3 Point v. "Full Stall" Landings

MauleSkinner said:
No...I never noticed that. This doesn't appear to be a "really obscene" deck angle to me...
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A few months ago someone posted a photo of a weird black high-wing taildragger ultralight that had really long gear and the pilot sorta rode in/on it like a motorbike. That one had an obscene deck angle in the three-point attitude. Can anyone find it? I can't.

Dan
 
N1347B said:
I fly a Luscombe...it's the sound of my backside sucking the seat :D.

Deb
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Sorry, Deb...I'm not real sure what that sounds like. Could you isolate it, and post a WAV file for us? Purely for purposes of aviation safety, of course!:rofl:
 
They still work. We changed the linkage to cables to eliminate whatever problem they had, got a field approval for the mod and they are a hoot. Power-off descent at 70 mph is ~400 fpm stowed, ~1,400 fpm deployed (timed with my watch). Retract mechanism is a screen-door spring.

They won't let me participate in the spot landing contests now.

MauleSkinner said:
I was gonna ask if the L-2 still had it's spoilers...the one I flew 20-some years ago did, but most of them that I've seen had them removed.


No...that's knowing your equipment and using it :D
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wabower said:
They still work. We changed the linkage to cables to eliminate whatever problem they had, got a field approval for the mod and they are a hoot. Power-off descent at 70 mph is ~400 fpm stowed, ~1,400 fpm deployed (timed with my watch). Retract mechanism is a screen-door spring.

They won't let me participate in the spot landing contests now.
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Weren't L-3 Taylorcrafts also spoiler equipped?
 
wabower said:
They still work. We changed the linkage to cables to eliminate whatever problem they had, got a field approval for the mod and they are a hoot. Power-off descent at 70 mph is ~400 fpm stowed, ~1,400 fpm deployed (timed with my watch). Retract mechanism is a screen-door spring.

They won't let me participate in the spot landing contests now.
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What WAS the linkage?

IIRC, if you add a nice, full slip to the spoilers, it's even hootier. :D
 
MauleSkinner said:
No...I never noticed that. This doesn't appear to be a "really obscene" deck angle to me...

800px-Fi-156_Storch_left.jpg
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I think it looks obscene and butt ugly, too.

Deb
 
dmccormack said:
Nooo...that's a Storch!

Slow flying, STOL machine!!
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I know what it is. I know what it can do. Seen it.

However, that still doesn't make it pretty.

It lacks bling.

Deb
 

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N1347B said:
I know what it is. I know what it can do. Seen it.

However, that still doesn't make it pretty.

It lacks bling.

Deb
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Beauty is in the eye of the beholder comes to mind here.
 
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I'VE GOT IT!

I DO 3-POINT FULL
MUSH LANDINGS!!!

Not stalled in the Clinical sense of the word but still not able to maintain altitude at a certain airspeed and angle...?


"Suggest you buy and read:
http://www.amazon.com/Stick-Rudder-E.../dp/0070362408
__________________
Jesse"

I have had a copy of Stick and Rudder since around 1975 or so...it's dog-eared and kinda' narrly but I still have it...
Until I read it I thought "Relative Wind" was what the family endured after daddy ate cabbage for supper.:eek:

As to my "Obscene deck angle" comment I suppose I should have just said "sits at a slightly higher static angle of attack than some but not all taildraggers".
Per an Air Progress article by Budd Davisson:The Fi-156C sits at with it's nose @ 24* nose in the air and departs the earth that way. Pulling back on the stick to get to the advised 35 knot climb speed gave a climb angle of 45*. "...takeoffs took 50'...landing with 0 headwind were less than 100' @ 30 knots..."

To a C-170 driver 24* might not be so obscene...to a C-150 driver it might...
I'll have to haul out the plans to the HB and see how nose up it really is at rest...

Chris (going out to practice my 3-point Full-Mush landings)...
 
Deb, what if the Storch was polished? Would it still be ugly??? And what if it was then setting next to a painted Luscombe? (the horror, the horror..)
 
Hiperbiper said:
Per an Air Progress article by Budd Davisson:The Fi-156C sits at with it's nose @ 24* nose in the air and departs the earth that way. Pulling back on the stick to get to the advised 35 knot climb speed gave a climb angle of 45*. "...takeoffs took 50'...landing with 0 headwind were less than 100' @ 30 knots..."

To a C-170 driver 24* might not be so obscene...to a C-150 driver it might...
I'll have to haul out the plans to the HB and see how nose up it really is at rest...
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Note that the Storch has leading edge slats...makes a BIG difference in the critical AOA. My guess is that it's critical AOA is in that 24* neighborhood.

A 170, on the other hand, doesn't have those nice high-lift devices, and so sits at a lower deck angle more appropriate to its critical AOA. 24* WOULD be obscene for a 170...you wouldn't get it off the ground without raising the nose, and you're increasing takeoff drag in with the higher deck angle.
 
MauleSkinner said:
A 170, on the other hand, doesn't have those nice high-lift devices, and so sits at a lower deck angle more appropriate to its critical AOA. 24* WOULD be obscene for a 170...you wouldn't get it off the ground without raising the nose, and you're increasing takeoff drag in with the higher deck angle.
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You mean raising the tail, don't you?

Dan
 
dmccormack said:
:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Lemme guess, do you chant, "keep it straight, keep it straight, keep it straight..." just before touchdown also?
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I usually just say "Feets, don't fail me now!!" before touchdown, then "rudder rudder rudder rudder rudder..." as I roll out. :D
 
RickH said:
Deb, what if the Storch was polished? Would it still be ugly??? And what if it was then setting next to a painted Luscombe? (the horror, the horror..)
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Okay. I admit it. I like a Storch. Doesn't need to be polished. I would fly it in a heart beat.

I just wanted to hear the collective gasp of horror from male pilots when such a studly airplane was dismissed for lack of bling. :rolleyes:

I would fly a painted Luscombe, too. It's the only one available at this moment, because mine is still having the new alternator and wiring installed.

The owner said no to my flying it, and since he has to sign the logbook for my alternator installation, I didn't argue.

Deb
 
rottydaddy said:
I usually just say "Feets, don't fail me now!!" before touchdown, then "rudder rudder rudder rudder rudder..." as I roll out. :D
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I wiggle the rudder pedals on short final to confirm I have my feet properly positioned and that it's moving as expected.

It's a good habit suggested by my TW CFI -- it works!! :yesnod:
 
N1347B said:
Okay. I admit it. I like a Storch. Doesn't need to be polished. I would fly it in a heart beat.

I just wanted to hear the collective gasp of horror from male pilots when such a studly airplane was dismissed for lack of bling. :rolleyes:

I would fly a painted Luscombe, too. It's the only one available at this moment, because mine is still having the new alternator and wiring installed.

The owner said no to my flying it, and since he has to sign the logbook for my alternator installation, I didn't argue.

Deb
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Good plan. Don't make the A&P mad. Especially when you live with him. Great article in the current GAN, BTW.
 
Ghery said:
Good plan. Don't make the A&P mad. Especially when you live with him. Great article in the current GAN, BTW.
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+1 and congrats to you and Henry. Retirement is great...I don't know why I didn't do it 40 years ago!
 
RickH said:
+1 and congrats to you and Henry. Retirement is great...I don't know why I didn't do it 40 years ago!
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It is great, but so far, all we've done is work. I waiting on the fun part to start. :redface:

Deb
 
MauleSkinner said:
I've found that airplanes are a lot prettier when you can do something that no one else can even come close to ;)
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I gauge airplane aesthetics along similar lines: a Luscombe is just pretty, like any pretty thing, but a Storch also has its own beauty, because you can tell just by looking at it exactly what it does and how well it does it.
 
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