Adderall

dell30rb

dell30rb

Final Approach
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Ren
Got a friend who wants to get his PPL. He has a prescription for Adderall for the last few years.

Attention Deficit (ADD) - Ritalin (Methylphenidate Hydrochloride), Adderall (Dextroamphetamine Sulfate) and Strattera (Atomoxetine Hydrochloride) are usually not approved by the FAA. Under rare circumstances, individuals using Ritalin have been approved with restrictions. Approval is more likely for adults due to the difficulty in accurately evaluating ADD in young people and typically requires time off medication prior to flight.
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Found this info online. What are his chances of getting approved to fly with the prescription (he is an adult)? If that is not an option, would it be difficult for him to get a medical if he dropped the prescription.

Thanks
 
ADD is disqualifying. Your buddy should look into Sport Pilot unless he's already been denied for a medical.
 
dell30rb said:
Got a friend who wants to get his PPL. He has a prescription for Adderall for the last few years.




Found this info online. What are his chances of getting approved to fly with the prescription (he is an adult)? If that is not an option, would it be difficult for him to get a medical if he dropped the prescription.

Thanks
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Bruce may have better info, but my guess is zero chance of getting a medical, both the med and the underlying condition are disqualifying. Could go SP, but there is a question as to whether they'll be safe.
 
I believe the only way to get a medical, is to have the original diagnosis reversed which is expensive and could leave the OP's buddy $5k or more lighter in his wallet and still not able to get his medical.

Dr. Bruce can clarify.
 
I don't think this one is going to be quick. Talked to Bruce about this for a neighbor kid with similar situation. It's going to take not just a doc saying "Oh, I guess the kid doesn't have ADHD" but an extended time OFF the drugs with a demonstration of unimpaired functioning.
 
Yeah - I was involved with helping a kid beat this (with Doc Bruce's help). My understsnding : Adderol is for ADD, and ADD is a lifetime illness. The only way around it is to prove you didn't have it in the first place, and that means $ for a full-blown psych eval to overturn the original diagnosis. Of course, some people really DO have ADD...
 
Thanks for all the replies.

Basically he has the classic scenario of being diagnosed as a teenager with ADD. A few years later he seems to have outgrown it.

From what I have been able to research, it looks like a minimum of 90 days with no prescription and then a psych eval costing $750-$2500. I'm glad I was able to bring this up with him before getting denied a medical as SP might be a good option.
 
dell30rb said:
A few years later he seems to have outgrown it.
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That's the deal - if it really is ADD I don't think you outgrow it. Maybe you can learn to cope, but it might be that he didn't have it to begin with. The good Dr is best for this.
 
Hard to say if he was mis-diagnosed or what.

I told him from what I was seeing he would need to be off the prescription for a minimum of 90 days and then take a comprehensive evaluation to remove the diagnosis.

Currently talking up the sport-pilot option. There is a pretty decent LSA flight school on our field that rents allegros for $80/hr.

If he decides he wants to go for the private instead, i'll put him in touch with Doc Bruce.
 
Henning said:
Bruce may have better info, but my guess is zero chance of getting a medical, both the med and the underlying condition are disqualifying. Could go SP, but there is a question as to whether they'll be safe.
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All histories great pilots are non diagnosed ADD cases.:lol:
 
Got an email about this about a week back....was that you?

I have no idea where this came from. From time to time in aviation you hear things that started with "It can't be so it cant be so it can't be so" which becomes "the exception must be so, the exception must be so the exception must be so".

Adderal and all the stimulants are grounding. They have such a profound effect on cognitive performance and the FAA can't control whether you are on it or off it, for a part-time Rx....as in the moment yo have the accident.

I would be very surpised if there is any truth to this. I can't think of a single condition where part-time use would be appropriate. I can see how a PMS or VFS interested company might want to troll for business.....and I've been to many FAA psychiatry meetings....
 
bbchien said:
Got an email about this about a week back....was that you?



I would be very surpised if there is any truth to this.
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Negative on the e-mail.

Truth to what? An approval for part-time use?

Thanks for the response. With the exception of that quote in my original post (found it in multiple places with a google search) nothing I found on the internet suggested Adderall would be approved under any circumstances.

I did learn that Adderall is 75% dextroamphetamine which is the 'go pill' drug given to military pilots for long missions.
 
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dell30rb said:
Negative on the e-mail.

Truth to what? An approval for part-time use?

Thanks for the response. With the exception of that quote in my original post (found it in multiple places with a google search) nothing I found on the internet suggested Adderall would be approved under any circumstances.

I did learn that Adderall is 75% dextroamphetamine which is the 'go pill' drug given to military pilots for long missions.
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Renjamin, there are a lot of things the mil can do with a Flight Surgeon on the ramp, and sometimes on board. I did 36 hour patrols.

I can find NOTHING suggeting that Adderall would be approved under any circumstances, and the agency confirmed that verbally today.

"I wish it true I wish it true I wish it true" is how many of these things get started.
 
bbchien said:
"I wish it true I wish it true I wish it true" is how many of these things get started.
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I've already told my pal he has zero chance of getting certified w a prescription and that the only path I could find for getting a medical is to get off of the drug for a period of time and then take a psych eval.

Just to clarify.
 
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I was prescribed Adderall all throughout middle school and up until Sophmore year of high school when I stopped taking it. In order to get my medical when I was a Freshman in college, I had to do 17 psychological tests with a board approved psychiatrist and I had to bear the cost. It sucks, but it's worth it.
 
Darsh said:
I was prescribed Adderall all throughout middle school and up until Sophmore year of high school when I stopped taking it. In order to get my medical when I was a Freshman in college, I had to do 17 psychological tests with a board approved psychiatrist and I had to bear the cost. It sucks, but it's worth it.
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Thanks! Just curious, how bad did that hurt your wallet. And were the tests to reverse the diagnosis of ADD?
 
bbchien said:
That's usually about $2,000. I have a guy who got certified by selling his car to pay the neuro-psychologist.
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There is another potential avenue if one has a diagnosis, and that is a state shrink, they are free if you can get to one without being a full blown schizophrenic anymore.

I guess I lucked out that my dad was the state's head shrink and decided to just let me roll. It was funny when the school counselor suggested that I be medicated and he counter suggested hiring teachers that could answer a question with something beyond that which was listed in the teachers edition of the textbooks that were inaccurate to begin with and perhaps that could develop curriculums that weren't totally boring.:rofl: I think the counselor figured out where I got my attitude from at that point and gave up:dunno::lol:
 
Another way to pay for it is:
1) pass the psych evals
2) sue the incompetents who did an improper diagnosis in the first place

Not a big fan of lawsuits, but this over-drugging of our kids has got to stop, and the legal system is probably the only way it will stop.
 
Jeff Oslick said:
Another way to pay for it is:
1) pass the psych evals
2) sue the incompetents who did an improper diagnosis in the first place

Not a big fan of lawsuits, but this over-drugging of our kids has got to stop, and the legal system is probably the only way it will stop.
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No it won't.

I just deposed for 90 minutes with two of the most average members of the legal community I have ever encountered. As in, "educate me at the other guy's expense, I don't do any research before I get here". They might be good attornies, but getting knowledgeable it would seem, should get on the list.
 
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While we are on this topic - my brother's kids were prescribed Metadate and have both been on it for a while, although he may have taken his son off it as he thinks it was making him depressed.

I disagree heartily with drugging kids, but I don't know all the details and I'm not an expert so I can't butt in to my brother business.

His daughter especially is a handful and a half. No idea if she truly has ADD, but oh boy, one of the most spastic energetic kids I've ever met. Constant interrupter, has to have the spotlight 100% of the time, overshadows her older brother, etc. I know, sounds like a normal kid, right?

Is this a drug that will bar either of them from flying one day?
 
woodstock said:
His daughter especially is a handful and a half. No idea if she truly has ADD, but oh boy, one of the most spastic energetic kids I've ever met. Constant interrupter, has to have the spotlight 100% of the time, overshadows her older brother, etc. I know, sounds like a normal kid, right?
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I think it's called being a princess.
 
I'm going to hazard a guess that the diagnosis may be more important than the drug itself.
 
woodstock said:
While we are on this topic - my brother's kids were prescribed Metadate and have both been on it for a while, although he may have taken his son off it as he thinks it was making him depressed.

I disagree heartily with drugging kids, but I don't know all the details and I'm not an expert so I can't butt in to my brother business.

His daughter especially is a handful and a half. No idea if she truly has ADD, but oh boy, one of the most spastic energetic kids I've ever met. Constant interrupter, has to have the spotlight 100% of the time, overshadows her older brother, etc. I know, sounds like a normal kid, right?

Is this a drug that will bar either of them from flying one day?
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What will bar them is your Brother's posssibly inadequate workup of what the kids actually have. If he is educated and of any means at all he should have had a clinical psychologist see them and do the workup. Maybe he has.

But if the opinion was had, is qualified (Ph.D. psych with neuro fellowship) and is affirms ADD/ADHD, those kids do not belong on a flight deck.
 
Spanking your kid became illegal because there's no profit to be made. Just fine to dope them to the gills though, plenty of money there.
 
I'm curious how this all works. I'm going for my medical soon. I don't even have a primary care doc. Are they going to want old medical recs? Do they drug test at the medical? Or is this all the honor system?
 
Unregistered said:
I'm curious how this all works. I'm going for my medical soon. I don't even have a primary care doc. Are they going to want old medical recs? Do they drug test at the medical? Or is this all the honor system?
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Honor system, however if you aren't honest and get into an accident or somehow otherwise draw attention to yourself, they scrutinize all your records and then you're ****ed.
 
And the only thing they test for chemically when you go in for the FAA medical exam is sugar in your urine. But you really don't want to lie to the FAA -- eventually, they do seem to find out, and then they administer the aviation equivalent of capital punishment.
 
Henning said:
TIt was funny when the school counselor suggested that I be medicated and he counter suggested hiring teachers that could answer a question with something beyond that which was listed in the teachers edition of the textbooks that were inaccurate to begin with and perhaps that could develop curriculums that weren't totally boring.
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Henning! With a sentence like this maybe the counselor was right!!! :rofl:

To be clear, this is said in jest....

-Skip
 
I'm a doctor still in residency training. The bulk of kids we see are Medicaid patients with low socioeconomic class parents. We see tons of kids in our clinic that get diagnosed with ADHD and placed on some form of stimulant/non-stimulant for treatment. Most of us are well aware that the kids probably don't have ADHD, but instead have terrible/worthless/clueless parents. As much as we would love to counsel the parent on behavior and study skills and everything else, 99% of the time it doesn't help. A lot of us feel that placing the kids on these medications give them *some* hope of at least not getting kicked out of school or making all C's instead of D's. Never realized could be potentially making it difficult for them to be a pilot in the future, though!
 
Unregistered said:
I'm a doctor still in residency training. The bulk of kids we see are Medicaid patients with low socioeconomic class parents. We see tons of kids in our clinic that get diagnosed with ADHD and placed on some form of stimulant/non-stimulant for treatment. Most of us are well aware that the kids probably don't have ADHD, but instead have terrible/worthless/clueless parents. As much as we would love to counsel the parent on behavior and study skills and everything else, 99% of the time it doesn't help. A lot of us feel that placing the kids on these medications give them *some* hope of at least not getting kicked out of school or making all C's instead of D's. Never realized could be potentially making it difficult for them to be a pilot in the future, though!
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Will that change how you handle this in the future? Will you tell your colleagues about this?

"...you’re either part of the solution or you’re part of the problem." - Eldridge Cleaver, 1968
 
Ron Levy said:
"...you’re either part of the solution or you’re part of the problem." - Eldridge Cleaver, 1968
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I've been getting that saying wrong...
partofthesolution_f_fullpic_4.jpg
 
mrdavedpg said:
I believe the only way to get a medical, is to have the original diagnosis reversed which is expensive and could leave the OP's buddy $5k or more lighter in his wallet and still not able to get his medical.

Dr. Bruce can clarify.
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I am 25 and just recently had to do this. I was diagnosed with ADHD when I was 16 and was prescribed adderall. It took me nearly 2 full years of ridiculous testing and interviews to get my diagnosis reversed. Some of the most expensive and worthless examinations I could of ever imagined.
 
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