Approach question: KHND

[MarcP]

I was reading through the KHND VOR-B approach (attached), and noticed two sets of minimums. Based on that, I assume the approach can be flown with a single VOR only, no DME.

My question is: how does one get from the IAF (the Boulder VOR) to the FAF without DME? I see the times published from FAF to MAP, but am I supposed to use my own timing from the VOR to the FAF?

 

[Walboy]

Fly outbound on BLD 247 radial. Use the LAS 119 crossing radial to locate AGNUT. You can do this with one VOR receiver, two makes it much easier.

 

[midlifeflyer]

I was reading through the KHND VOR-B approach (attached), and noticed two sets of minimums. Based on that, I assume the approach can be flown with a single VOR only, no DME

You can also base it on the fact that the chart doesn't say, "DME required."

And @Walboy is right.

 

[MarcP]

Oh, right! Flip back and forth! That makes sense.

 

[MauleSkinner]

Ah, for the good ol’ days when you got to do intersection holds with a single VOR on checkrides!

 

[asicer]

Oh, right! Flip back and forth! That makes sense.

The Garmin SL30 and the Trig TX56a both have NAV monitor mode. The radio does the flipping for you.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Ah, for the good ol’ days when you got to do intersection holds with a single VOR on checkrides!

One of the few things my instrument training rental had was two VORs. But I did the flip-flop thing with one on my private checkride.

 

[flyingron]

Why flip back and forth? Tune to BLD and start the timer when you cross inbound and use the mins without CIXOB.
The only thing that requres a second VOR or DME (when not using the stepdown mins) is the GABIL fix on the missed.

 

[midlifeflyer]

Why flip back and forth? Tune to BLD and start the timer when you cross inbound and use the mins without CIXOB.
The only thing that requres a second VOR or DME (when not using the stepdown mins) is the GABIL fix on the missed.

Well, I kinda suspect folks are trying to get that extra 1100'.

The only thing that requres a second VOR or DME (when not using the stepdown mins) is the GABIL fix on the missed.

When it comes right down to it, technically, we can't flip back and forth or do math to use the stepdown...

 

[flyingron]

Yep, I suppose you could flip to get GABIL after flying the non-stepdown mins, but the CIXOG mininums won't work that way.

 

[luvflyin]

Ah, for the good ol’ days when you got to do intersection holds with a single VOR on checkrides!

Pfft. Howza bout an intersection defined by two NDB's? My CFII was really that sadistic.

 

[RussR]

Why flip back and forth? Tune to BLD and start the timer when you cross inbound and use the mins without CIXOB.
The only thing that requres a second VOR or DME (when not using the stepdown mins) is the GABIL fix on the missed.

You need to do the flip to identify the FAF at a minimum, there is no provision for timing to the FAF.

On the final segment, requiring flipping is not considered as a valid design by TERPS, which is why you see the note "Dual VOR or DME required". I have not researched whether flipping in final is mentioned as a bad idea in the IPH or any other FAA publication.

 

[luvflyin]

Oh, right! Flip back and forth! That makes sense.

Think about doing it with one VOR receiver that doesn't have the FlipFlop function. When you change stations you have to dial in the frequency each time. And to be absolutly correct, ID it each time. Those flipityflopitys haven't been around forever.

 

[DoubleD]

Don't we all have GPS now?

 

[MauleSkinner]

Pfft. Howza bout an intersection defined by two NDB's? My CFII was really that sadistic.

one of the approaches on my CFII checkride was a non-terminal NDB with a 30-knot crosswind. Does that count?

 

[Palmpilot]

Don't we all have GPS now?

Not all rental planes have an IFR GPS, and those that do may or may not have an up-to-date database.

 

[luvflyin]

one of the approaches on my CFII checkride was a non-terminal NDB with a 30-knot crosswind. Does that count?

Yeah! He was a meanie to