeck2 said:
The real question is why people who play with a ball for a living get paid X million/s per year?
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Easy: enough somebody's out there are willing to watch it on TV (adds), commercial free (higher subscription price) or pay crazy season ticket prices. I don't think they'd get paid anything if people didn't value sports so much. Its kinda crazy. And its corporate too with big companies buying lots of the season tix and private boxes and writing it off.
 
Oh I get it. I don't blame the ball player at all. I blame the sheep who think $300 for a nose bleed bleacher seat is fair.
 
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My wife switched careers and now works for the school district.
I soooooooooo want to downsize everything and work for a school district.

She has so much downtime that she gets to spend with the kids.
The more time I spend in this career, the less I value the pay.
 
Ryanb said:
Why is it that public servant jobs (ie., police) are often paid so little?

According to the web, the average police officer in my city has an annual salary of $48,800. Seems to me like a job with high risk should be rewarded with a significantly higher salary...I’ve never understood it. Government restrictions?

Than you have these desk jockeys who are paid $80k+ for sitting on their duff all day. What gives?
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There is another side to this. Those nasty capitalists and their greddy companies that make money (and pay this thing called 'taxes') actually need people (lets call them employees or desk jockey's). And often these days they need skilled people, highly skilled people. So to find them they need college graduates. Now our friendly colleges charge these future desk jockies tons of money because they feel....well they just can and it aint gonna change. So two choices. Don't go to college or go to college. But that greedy company needs the college graduate really bad so they pay them more. And they tell two friends and so on. Colleges are really happy. Companies are kinda happy (they don't like to pay higher wages but have too). Counties, states and federal are really happy with all those taxes.

How much debt does a 24hr shift based service profession carry up front: Sure, to be a nurse you need that 4yr degree. To be a policeman or fireman you typically don't need as much up front debt to start your career and thus the higher supply.

A pilot seems the odd profession out...you need crazy almost-medical-school-training costs up front and only later on will exceed the policemen/fireman but still not have their benefits package.

Look at it another way. If cities could afford to pay their policeman as much as the desk jockey's (on their first day) they would receive tons more qualified applicants. Many of those qualified applicants would be people that are like "why go to college, this pays just as much and no college costs". Once flush with applicants it will take a bean counter like 3hrs to suggest lowering the pay because there is competition (supply) for the job (demand). And the accountant might even suggest lowering their benefits until the line of applicants is just long enough to meet demand. Or that same accountant might even suggest lower the wages even more and offsetting with better retirement because in the end the actuary studied it and that strategy will cost the city/county/state the least overall...or be a shell game to be played later.

So lets blame the actuaries. Hint: they make a ton of money too :)
 
Clip4 said:
Everyone keeps saying that. Truth is there are only 7 states with good police pensions.
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What is your definition of a "good" police pension? I'd say just about ANY pension is a good pension, since you are guaranteed your monthly check until the day you die or the pension goes bankrupt. When everyone else's 401K runs out, it's SS from then on out, hopefully it meets your monthly needs.
 
Top paid POLICE OFFICER in my city made $215,528.42
Lowest paid POLICE OFFICER in my city made $104,723.26

These are POLICE OFFICERS. Not captains. The captain made $262,993.97 last year
 
Timbeck2 said:
The real question is why people who play with a ball for a living get paid X million/s per year?
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That's easy. It's because the owners of the sports teams let the taxpayers pay for arenas and stadiums leaving them with lots more money to pay the talent. It's good for economic development...haven't ya heard? o_O
 
SoonerAviator said:
What is your definition of a "good" police pension? I'd say just about ANY pension is a good pension, since you are guaranteed your monthly check until the day you die or the pension goes bankrupt. When everyone else's 401K runs out, it's SS from then on out, hopefully it meets your monthly needs.
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Guaranteed by who? With the exception of Illinois and California if the money isn’t there the pensions are not paid.
 
Clip4 said:
Guaranteed by who? With the exception of Illinois and California if the money isn’t there the pensions are not paid.
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Not sure if you’re aware, but federal/state laws mandate the minimum funding level for all defined benefit plans. If it’s not funded/underfunded, people are going to find out pretty quick.


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Ryanb said:
Most job studies would disagree with you.

As Tim said, it’s not you having to shoot at someone else...it’s someone else shooting at you.
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I would have to look at the actual numbers, but from what I remember getting shot is #2 after traffic deaths.

Edit.
Bad memory. Getting shot is #1
2018
 
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Jamie Kirk said:
Top paid POLICE OFFICER in my city made $215,528.42
Lowest paid POLICE OFFICER in my city made $104,723.26

These are POLICE OFFICERS. Not captains. The captain made $262,993.97 last year
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Strap on a uniform and let someone spit on you, almost run you over, try to stab you, call you every vile name you can think of and then some, vomit on you, die in your arms, try to kill someone else in front of you all the while doing it on video tape so someone can sue the living sheeeet out of you and work every angle on social media to make YOU the criminal and the bad guy a poor victim...... then go home and lead a normal life with a spouse and a couple kids.

I suspect you have no idea what real work is, and probably have soft hands to go with it. I back the badge 100% and you can take that to the bank!
 
Unit74 said:
Strap on a uniform and let someone spit on you, almost run you over, try to stab you, call you every vile name you can think of and then some, vomit on you, die in your arms, try to kill someone else in front of you all the while doing it on video tape so someone can sue the living sheeeet out of you and work every angle on social media to make YOU the criminal and the bad guy a poor victim...... then go home and lead a normal life with a spouse and a couple kids.

I suspect you have no idea what real work is, and probably have soft hands to go with it. I back the badge 100% and you can take that to the bank!
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I own a Class III Manufacturing company who donates more than you make a year to fallen military and first responders. On top of that I provide them equipment at no cost which will help them go home safe.

Would you like to put your mouth further in your mouth or should I continue?
 
Ghery said:
My wife, a RETIRED 5th/6th grade teacher said the same thing before she retired. And those who think teachers have limited hours have never lived with one. There's a bunch of unpaid OT grading papers, etc. that go with the job.
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How many hours classroom time did she have per week ? Unless she was scheduled for 40hrs classroom time, the time spent grading is not OT, it's just part of the job. From having a number of teachers in our circle of friends, I have noticed that the grading work doesn't have to be done while the sun is out and the pool is open.
I don't envy teachers for their income, I certainly don't. I do envy the summers off and the flexibility in a regular work week.

Now if you want to make money in education, you need to snag an administrator job without student contact. Associate Assistant Deputy commissioner of comparative curriculum development. You are not union at that point, but for some reason, even if they get fired they always fall on their feet and move to leech off another school district.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
I own a Class III Manufacturing company who donates more than you make a year to fallen military and first responders. On top of that I provide them equipment at no cost which will help them go home safe.

Would you like to put your mouth further in your mouth or should I continue?
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If thats the case, why are you talking crap Mr. Money bags? Put YOUR money where your mouth is and stop trash talking cops.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
I own a Class III Manufacturing company who donates more than you make a year to fallen military and first responders. On top of that I provide them equipment at no cost which will help them go home safe.

Would you like to put your mouth further in your mouth or should I continue?
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Spend some time reading and ask yourself if $100k is worth it, em kay?

https://www.odmp.org/
 
Unit74 said:
If thats the case, why are you talking crap Mr. Money bags? Put YOUR money where your mouth is and stop trash talking cops.
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I trash talked cops? OP commented how underpaid police officers are, I gave him some facts. How about you stop attacking people.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
I trash talked cops? OP commented how underpaid police officers are, I gave him some facts. How about you stop attacking people.
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You let out the secret. We can't have that.
 
I'm not the one who insinuated that cops are grossly over paid, as you did. I suspect you are in SoCal, as several of my friends are cops out there and $100k is about right, which includes OT. If that's the case, $100k won't get you a pot to **** in when a house is $400k worth of garbage in a bad neighborhood whereas $50k in Arkansas is decent money and a $100k gets you a nice little place in the country.

Here are some DOL stats to chew on if you really care.... https://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/police-officers-2014.htm

Jamie Kirk said:
Oh look, it's Mr. unhinged again. How about you step back from the keyboard for a while so your blood pressure can come down.
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Unit74 said:
I'm not the one who insinuated that cops are grossly over paid, as you did. I suspect you are in SoCal, as several of my friends are cops out there and $100k is about right, which includes OT. If that's the case, $100k won't get you a pot to **** in when a house is $400k worth of garbage in a bad neighborhood whereas $50k in Arkansas is decent money and a $100k gets you a nice little place in the country.

Here are some DOL stats to chew on if you really care.... https://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/police-officers-2014.htm
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What's scary is you have a pilots license. About the only thing more scary would be if someone let you carry a gun.
 
Unit74 said:
Strap on a uniform and let someone spit on you, almost run you over, try to stab you, call you every vile name you can think of and then some, vomit on you, die in your arms, try to kill someone else in front of you all the while doing it on video tape so someone can sue the living sheeeet out of you and work every angle on social media to make YOU the criminal and the bad guy a poor victim...... then go home and lead a normal life with a spouse and a couple kids.

I suspect you have no idea what real work is, and probably have soft hands to go with it. I back the badge 100% and you can take that to the bank!
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For a hundred grand per year? My wife deals with those things, as does nearly every other health care worker in this country, almost every day, and for a lot less than cops get paid to do it. ;) Except we're lucky, because we don't have to go home to any kids. :) We *ARE* pretty normal, though, so there's that.
 
The rate of fatal work injuries for police officers in 2014 was 13.5 per 100,000 full-time equivalent workers, compared to 3.4 for all occupations. Similarly, the rate of nonfatal occupational injuries and illnesses involving days away from work among police officers was 485.8 cases per 10,000 full-time workers in 2014; the rate was 107.1 cases for all occupations. (DOL,2018, para. 3)



Lachlan said:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...es-25-most-dangerous-jobs-america/1002500001/
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Jamie Kirk said:
What's scary is you have a pilots license. About the only thing more scary would be if someone let you carry a gun.
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What is scary is people like you vote.
 
Unit74 said:
What is scary is people like you vote.
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There ya go again.

I hope you can actually have a conversation with your wife and not just attack her.

So easy even a caveman can do it. But not Unit74
 
Unit74 said:
The rate of fatal work injuries for police officers in 2014 was 13.5 per 100,000 full-time equivalent workers, compared to 3.4 for all occupations. Similarly, the rate of nonfatal occupational injuries and illnesses involving days away from work among police officers was 485.8 cases per 10,000 full-time workers in 2014; the rate was 107.1 cases for all occupations. (DOL,2018, para. 3)
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Yup, it's dangerous. I think everyone agrees on that point.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
There ya go again.

I hope you can actually have a conversation with your wife and not just attack her.

So easy even a caveman can do it. But not Unit74
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Right................ To come full circle, you make an inflammatory comment and try and act like you are on the high road of nobility in an effort to deconflict your conjecture of what worth is in law enforcement. Then while masking your ignorance of what being in the uniform is all about, and trying to walk it back by claiming you are a big donor to "First Responders" and flip the script on me for being the ignorant one. You do know you are rather transparent, que no?
 
Unit74 said:
Right................ To come full circle, you make an inflammatory comment and try and act like you are on the high road of nobility in an effort to deconflict your conjecture of what worth is in law enforcement. Then while masking your ignorance of what being in the uniform is all about, and trying to walk it back by claiming you are a big donor to "First Responders" and flip the script on me for being the ignorant one. You do know you are rather transparent, que no?
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Now imagine how the conversation would have gone if you post more like this instead of attacks.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
Top paid POLICE OFFICER in my city made $215,528.42
Lowest paid POLICE OFFICER in my city made $104,723.26

These are POLICE OFFICERS. Not captains. The captain made $262,993.97 last year
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If that’s correct, it’s certainly WELL above the national average and wasn’t the demographic I was describing.

Kudos to your city for paying the blue men and women what they deserve.
 
This is like saying teachers don't make enough. This depends on locale. A lot of the officers around here are paid very well for their location, couple hour drive away, not so much. Often it is just moving a couple towns over, but any public service worker.
 
Ghery said:
My wife, a RETIRED 5th/6th grade teacher said the same thing before she retired. And those who think teachers have limited hours have never lived with one. There's a bunch of unpaid OT grading papers, etc. that go with the job.
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Most jobs today have extracurricular requirements. As an engineer tied to a US manufacturer, I've traveled to multiple continents on business, and haven't been in a good neighborhood yet on one of those trips. I also get to talk to people in China and Scotland at odd hours of the day (often way outside normal business hours here), and my evenings and weekends don't cost my employer another dollar.

The global economy and easy communication and travel to all points of the world have made the 8-5 world a thing of the past if it ever really existed.
 
I don't think I could have been a police officer. When I watch live PD (not by choice) I usually make it through about 30 seconds of each contact before I want to taze the suspect. I keep telling myself I might be more patient if I were on the clock. And maybe all the paperwork that goes with the tazer use might keep me patient. But if every contact were like the ones on live PD, I'd be on a development plan forever.
 
-KLB- said:
I don't think I could have been a police officer. When I watch live PD (not by choice) I usually make it through about 30 seconds of each contact before I want to taze the suspect. I keep telling myself I might be more patient if I were on the clock. And maybe all the paperwork that goes with the tazer use might keep me patient. But if every contact were like the ones on live PD, I'd be on a development plan forever.
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Same here. As a cop, you're not dealing with the gems of society. It would be tough to deal with that every day.
 
Clip4 said:
Obviously you are not aware that the laws you quote do not apply to public employee pensions.

https://www.courier-journal.com/sto...t-blames-underfunding-hedge-funds/1743292002/
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The premise is the same, public pensions are annuities which are rarely in jeopardy of failure. There are a few exceptions (New Jersey, etc) but generally speaking, state legislators don’t allow the pensions to go underfunded, and certainly not to the point of default.

The private sector rarely provides defined benefit plans anymore precisely because of the plan costs and extremely high funding regulations.


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Public Pensions are generally ran by a committee of people that don't know anything, and are sold products by the sales guys that show up. If the state can afford to fund them, then it works out. Lots of states are in real trouble do to poor decision making.
 
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