Another First Officer...

midlifeflyer

midlifeflyer

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October 18, 2023

California Pilot Indicted for Interfering With a Flight Crew​

On October 18, 2023, a grand jury in the U.S. District Court for the District of Utah indicted Jonathan J. Dunn for interfering with the crew of a commercial airline flight.

The indictment alleges that, on or about August 22, 2022, Dunn, the crew’s First Officer, interfered with the performance of a crew member by using a dangerous weapon to assault and intimidate the Captain. Dunn was authorized to carry a firearm through the Transportation Security Administration’s Federal Flight Deck Officer program. After a disagreement about a potential flight diversion due to a passenger medical event, Dunn told the Captain they would be shot multiple times if the Captain diverted the flight.

DOT-OIG is conducting this investigation with the Federal Bureau of Investigation with substantial assistance from FAA.

Link: https://www.oig.dot.gov/node/39680
 
Time to get rid of FOs. Computers don't get angry and try to crash flights or threaten to shoot crew.
 
Took a YEAR to get an indictment?? I guess a FO isn't a Ham Sandwich
 
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172andyou said:
Time to get rid of FOs. Computers don't get angry and try to crash flights or threaten to shoot crew.
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I once had an autopilot trim full nose down from cruise flight for no apparent reason…

(it was a KAP140 for those of you playing at home)
 
172andyou said:
Time to get rid of FOs. Computers don't get angry and try to crash flights or threaten to shoot crew.
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Hey, I'm all for de-populating the planet but I try to keep those thoughts private.

Before you get mad, I'm kidding.
 
Pertinent sentences
The Transportation Department's inspector general's office said in an email sent Tuesday that Dunn was the first officer, or co-pilot, on the flight and was authorized to carry a gun under a program run by the Transportation Security Administration.

“After a disagreement about a potential flight diversion due to a passenger medical event, Dunn told the Captain they would be shot multiple times if the Captain diverted the flight,” the inspector general's office said.

The inspector general described Dunn as a California pilot. It did not identify the airline on which the incident occurred, saying only that it was a commercial airline flight. The office did not give the flight's intended route, or whether it was diverted.
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That’s…..a doozy.
 
Couldn‘t that be considered hijacking? I would think that’s a more serious charge than “interfering with a flight crew member! Now he will never move to the other seat, He’s Dunn!
Maybe before the trial give the family of the medical emergency passenger’s time alone with the First Officer alone in a locked room. Might not need a trial! Just no sympathy for idiots!
 
diabolical said:
Couldn‘t that be considered hijacking? I would think that’s a more serious charge than “interfering with a flight crew member! Now he will never move to the other seat, He’s Dunn!
Maybe before the trial give the family of the medical emergency passenger’s time alone with the First Officer alone in a locked room. Might not need a trial! Just no sympathy for idiots!
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Yup. Right or wrong (and we are wrong at times for sure), the Captain is responsible for everything. A good captain will solicit all opinions & advice from all possible sources, and make the best decision in their opinion. Period. End.
 
Will be interesting to find out what happened when the flight crew debarked at their final destination. Whatever that was.

Also surprised this news was suppressed for so long.
 
The intended diversion must have been a real ish-hole. I have a few places in mind that I would protest diverting too also. Possibly not at gunpoint though.

I wonder if there is a subtle hint around the use of neutral pronouns for the Captain.
 
schmookeeg said:
The intended diversion must have been a real ish-hole. I have a few places in mind that I would protest diverting too also. Possibly not at gunpoint though.

I wonder if there is a subtle hint around the use of neutral pronouns for the Captain.
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Yeah… the word “they” threw me for a loop.
 
Kritchlow said:
Yeah… the word “they” threw me for a loop.
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Using “they” for third person singular has been a linguistic concept for a long time, even prior to the rise of it specifically as a non-gendered pronoun. It’s been around for centuries

en.m.wikipedia.org

Singular they - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org
 
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diabolical said:
Couldn‘t that be considered hijacking? ...
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I don't think attempting to force an aircraft to go to the original intended destination would meet the definitioni of "hijack"
 
Maybe it was an international flight and the captain wanted to divert to Somalia? Or Tehran? :goofy:
 
donjohnston said:
Maybe it was an international flight and the captain wanted to divert to Somalia? Or Tehran? :goofy:
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Interesting story of diverting into Tehran by a Northwest airlines DC-10. The story starts about 10 minutes in.

 
X3 Skier said:
Took a YEAR to get an indictment?? I guess a FO isn't a Ham Sandwich
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There's all sorts of stuff that could have happened over the course of that year. One common possibility is that there have been negotiations between the US Atty and defense counsel. Checking the docket, there was no arrest warrant issued with the indictment just a summons to appear for arraignment on November 19 which was issued the same day as the Indictment was entered into the record and executed the next day. I don't see anything suggesting he was already in custody so that also suggests the possibility of an advance deal.

But I'm just speculating.
 
Dunn was the first officer, or co-pilot, on the flight and was authorized to carry a gun under a program run by the Transportation Security Administration
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A. What an idiotic program.
B. If you are going to have a program like that, and someone in the program misuses their weapon, the penalty should be SEVERE.
 
kaiser said:
I once had an autopilot trim full nose down from cruise flight for no apparent reason…

(it was a KAP140 for those of you playing at home)
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That happened to me once, but it was pilot error. I was pushing down on the trim switch instead of the ptt. The autopilot kept fighting my trim input until it suddenly gave out, and the nose pitched almost vertically down. Not saying that's what happened in your case.
 
Ed Haywood said:
A. What an idiotic program.
B. If you are going to have a program like that, and someone in the program misuses their weapon, the penalty should be SEVERE.
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Are you not aware of the FFDO program? They all have jurisdiction of about 15 square feet and flash their badge for a Chik-Fil-A first responder discount at the airport outlets.


Not kidding. Coming back from Reno this year, one those guys was flashing his badge to get a ride in the crew shuttle to the airport. Driver told him it was a United crew only shuttle but he could ask the CA. Did the whole badge flash with the CA who asked if he was a United employee. Dude said no, CA said “Hotel guests have a shuttle available to them.” and left the dude.
 
Despite what you see on TV cop shows, prosecutions frequently aren't commenced by a cop handcuffing someone and shouting Miranda rights at them as they are hauled off. They knew where the guy was and the feds have five years typically to charge someone.
 
flyingron said:
Despite what you see on TV cop shows, prosecutions frequently aren't commenced by a cop handcuffing someone and shouting Miranda rights at them as they are hauled off. They knew where the guy was and the feds have five years typically to charge someone.
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Justice delayed is Justice denied?
 
AKiss20 said:
Using “they” for third person singular has been a linguistic concept for a long time, even prior to the rise of it specifically as a non-gendered pronoun. It’s been around for centuries

en.m.wikipedia.org

Singular they - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org
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Yes, it's been a concept that, as your source notes, most authorities considered an error until very recently (the change not for linguistic reasons).
 
Lindberg said:
Yes, it's been a concept that, as your source notes, most authorities considered an error until very recently (the change not for linguistic reasons).
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Because pedantic grammarians are universally followed and respected in all aspects of spoken and written word?

Just because some grammarians arbitrarily decided to recommend against using it centuries after its use became common, doesn’t mean its usage wasn’t established or commonplace. If you can’t interpret the singular they and get thrown by it, you really have to have been living under a rock.
 
AKiss20 said:
Because pedantic grammarians are universally followed and respected in all aspects of spoken and written word?

Just because some grammarians arbitrarily decided to recommend against using it centuries after its use became common, doesn’t mean its usage wasn’t established or commonplace. If you can’t interpret the singular they and get thrown by it, you really have to have been living under a rock.
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You probably also hate the Oxford comma. It's ok, not everyone writes to be understood.
 
Lindberg said:
You probably also hate the Oxford comma. It's ok, not everyone writes to be understood.
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Negative, I do not. I love the Oxford comma. It reduces ambiguity, much as the singular they does as it offers the ability to be explicitly non-prescriptive in the gender of the subject, leaving the gendered pronouns for situations where the gender is explicitly prescribed. Using he as the singular generic is more ambiguous, not less.
 
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