Android AWOL from OSH

[Cap'n Jack]

The best platform is the one that lets you get your desired tasks done...with the least amount of aggravation.

I found Apple OS to be nothing but a continual stream of aggravation. I understand they've made progress in the last upgrade, but this article makes it clear that they have a long way to go before iOS matches the power and flexibility of Android.

Again, depends on what you do. I use both for navigation (edge to the iPad/ForeFlight for me, the Android things didn't work _for me_), Geotagging (edge to the iPad thanks to the Bad Elf- long battery life, lots of data logging space), music (edge to the Android by avoiding iTunes), books (tied), and web browsing (tied), star mapping (tied), simple chemical calculations (tied). If I need anything more complex, I'll use a "real" computer. If I want pictures, I prefer a "real" camera, though the phone/tablet cameras do a great job in the right hands and in decent light.

You prefer Android- good for you; I really don't see either as being inferior- just...different.

 

[airdale]

The best platform is the one that lets you get your desired tasks done...with the least amount of aggravation.

Yup. For a large number people the limited iThing environment suffices. For me, wanting to use tools like Adblock Plus, it does not.

As an iMac/Macbook/iPad/iPhone user their ecosystem provides a great experience where everything is coupled together and just works.

Yes. The price of simplicity and robustness is, to one degree or another, limited capability. To support your point, I spent an inordinate amount of time chasing an N7 problem where the turned-off battery drain was excessive. It seems to be a combination of an OS bug and a few poorly-written apps. I don't think something like that would be happening to me if I lived in the iThing world.

So, with my Adblock Plus I get a dose of Android aggravation. TANSTAAFL. Life's a tradeoff.

 

[anandaleon]

perhaps Android was a little AWOL, but the Levil booth was demoing three new Apps that support the iLevil AHRS-ADS-B:

1. Naviator
2. Avilution
3. xEFIS

1 and 2 are complete moving map Applications and now with the ADS-B and AHRS integration they make an excellent back-up solution.

xEFIS is specifically for those that would like an EFIS display backup.. it can be configured as "analog gauges" or modern glass cockpit view...

Android may not have as many options for pilots as iOS does but we were happy to report at Oshkosh that the available options today are working smoothly and can only get better from here on...

couple of customers took an iLevil home to try with their Android devices so we should hear some PIREPs from them soon.

Ananda

as always.. " fly straight and Levil"

 

[wabower]

I'd be willing to bet that for Joe-average-toad-users (like me) that if whatever they started with works reasonably well they have bigger fish to fry than farting around with tabletry-talk or thinking about changing to something else that might or might not be better.

 

[Jay Honeck]

It wasn't the aviation apps that made be discard my iPad. It was everything else!

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3...

 

[wabower]

I've never wanted to use any of the little-screen gadgets for big-screen projects.
Maybe that's part of the difference.

It wasn't the aviation apps that made be discard my iPad. It was everything else!

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3...

 

[denverpilot]

...but this article makes it clear that they have a long way to go before iOS matches the power and flexibility of Android.

I always get a kick out of industry buzzwords like "power and flexibility". You know what? I don't care about mythical "power" in a phone, unless you mean the battery.

And "flexibility"... Yeah lots of flexible software out there never gets used for even a tiny bit of its possible uses, because most of them are dumb or useless.

I have a list if things I need my phone to do...

- calls
- texts
- Foreflight backup device
- lazy mans flashlight

The list of wants but don't need is long and starts with...

- email
- camera

But, I see nothing on those lists that requires any additional "power and flexibility". It's not a damn Yoga class.

 

[MSPAviator]

I did finally get a response from Lightspeed. They said tersely that my request for an Android app for Lightspeed headsets was forwarded to their engineering department.

I'm sure they saw the email popup on their iPhone and laughed.

 

[Jay Honeck]

I did finally get a response from Lightspeed. They said tersely that my request for an Android app for Lightspeed headsets was forwarded to their engineering department.

I'm sure they saw the email popup on their iPhone and laughed.

It amazes me that Lightspeed would write an app that only works in iOS. Talk about stupid!

As Blackberry goes, iOS will follow. It's simply impossible to beat an open source OS like Android -- which now commands 70% of the market, and is growing.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

It amazes me that Lightspeed would write an app that only works in iOS. Talk about stupid!

As Blackberry goes, iOS will follow. It's simply impossible to beat an open source OS like Android -- which now commands 70% of the market, and is growing.

see thread above and repeat

 

[nddons]

It amazes me that Lightspeed would write an app that only works in iOS. Talk about stupid!

As Blackberry goes, iOS will follow. It's simply impossible to beat an open source OS like Android -- which now commands 70% of the market, and is growing.

I don't know about that. I'm a user, not a techie, but my iPhone and iPad are tools, and they flat out work. They seem idiot proof to me, which is huge to the massive segment of "just users" like me.

If I can't get the latest self pleasuring android app or the ball scratching app written by some kid in his basement, I'm Ok with that.

 

[Jay Honeck]

The point is that anyone who writes an app that ONLY works in Apple's iOS is doomed to failure, if the market trend continues. The ONLY reason Apple has a grip in the aviation market is because they were first -- just like Narco was.

Remember them?

 

[jesse]

The point is that anyone who writes an app that ONLY works in Apple's iOS is doomed to failure, if the market trend continues. The ONLY reason Apple has a grip in the aviation market is because they were first -- just like Narco was.

Remember them?

lmfao...

 

[jmn444]

The point is that anyone who writes an app that ONLY works in Apple's iOS is doomed to failure, if the market trend continues. The ONLY reason Apple has a grip in the aviation market is because they were first -- just like Narco was.

Remember them?

I think doomed to failure and doomed to be constrained to a certain market share are two very different things.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

The point is that anyone who writes an app that ONLY works in Apple's iOS is doomed to failure, if the market trend continues. The ONLY reason Apple has a grip in the aviation market is because they were first -- just like Narco was.

Remember them?

Read thread above and repeat

There's some people that posted a different point-of-view that make their living writing software. I'm not sure why you dismiss their comments so readily.

I'd understand your comments better if one of these IT experts were telling you how to run a hotel, but it seems like you are telling programmers how to write software.

 

[denverpilot]

The point is that anyone who writes an app that ONLY works in Apple's iOS is doomed to failure, if the market trend continues. The ONLY reason Apple has a grip in the aviation market is because they were first -- just like Narco was.

Remember them?

That was so dumb I can feel myself being sucked into the Vortex of Stupid. LOL!

 

[Jay Honeck]

That was so dumb I can feel myself being sucked into the Vortex of Stupid. LOL!

The aviation parallels between Narco and Apple are striking. At one point Narco owned every panel in general aviation -- precisely the way the iPad does now.

Why? Because Narco was the first, best option for affordable avionics in light aircraft. The SuperHomer was the iPad/ForeFlight of post-war American aviation.

Then, they sat back and made money. Nothing wrong with that, but first King, then Garmin ate their lunch. Narco now exists in name only, with a tiny handful of employees who primarily repair old radios.

If the market share statistics are accurate, the trend against iOS is more of an Android avalanche than a ground swell. Software developers that ignore that trend do so at their own peril.

Will there always be iPads in airplanes? Sure. There are still Narcos out there, flying, too.

My money is on Garmin, however. And Android.

 

[denverpilot]

So you're saying that Apple doesn't have new products coming, in your HEAD? LOL...

 

[jmn444]

Yeah.... Very little real parallels IMO. If that concept were true, nobody would still be buying apple computers. Not having largest share of the market simply doesn't equal failure.

 

[denverpilot]

P.S. Jay you do realize hundreds of thousands of folks are already beta testing new OS loads for both iOS and OSX right?

Initial reports from a co-worker indicate the new CPU timeslicing methodology for OSX has upped his battery life on a MBP by an average of two full hours of standard daily mixed use.

 

[X3 Skier]

Don't worry about Jay, he can see the future of Apple so clearly, he has mortgaged his hotel, airplane, all his personal property so he can short Apple stock and buy Google options.

With the profits, he will corner the Hilton IPO and become the reincarnation of Baron Hilton.

Seriously, choice of Android or Apple is solely of what suits your needs, nothing more, nothing less.

Cheers

 

[Jay Honeck]

Yeah.... Very little real parallels IMO. If that concept were true, nobody would still be buying apple computers. Not having largest share of the market simply doesn't equal failure.

Perhaps "failure" is too strong a word for y'all. Let's try a "drastic reduction in sales and potential growth for Apple".

I'm sure the twelve guys left at Narco are happy with their market share, too, but the 2500 people they laid off may beg to differ.

Apple will survive as a profitable niche product, thanks to their incredibly loyal fan base -- but Android is the future. It is...inevitable. You simply can't compete effectively against an open source OS that has 70% of the market, and is growing by leaps and bounds.

 

[Jay Honeck]

Seriously, choice of Android or Apple is solely of what suits your needs, nothing more, nothing less.

Exactly right, which is my point in its entirety.

The world has chosen Android, and everything continues to migrate to it -- except aviation apps. We are the oddity, not the norm, and that's rarely a good place to be from a business standpoint.

 

[Jay Honeck]

P.S. Jay you do realize hundreds of thousands of folks are already beta testing new OS loads for both iOS and OSX right?

Initial reports from a co-worker indicate the new CPU timeslicing methodology for OSX has upped his battery life on a MBP by an average of two full hours of standard daily mixed use.

And that's all great -- it will keep Android on its toes.

We all win from competition between the two. But the market share of Apple's mobile OS is below 30%, and shrinking. That is not a tenable strategy, in the long run.

 

[rpadula]

That was so dumb I can feel myself being sucked into the Vortex of Stupid. LOL!

LOL! I've been gone for 5 months and this iPad vs. Nexus argument is still going?

 

[wabower]

You'll be comforted to know that Honecks recent posts make at least as much sense as his earlier off-the-walls.

LOL! I've been gone for 5 months and this iPad vs. Nexus argument is still going?

 

[denverpilot]

LOL! I've been gone for 5 months and this iPad vs. Nexus argument is still going?

Actually it just started up again. Jay wasn't as bored when he was airplane shopping.

 

[kyleb]

LOL! I've been gone for 5 months and this iPad vs. Nexus argument is still going?

Yep. It is like whack a mole - as fast as bad arguments are made "for" Android, they are largely debunked, then a new premise springs forth explaining some other reason why Android is better.

The OP's best argument was his first one: "My N7 is a good value". The others have mostly been a reach...

 

[retailguy]

 

[retailguy]

It's a big world out there and it is speaking...

 

[retailguy]

Now look at the USA. Very different picture, yet still changing although much slower.

 

[airdale]

How does Samsung's penetration imply anything at all about Android penetration? In my (US) house we have two HTC and two Asus devices. We have never owned anything by Samsung.

 

[retailguy]

How does Samsung's penetration imply anything at all about Android penetration? In my (US) house we have two HTC and two Asus devices. We have never owned anything by Samsung.

It doesn't specifically, however, Samsung is the android market leader by far. My point was in the growth of Samsung devices in the past several quarters. How about this table instead?

I like pretty graphs....:wink2:

 

[airdale]

How about this table instead?

Well, apples and apples would be nice. Sales, share, or subscriptions I don't care. But both the worldwide and the US domestic numbers should in the same units.

Sales numbers should make it clear whether it is units or dollars. Apple's high prices will make them look good for dollar sales but it is unit sales that sell apps.

 

[Henning]

Can't compare phone stats and tablet stats either. I have both, an Android phone and an iPad.

 

[denverpilot]

It's a big world out there and it is speaking...

Or the manufacturers who build for the masses stopped making anything except Android because its hellaciously cheap.

Today's SANS Newsbites had some lovely security announcements for really really basic stuff on Android. That's going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

Not saying iOS is a whole lot better in that regard, and both are probably going to hide NSA tracking turn-on code in their binaries (Apple already caught, I suspect the next announcement will be that it's in the new Motorola phone), but Android will be like Windows in this regard... Eventually we'll have "Patch Tuesday" for continual holes in the thing.

Patching and serious bugs are accelerating as fast as CPU horsepower did in the early days right now, on almost all platforms. We're reaping the "we can fix it later, ship it" mentality of coders who are so abstracted from their hardware that they just use the compiler to find bugs, not their eyeballs.

Gonna get bad here eventually. Both leading mobile platforms will be seriously breached in the next year or two. Not sure if the average consumer will care or even know...

Most likely reason? A good worm and some malicious code and you overload the LTE/4G back-end and maybe DDoS some juicy target at the same time.

That's serious bragging rights. I'm sure someone is working on it.

 

[rich0]

see thread above and repeat

Little of the thread above is relevant to what Lightspeed is doing.

Apps like Foreflight/Pilot/etc are very complex - likely written in tens or hundreds of thousands of lines of code. They manipulate lots of graphics and are performance-sensitive. There is a real cost to targeting two platforms (though this can be mitigated somewhat if you use a cross-platform framework instead of targeting direct APIs). I still think it is a worthwhile investment, but I can see the argument.

An app like what Lightspeed uses to control their headsets is trivial to write. 90% of its functionality is just to display a few pages of settings, translate them into some instruction set, and send them over bluetooth. The meat of that logic doesn't use the API at all and would be trivial to port between the platforms. I could see maybe not supporting audio recording initially on one platform or the other, but not having a simple settings app? If I had the specs on the headset's command language I could probably knock that out in a weekend, and I've never written an Android app that did much more than hello world. There just isn't much that needs to be done.

 

[rich0]

Can't compare phone stats and tablet stats either. I have both, an Android phone and an iPad.

http://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS24253413

Android on tablets is looking like Android on phones 2-3 years ago. They just passed Apple for unit shipments (which isn't quite the same as total market share).

I'm sure Apple will hang onto a niche with phones/tablets just as they did with PCs. On computers anything limited to a single brand of hardware generally doesn't do well long-term. The whole point of Android is that anybody can legally make an Android phone and sell it (and they can even do it without paying a dime to anybody, well, aside from the patent trolls that everybody has to pay off). That's why it is so popular with manufacturers - they're not reliant on a deal with some OS vendor who can change the deal at any time (like Microsoft) or who just doesn't want to deal (like Apple). You don't even need to make a deal with Google to sell one, and many of the cheap Chinese units don't, and neither does Amazon. It is also a more flexible OS from the start (less hardware-bound, native multitasking, a bit more linux-like so more familiar, etc).

 

[LDJones]

Or the manufacturers who build for the masses stopped making anything except Android because its hellaciously cheap.

You mean they all left the burgeoning Apple-compatible computer/tablet/phone market? Oh, wait....there wasn't one....

That, in a nutshell, is why they will be forever destined to be a niche player....a big niche in a global market, but still a niche.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

It doesn't specifically, however, Samsung is the android market leader by far. My point was in the growth of Samsung devices in the past several quarters. How about this table instead?

A recent study found that Apple and Samsung combine to make over 99% of the profits in the mobile market. Nobody else is really making any money. Regardless of the current situation, that means that they're likely to continue to dominate because they have more money to spend on R&D.

Also, Apple tends to dominate the high end of the market. Even though there are more Android devices selling now, iOS users tend to spend more money on apps. There's a lot more to this equation than "who sold more devices last quarter."