Aerobatic crash at dayton airshow

MultiMediaWill said:
I can only hope that the worms in the ground are okay. Seriously though, anyone who attempts such a feat is asking to die.
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Some people on this forum have numerous friends in the airshow community, and on behalf of all of them, I would like to call you a douche.

Was Amanda Franklin asking to die too? You twunt.
 
Hard to judge between the two videos, but it sure looked like in the successful video that the aircraft had much more ground speed speed. Assuming headwinds were relatively similar, I say stall.
 
DavidWhite said:
Some people on this forum have numerous friends in the airshow community, and on behalf of all of them, I would like to call you a douche.

Was Amanda Franklin asking to die too? You twunt.
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Careful David...

Just remember, dog **** doesn't typically stink until you step in in.

Not that I disagree with your sentiments...

RIP pilot and walker. :(
 
Fearless Tower said:
I know very little about aerobatic flying, but are you thinking he over-corrected when stopping the roll to keep it level?
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Just from what it looks like the pilot had a lot of rudder input to stay level during the roll then upon completion of the roll still had a lot of input in and brought the nose up a little at which point the low wing stalls. Tons of drag and a low ground speed. Thats just a guess, im no acrobatic pilot either.
 
This is tragic for the families. Our prayers and best to them.

Looks like:
1. Plane failed to maintain directional control and headed toward the crowd line. Plane's energy is starting to point at crowd, that's a no-no.
2. Indecision at that point. Loss of situational awareness.
3. Going lower, pushed stick forward, you see the tail drop. Airspeed already looks low and the plane is settling.
3. Inverted stall, left wing drop maybe due to weight and drag of wing walker aided by left wing up input as the nose drops through.
 
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Fearless Tower said:
I know very little about aerobatic flying, but are you thinking he over-corrected when stopping the roll to keep it level?
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I too know zero about aerobatics but it looked to me like he was too slow to maintain Inverted level flight and tried to roll upright but didn't have enough altitude to do so.
 
Very sad. The video is definitely hard to watch. Not a good day for aviation.

David
 
R.I.P. and condolences. I followed the Franklin tragedy on Facebook. Heartbreaking.

This is just me but I do not enjoy folks putting their lives at risk to this extent just to titillate a crowd. When I go to SnF or other shows, I usually give the low-level acts a miss. Especially something like this act; I would have no interest in watching that.
 
My family has been to three big air shows in the last three years. Oshkosh 12 was our last. Many reasons, safety being one. I hate to see this and glad no spectators were hurt. We as pilots know the risks. RIP.
 
I just saw that this happened today. I'll be there tomorrow, was supposed to be there today (glad I wasn't, the video itself is hard enough to watch).
 
Rough to watch. RIP to the pilot and the wingwalker.
 
Was there. First airshow ever. Was sitting on the ground. Saw it go "too low" and decided to stand up - not sure that was a good idea. Saw way too much. Husband said the "wing walker" girl got tossed a couple feet from the accident but still died. It was jaw dropping. Was only the third *act* in. Tragic for sure. :(
 
Terrible. Just terrible. I feel such sorrow for the pilot and ms wicker. I also feel badly for the families of the performers as well as the spectators.

While I don't enjoy air show performances of this nature i agree with david.
 
saracelica said:
Was there. First airshow ever. Was sitting on the ground. Saw it go "too low" and decided to stand up - not sure that was a good idea. Saw way too much. Husband said the "wing walker" girl got tossed a couple feet from the accident but still died. It was jaw dropping. Was only the third *act* in. Tragic for sure. :(
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Sorry you had to experience that. Personally, I walk away from shows like that.
 
Terribly sad. I wish I wouldn't have watched that video. There is nothing to learn by doing so.
 
jesse said:
There is nothing to learn by doing so.
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I understand, but I respectfully disagree. We have to be reminded from time to time of the consequences of doing what we do, poorly. It isn't fun, isn't pleasant, but sometimes seeing these things with our own eyes sears it in our memory and actually makes us better pilots.

Just my opinion of course. Still very sad and hard to watch.
 
TexasPilot71 said:
I understand, but I respectfully disagree. We have to be reminded from time to time of the consequences of doing what we do, poorly. It isn't fun, isn't pleasant, but sometimes seeing these things with our own eyes sears it in our memory and actually makes us better pilots.

Just my opinion of course. Still very sad and hard to watch.
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Perhaps relevant for those of us that do low level inverted flight with wing walkers but that's about it. Knowing our community, I can tell you, there are very few of us in that category.
 
I didn't watch it and won't. Ditto many of the other shocking tragedies on the news. I'm terribly sorry for any loss of life or severe injury but watching it doesn't help them or me.

jesse said:
Terribly sad. I wish I wouldn't have watched that video. There is nothing to learn by doing so.
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It's still relevant even if most of us will never do an aerobatic maneuver in our lifetime.

Mistakes and loss of situational awareness can be deadly in aviation, whether flying inverted or just turning base to final.
 
In which case I figure my current exposure rate is about 8,000 of one to none of the other.

fiveoboy01 said:
It's still relevant even if most of us will never do an aerobatic maneuver in our lifetime.

Mistakes and loss of situational awareness can be deadly in aviation, whether flying inverted or just turning base to final.
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Joaquin Phoenix in 8mm, "You'll see things you can't unsee."

I don't know what went wrong when unsuccessful, or what is done right when successful.

RIP
 
RIP to a mom and a trusted pilot. Peace and comfort to a fiancé, kids, friends and family. Sad.
 
wabower said:
In which case I figure my current exposure rate is about 8,000 of one to none of the other.
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You're correct and I am certainly not trying to start an argument. I'm just a lowly student pilot.

I figure if I keep reminding myself that I can die easily if I don't pay attention, it might help to keep me from making a fatal mistake.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
I figure if I keep reminding myself that I can die easily if I don't pay attention, it might help to keep me from making a fatal mistake.
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Not to derail the thread, but you could die rolling out of bed tomorrow morning.

RIP to the performers, this is one of the things that generally keeps me from airshows, the fear of seeing something like this.
 
I could yep, and if there were a video of someone dying rolling out of bed, I'd watch it so I could remind myself that it's possible :)
 
TexasPilot71 said:
I understand, but I respectfully disagree. We have to be reminded from time to time of the consequences of doing what we do, poorly. It isn't fun, isn't pleasant, but sometimes seeing these things with our own eyes sears it in our memory and actually makes us better pilots.

Just my opinion of course. Still very sad and hard to watch.
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I agree. We all can learn from these accidents. Just like in the Afghan 747 crash, although hard to watch and most of us don't fly 747s, one can understand the importance of proper CG.

I've seen countless accident videos in the military, including ones of people I knew personally. Accident videos aren't just a sobering reminder about the hazards out there, you analyze them and hope to find a way to prevent similar accidents in the future.
 
Worth watching even if only as a reminder that when we take away our margin of safety, we then have no margin of safety.
 
Low and slow has consequences. Doesn't matter if you're flying a jet, helicopter, blimp, balloon, or a Cub, whether you're inverted or upright, whether you have two wings or one; low and slow has deadly consequences if not performed properly. That's a lesson that must be seared in our memory. Visually or cognitively. Whatever it takes. That was my point. There is no reset button in aviation. We get ONE shot.
 
fiveoboy01 said:
I can die easily if I don't pay attention, it might help to keep me from making a fatal mistake.
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fiveoboy01 said:
loss of situational awareness can be deadly in aviation, whether flying inverted or just turning base to final.
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This had nothing to do with not paying attention or loss of situational awareness. This type of flying is so far removed from what 99.9% of pilots understand anything about. What happened here doesn't need to be studied. It's not rocket science.
 
And does that completely invalidate either of my two statements that you quoted? No.

I'm not that blind that I can't see the differences in the type of flight and that most of us won't ever do any such maneuver.

As for your assertion, I disagree. It most certainly WAS a loss of situational awareness...other causes could be a mechanical failure with the airplane or the pilot suddenly suffered a physical ailment. I'm sure an investigation will reveal if either of those is the case.

Anyways I don't need to argue further. My only point is that nearly all accidents can be learned from, even if the pilot will never perform that specific type of flying.
 
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