Piper Navajo N818BR down Victoria TX

RyanB

RyanB

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Looks like it just happened. Aerial surveying for 5hrs and then goes down? Fuel exhaustion? No word on pilot condition yet.

The first video shows it landing on a roadway.

sanangelolive.com

VIDEO: Plane Crashes at Victoria Intersection, Involving Three Vehicles

VICTORIA, TX — A plane crash at the intersection of Mockingbird Lane and Zac Lentz Parkway feeder road Wednesday afternoon involved three vehicles, according to the Victoria Police Department. An officer said the crash occurred around 3 p.m. after a report of an airline emergency. The status of...
sanangelolive.com sanangelolive.com

www.crossroadstoday.com

BREAKING NEWS: Plane crash in the intersection of Zac Lentz Parkway and Mockingbird

UPDATE: Five people were involved in the incident, and three people were taken to the hospital with non-life-threatening injuries. One person was transferred to an out-of-town hospital for higher-level trauma
www.crossroadstoday.com www.crossroadstoday.com

 
There's another video from behind the aircraft. Looks like he did a good job flying it all the way into the crash.
 
I'm shocked they were able to keep the expletives in as long as they did.
 
From FAA ASIAS at faa.gov--
N818BR PIPER PA-31
Highest injury: Minor
Damage: Substantial (!)
"AIRCRAFT RAN OUT OF FUEL AND MADE AN EMERGENCY LANDING ON A HIGHWAY AND STRUCK A LIGHT POLE AND TWO VEHICLES, VICTORIA, TX."

Shaking my head at running out of fuel in a Chieftain.
Thank goodness nobody on the ground was badly hurt with this type of operation.
Take off: 8:51 Local
Crash into cars: 14:00 Local
Flight time before crash: 5:09, not including run up, taxi, etc.
Fuel level before flight: Unknown
 
A couple of weeks ago the plane made a flight from Kissimmee to Lake Charles. FlightAware shows the time enroute as 4:46. Again according to FlightAware, the elapsed time on the mishap flight was 5:10. This indicates to me the operator may have been taking prior substantial risks with fuel planning.
 
I was reading an accident report where the pilot filed that he had 7 hours of fuel on board. Seven hours and ten minutes into flight, he ran the thing out of fuel. Unfortunately, he wasn't quite at the airport yet. I gave him points for nailing the fuel burn.

I won a proficiency race once, you fly over a fixed course and you had to predict your fuel burn and time. You got a point for every second and tenth of a gallon you were off. I had a score of 30, which was uncommon to win as often the winners were in single digits.
 
flyingron said:
I was reading an accident report where the pilot filed that he had 7 hours of fuel on board. Seven hours and ten minutes into flight, he ran the thing out of fuel. Unfortunately, he wasn't quite at the airport yet. I gave him points for nailing the fuel burn.
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There's another current thread about an RV-12 crash where the pilot flew 4 hours and 10 minutes with 2 takeoffs. Vans says endurance is 3 hours and 30 minutes plus a 45 minute reserve.
 
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I plan on being on the ground with no less than 10 gal remaining. When one tank gets down to 6 gal or so, that becomes the emergency tank. I then run the engine on the opposite tank, the idea being that if I miscalculated and that tank runs dry, I have enough left to restart the engine and find a suitable place to land.

Never had an issue as far as fuel planning goes, but it is nice to know you have something set aside. One benefit of flying a low wing and having to switch tanks.
 
My family lives about 5 miles from the crash site. I'd really like to know when this guy ran it out of fuel. Plenty of better options to put down in that area than on the access road of a major highway in town...right next to a high school. All of the highways that enter and leave Victoria are 4-lane divided with a turning lane in the middle and no medians. Hell, aside from some low shrubs, it's flat and arid all around the airfield he was aiming for. Even the mall parking lot right behind him would've been a better option than an access road. Or, I dunno...put it on the 4-lane divided highway right next to the access road.

This one's pretty frustrating. A lot of people hurt on the ground needlessly.
 
Brocolerio / Juan Browne has a video up. Mentioned 66 yr old pilot as well as alternate landing options shown on google maps that would have been less populated.
 
So I have a question as I have never tried this. If you run a plane out of fuel and then switch tanks does the engine fire right up or what is the process?
 
Jamie Kirk said:
So I have a question as I have never tried this. If you run a plane out of fuel and then switch tanks does the engine fire right up or what is the process?
Click to expand...
You turn on the boost pump, switch tanks, and wait about an hour and a half, nervously hoping it comes back to life. Actual time elapsed is probably about 3 seconds.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
So I have a question as I have never tried this. If you run a plane out of fuel and then switch tanks does the engine fire right up or what is the process?
Click to expand...
I wanted to find this out on case it happened to me. I was at altitude over an airport. Mine is a low wing. I did not even have to turn the boost pump on. Within a couple of seconds of the engine started right up.

But I'm sure every plane is different and in an emergency the boost pump should be turned on. The actual fuel piping layout, relative elevations of the fuel tank, and inline valves, fittings, and sensors will affect this in a carbureted system.

On fuel injected systems, it's obviously all about the fuel pumps.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
So I have a question as I have never tried this. If you run a plane out of fuel and then switch tanks does the engine fire right up or what is the process?
Click to expand...
No, not if you run a plane out of fuel. However, I have never tried this either.

But, if you run a tank out of fuel then maybe (see above).

("But Mister FSDO, the engine fired up 3 other times before on that flight...")
 
How many hours must one need before fuel exhaustion isn’t a concern for one’s prospective employer?
 
KE5BM said:
My family lives about 5 miles from the crash site. I'd really like to know when this guy ran it out of fuel. Plenty of better options to put down in that area than on the access road of a major highway in town...right next to a high school. All of the highways that enter and leave Victoria are 4-lane divided with a turning lane in the middle and no medians. Hell, aside from some low shrubs, it's flat and arid all around the airfield he was aiming for. Even the mall parking lot right behind him would've been a better option than an access road. Or, I dunno...put it on the 4-lane divided highway right next to the access road.

This one's pretty frustrating. A lot of people hurt on the ground needlessly.
Click to expand...
I understand what you're saying, but as someone who's had three engine failures, I don't second guess where someone puts a plane down. One of them I landed on a road, one I landed at the airport, one I hit trees (not recommended).

On the one where I made it back to the airport, I was worried that I wasn't going to make it. Between the airport and me was a neighborhood. It was a towered airport and at one point I told them I didn't think I was going to make it. I was seconds away from turning away and heading toward a park where the outcome wouldn't have been good when I decided I had it made.

When I landed on a road, I flew over the top of a car. The lady in the car told me she had been watching me circle. If she hadn't moved off of the road, I was going to land in a cornfield and it was plowed across my path.

We all think we can do it, but every time you pull the nose up a little, you lose airspeed and range. If you don't pull up, the ground is getting closer with no go-around option. Pull up a little too much and the ground gets closer quickly. I think I can make it to that open field... well no... well maybe...

If I didn't know the outcome of the Navajo crash, just seeing the first part of the video, I would have thought it was a great choice.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
So I have a question as I have never tried this. If you run a plane out of fuel and then switch tanks does the engine fire right up or what is the process?
Click to expand...
Just for training purposes, while over the field at a safe altitude I turned the fuel selector to the off position. Power was set to about 70%. The engine quit about 10-15 seconds later. Fuel back on, electric pump on and the engine was running again less than 5 seconds later.
 
Lowflynjack said:
I understand what you're saying, but as someone who's had three engine failures, I don't second guess where someone puts a plane down. One of them I landed on a road, one I landed at the airport, one I hit trees (not recommended).

On the one where I made it back to the airport, I was worried that I wasn't going to make it. Between the airport and me was a neighborhood. It was a towered airport and at one point I told them I didn't think I was going to make it. I was seconds away from turning away and heading toward a park where the outcome wouldn't have been good when I decided I had it made.

When I landed on a road, I flew over the top of a car. The lady in the car told me she had been watching me circle. If she hadn't moved off of the road, I was going to land in a cornfield and it was plowed across my path.

We all think we can do it, but every time you pull the nose up a little, you lose airspeed and range. If you don't pull up, the ground is getting closer with no go-around option. Pull up a little too much and the ground gets closer quickly. I think I can make it to that open field... well no... well maybe...

If I didn't know the outcome of the Navajo crash, just seeing the first part of the video, I would have thought it was a great choice.
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What video?
 
Looking at maps, it's seems pretty obvious he was trying to get to the airport. When he ran out of time, there isn't really anywhere else to go. The north side of the freeway is all trees, the everything else is pretty congested, including a high school.
 

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Lowflynjack said:
I understand what you're saying, but as someone who's had three engine failures, I don't second guess where someone puts a plane down.
Click to expand...
:hairraise: Dang... I know everyone's got a "thing" when it comes to failures on aircraft, but I'm glad mine is just flat tires and not engines. :o
Lowflynjack said:
Looking at maps, it's seems pretty obvious he was trying to get to the airport. When he ran out of time, there isn't really anywhere else to go. The north side of the freeway is all trees, the everything else is pretty congested, including a high school.
Click to expand...
The only thing I'm wondering is why he didn't try for any of the airports that were closer, unless the engine(s) failed quite late in the game. It seems like it was a fairly constant descent all the way down, though, so I would guess an engine quit before he even started for the airport, and he had at least two better options closer.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
:hairraise: Dang... I know everyone's got a "thing" when it comes to failures on aircraft, but I'm glad mine is just flat tires and not engines. :eek:
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Yeah, I don't ever want another one! Two were caused by bad mechanics!

The best story was my friends Aeronca Chief. The engine started losing power, but I could get it to smooth out by pulling carb heat, but it would get rough again as soon as I pushed the knob back in. It got steadily worse until it eventually quit. I landed and rolled off the runway. A friend of mine walked over and told everyone to be quiet. He opened the fuel cap and we heard a sucking sound. The airplane owner had replaced the glass and gaskets on the Model A fuel gauge about a week before. It turned out, the previous owner had replaced the fuel cap 20+ years ago and put the wrong one on that didn't have a vent. Luckily for him, the fuel gauge was letting air into the tank. My friend had no idea he was sealing up the only vent to the tank. He got the right cap on it and we never had an issue again.
 
Wild that your friend thought to open the tank that way. The crazy things that happen in machines! It's all so simple yet so easy to screw up!
 
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