Where's Dr. Bruce?

No matter how you look at it, sensitivity and the internet don't mix.
 
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valittu said:
No matter how you look at it, sensitivity and the internet don't mix.
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The first rule of the internet is that a person's testicles grow in proportion to their level of anonymity.

Everybody's a tough guy from a 1000 miles away (of course that is just a day trip in a plane) :D
 
Doggtyred said:
Without beating up on Jay any more than necessary, he ran me off from ever wanting to go to his hotel less than 200 miles from me, or ever wanting to recommend it to anyone I knew going there…

Its a shame.. I really liked him when I met him in person at Osh back in 2002.. when he was in the paper business and not the hotel business.. (I was the one who tracked him down through campsite registration/plane parking for the first time… giving birth to the notion of the usenet Rec.Aviation.piloting/homebuilts party they had for the next several years there…). Heck.. he's the reason I came here from usenet all those years ago.
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I've found Jay & Mary to be not only gracious hosts, but very good friends.
 
I just tried to look at the thread but it says I don't have access.. Was it in the spin zone?
 
Jeanie said:
I just tried to look at the thread but it says I don't have access.. Was it in the spin zone?
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It's there now if it didn't start there. It's really an embarrassing thread to the pilot community and should be in a restricted search access database unavailable to the general public. If the GP could read it, they'd demand all those little planes and their pilots banned from the skies.
 
Well, nevermind, I don't need to spend time reading vitriol. It's a shame folks get so testy and wigged out over stuff.
 
kyleb said:
Bruce has a hard time walking away from an argument and has a tendency to take things to a personal level. Those are not good characteristics for enjoying your experience on the interweb.
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Agreed.

There are idiots everywhere and the idiots change from day to day - there are some days I take on the title - hopefully I apologize to those offended - but hell - its a complex social world. :mad2::mad2:
 
You mean the thread were Dr Bruce throws in a jab at Jay about zoom climes on his first post ;)
 
Hmmmmm..
 

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asgcpa said:
I talk to Bruce here and there as he is my AME and a valuable resource on other matters. I spoke to him last week to get him the data for my SI. This attack on him has been going on for quite some time where people open their yaps and make baseless statements and argue on medical topics. The accusations of greed and questioning of integrity was the final straw. Whether or not Bruce is thinned skin, we could all rely on him coming here nightly and answering questions. Some of those on the forum had their mouth in motion before their brains were engaged. The actions of a few ruined it for all of us. There really should be a modecum of decorum here. At least I can, as many of you, can contact him off the board.
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Agree. Anyone who thinks Dr. Bruce is even the slightest bit weak just doesn't know this guy.

Dr. Bruce is incredibly strong, generous, and intelligent. I wouldn't be flying if it weren't for him
 
CT Arrow said:
Why not simply take it off line, resolve the problem and stop the forum drama.
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A good point. I'd answer (though not for the good doctor, of course), sometimes you need to make a point.
 
RJM62 said:
Enough with the blame game! Let's arrange an airlift to transport POA'ers to Doc Bruce's home, bearing gifts of Kaliber and the finest char-broiled meats, and humbly beseech him to return. Inasmuch as we'll have a common purpose, we can even cost-share.

-Rich
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Here, here!
 
Henning said:
More than that, Bruce actually gets the rules changed! One of the problems he runs into is the people that don't like the rules prove the issues of why the rules are there and make it more difficult to change them.

Do you think one of the SSRI taking airmen that now has a medical has given Bruce one cent towards his expenses, not to mention time, to make that SI possible? Did Bruce ever ask for a dime? Did he put up a Kickstarter page? No, he did that on his time and expense which he will never recover on helping people getting their issuance.
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Excellent point. If that's not the definition of beneficence then I don't know what is.
 
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spiderweb said:
Agree. Anyone who thinks Dr. Bruce is even the slightest bit weak just doesn't know this guy.

Dr. Bruce is incredibly strong, generous, and intelligent. I wouldn't be flying if it weren't for him
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Everybody has weaknesses. Everyone.

Everyone has a button or three. Push one of them and they'll get ****ed.
 
Being of strong mind on the internet is weakness. Be water my friends.
 
I am a reader of this forum and not an active participant. But I just can't get over how ridiculous this thread is. Dr. Bruce has, and continues to, provide a tremendous service to the aviation community. Thanks to his work there are countless people still enjoying flight that would have been needlessly grounded without his work. We all owe him a debt of gratitude for that service.

That said, his behavior in that thread and his subsequent decision to leave the forum reminds me of a three year old. Whining that someone made a personal attack against you while viciously attacking them just doesn't work. Jay's comment about the person that was defending the medical process also being the one that seeks to gain from the situation touched on a sticky topic. While I don't believe that Dr. Bruce has anything but the best interest of pilots at heart and that his first post was geared toward working within the situation we have and was not intending to defend the position I did have the same thought that Jay posted while reading what the good Doctor wrote.

In the end two of the people that write things that I enjoy reading got into a fight. One of them proved to the world that he may be highly educated but decided to act like a child. For everyone's sake I hope he moves beyond this position and finds his way back to the forum. There is a large segment of our population that would love to get involved in flight but don't because of a medical issue that he could very easily resolve for them. By taking his knowledge to the red board means he is still available to those of us that have been involved in this community for a while a would be pilot isn't going to be a paid member of an aviation advocacy group in most cases. And at the end of the day, that's the real loser in all of this. We know how to get in touch with Dr. Bruce if we need his services. Those that may need him most do not.
 
You can't bite the hand that feeds you. If it wasn't for Dr Bruce I would not be able to fly. He has given hours of FREE advice and then Jay accused him of milking the system. I would be ****ed off too. Jay threw the first punch. I tell Bruce you said hello if I see him on my way through 3 MY on Saturday.
 
I have been a reader of this site significantly longer than a member, but reading that thread sure was interesting. In the end it comes down to two things: If someone needs medical advice then the very knowledgable Doc is the one to go to. If someone needs hotel/motel advice then Jay would be a good resource. Why two people got so worked up about a simple medical statement is beyond me, but Jay does appear to owe the Dr. an apology and perhaps the Doc should apologize to Jay for his smart aleck cracks too. In the end I believe both will come back as they realize that you cant always agree.
 
Brad Z said:
Dr. Bruce can't seem to figure out how to use the "ignore" feature. I'm not sure I get the whole "take my ball and go home" routine though...this is the internet; stupidity is a given.
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I agree with this... I think Jay was out of line, but I also think that if you enjoy giving advice and helping others (and why else would Bruce have been doing this), you can expect a certain amount of crap. The two viable choices are to ignore the bad and enjoy the good, or (and this may be what Bruce decided) to stop the activity.
 
TMetzinger said:
I agree with this... I think Jay was out of line, but I also think that if you enjoy giving advice and helping others (and why else would Bruce have been doing this), you can expect a certain amount of crap. The two viable choices are to ignore the bad and enjoy the good, or (and this may be what Bruce decided) to stop the activity.
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I can totally understand where the good Dr. is coming from, there are so many experts on any given subject here who needs another one.
 
wsuffa said:
Then why take a shot at him?
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Just answered the Ops question. He seems like a great guy and has helped many a person on here. Its not personal. Just one mans opinion. I didn't think the forum rules stated I had to be a doctor to have one. I will retract it then if I have to be a doctor... sorry!
 
Doctor bruce may just be tired of idiotic questions and petty arguments. How old is DR. Bruce? Does he currently have a practice? What kind? Or is he retired? These factors may influence where he do be. One sure does not have to be a doctor to take a verbal shot at one. I've gone to a couple that were really terrible.
 
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asgcpa said:
I talk to Bruce here and there as he is my AME and a valuable resource on other matters. I spoke to him last week to get him the data for my SI. This attack on him has been going on for quite some time where people open their yaps and make baseless statements and argue on medical topics. The accusations of greed and questioning of integrity was the final straw. Whether or not Bruce is thinned skin, we could all rely on him coming here nightly and answering questions. Some of those on the forum had their mouth in motion before their brains were engaged. The actions of a few ruined it for all of us. There really should be a modecum of decorum here. At least I can, as many of you, can contact him off the board.
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How many highly talented professionals provide free professional services on the internet on a continual basis? I've seen some good legal advice here on occasion but it's usually more generic than what Bruce handed out.

Personally I think that alone deserves special consideration. I know Bruce as a hard time "discussing" issues with someone he feels is "misinformed" but what really gets to him is when someone without his credentials argues with his medically related position. I've told him before to just ignore it but he admitted he just can't let something that's medically incorrect go unchallenged.
 
gismo said:
How many highly talented professionals provide free professional services on the internet on a continual basis?

A lot. That is how you build a personal brand and that is how Bruce built his. Not saying he is in it for $.

I've seen some good legal advice here on occasion but it's usually more generic than what Bruce handed out.

Personally I think that alone deserves special consideration.

Sure. I let my kid run wild in public because she is a special angel. All those other misbehaving kids have terrible parents that should be ashamed of themselves.

I know Bruce as a hard time "discussing" issues with someone he feels is "misinformed" but what really gets to him is when someone without his credentials argues with his medically related position. I've told him before to just ignore it but he admitted he just can't let something that's medically incorrect go unchallenged.

Someone played the 'credentials' card grab your ass and run.
He is a victim of his own personality, same as the rest of us. The world ain't going to change to soothe someone's personality no matter how saintly they might be.
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Remember Momma said it takes two to fight...
 
gismo said:
How many highly talented professionals provide free professional services on the internet on a continual basis? I've seen some good legal advice here on occasion but it's usually more generic than what Bruce handed out.

Personally I think that alone deserves special consideration. I know Bruce as a hard time "discussing" issues with someone he feels is "misinformed" but what really gets to him is when someone without his credentials argues with his medically related position. I've told him before to just ignore it but he admitted he just can't let something that's medically incorrect go unchallenged.
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That's tough... I think all of us who are experts in our fields have a hard time with folks saying nonsense about the stuff we care about. But that's just how people are.

And in the cases in question (sleep apnea), it's not just about medicine... it's about politics. And politics has very little logic beside what the mob wants.
 
Dr Bruce has given a LOT of free advice here.
I can understand why he gets frustrated. Look at some of the medical threads. People ask questions Dr Bruce tell them what the FAA will want. People will either keep asking more stuff and Bruce will tell them the same thing AGAIN.
Or people will say that is stupid why do they need that. He does not make the rules he is just telling you what you will need.
 
ron22 said:
Dr Bruce has given a LOT of free advice here.
I can understand why he gets frustrated. Look at some of the medical threads. People ask questions Dr Bruce tell them what the FAA will want. People will either keep asking more stuff and Bruce will tell them the same thing AGAIN.
Or people will say that is stupid why do they need that. He does not make the rules he is just telling you what you will need.
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Most do not want to hear the truth. They like wild and inaccurate stories posted by some that are in essence compulsive liars.

When someone offers factual information based upon real experience it's just not as exciting or fun.

Then you have the sciolist that feel compelled to argue against the professionals.

Dr. Bruce is an asset to have around for sure.
 
TMetzinger said:
I agree with this... I think Jay was out of line, but I also think that if you enjoy giving advice and helping others (and why else would Bruce have been doing this), you can expect a certain amount of crap. The two viable choices are to ignore the bad and enjoy the good, or (and this may be what Bruce decided) to stop the activity.
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Ehh...

Dr. Bruce was having a bad day that happened to coincide with Jay's venting / verbal diarrhea against the med profession after finding out he had not gotten *all* the options WRT a diagnosis. Then it became a really bad day.
 
warthog1984 said:
Ehh...

Dr. Bruce was having a bad day that happened to coincide with Jay's venting / verbal diarrhea against the med profession after finding out he had not gotten *all* the options WRT a diagnosis. Then it became a really bad day.
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IIRC Honeck was advised after the first diagnosis to seek another opinion. He was also advised on how to get a waiver (which in his case would have been easy.

Instead he just used it as a ***** and moan session.
 
Doc and Jay are both good guys in the larger war against aviation apathy. Doc against the apathy inherent in the silly medical system that had another flight crewmember with a 1st Class drop dead at the controls a couple weeks ago, Jay against the apathy of Wichita and the dead GA single industry that hasn't innovated squat in 30 years.
 
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