What Should I charge

Tom-D

Tom-D

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Tom-D
for weighing an aircraft for a new weight and balance, what paper work would you expect.

I'm considering buying a set of electronic scales , they are a considerable investment.
 
Out of curiosity, do the scales and software also aid in determining where the CG is during the weighing?
 
Tom-D said:
for weighing an aircraft for a new weight and balance, what paper work would you expect.

I'm considering buying a set of electronic scales , they are a considerable investment.
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I suspect a lot of people really don't want to know what their planes really weigh! But when someone needs it, I'd assume it would be worth a few hundred dollars. Probably less work than a prop balance, but with a bit more paperwork.
 
I think I paid $150 when I got mine done, received a new W&B sheet and a log book entry.
 
I'd be interested to see what guidance you've found that provides any kind of standards for aircraft scales. Certainly there are scales specifically made for weighing aircraft, but does that preclude a properly calibrated set of race car, or bathroom scales for that matter being used?
 
ScottH said:
I'd be interested to see what guidance you've found that provides any kind of standards for aircraft scales. Certainly there are scales specifically made for weighing aircraft, but does that preclude a properly calibrated set of race car, or bathroom scales for that matter being used?
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Any scale will work as long as it's properly calibrated. I have a set of digital race car scales I've used for years.
 
$200.

you have to buy the scales
you have to calibrate them every, what 3 years?
you have to buy your training
you have to do the drug test
you have to drag the scales out
you have to open the hangar and position the plane
You have to level the airplane and set the wheels properly on the scales
You have to drain the tanks
you have to record the results
you have to do the math
you have to do a new wt & balance
you have to re-fuel the airplane
you have to do a log entry
you have to get the airplane back out of your hangar
you have to put the scales away
you have to babysit the owner the whole time

make that $250
 
Normal price in my area is $150-200, with the caveat that "you want to get all your junk out first" because they drain the tanks and weigh the plane and do the paperwork and if you had sandbags in the back, well they're part of the empty weight now.
 
I think it would take a long time to get your money back. I really don't see a lot of business weighing airplanes. The few times I've had to do it I borrowed a pals race scales. With four electronic scales you don't really need calibration because it is virtually impossible for all four of them to be in error by the exact same amount. The same principle applied when using three inertial navigation units in flight - very unlikely that one would be correct while the other two were in error and in exact agreement with each other.

One business strategy that might work is to offer the service REALLY cheap, like $50. That might draw enough folks out of the woodwork who's airplanes haven't actually been weighed in 30 years, to get your money back.
 
Geico266 said:
I rented the scales from my FBO for $50 when I weighed the RV I built.
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That would never happen at my work. If you rent a tool from the repair station, it has to back through the calibration lab when it is returned. That's any calibrated tool that leaves repair station control.
 
When using bathroom scales, use a piece of wood to place the weight even over the scale. If you do not do this it will lock the scale. Then stand on the scale and make sure it weighs you or the reading is correct and the scale does not lock. Once you put the airplane on the scales make sure the scales again are not locked but move even if you just barley touch the airplane.
I have used this method with good results many times. I also weigh my airplane once a year or every condition inspection. This gets logged every year. I thought everyone did this.

Tony
 
It depends.
Are you going to travel?
Are you doing it at a set location where its set up?
Do you have a computer set up to input data quickly and print?
Are you going to prep the a/c for weighing?
How ever long it takes you. +some for cal and such.
 
flyingmoose said:
How ever long it takes you. +some for cal and such.
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And $250 seems very short to me. No it's not difficult, but you still need to be compensated for it.

If this includes redoing the equipment list or re-creating one that was lost eons ago from the guy's airplane, add more time to that.
 
Trying to get people to pay $150. to weigh their aircraft just to update their weight and balance information is a looser. The only thing cheap in aviation is the pilots.
 
Some owners threaten violence if anyone gets near their plane with a set of scales. :D

If it were me, I'd charge my normal hourly rate + some extra nominal fee to help cover the scales and periodic calibration services. Anyone that wants their plane weighed will likely know the costs involved with scales and should be willing to pay a fair amount. The rest, well, probably don't want to know the answer and especially don't want to pay for it.
 
I've seen some pretty messed up weight & balance / equipment list records :nonod:


Year after year, no one gives a crap so nothing ever changes.
 
Paid 150 a few years ago after updating the panel,well worth it as I got a weight loss on empty weight.
 
Any race shop/speed shop will have a set of calibrated scales. They hook up to a computer and can be used for weighing most planes. There's four scales, but you only need to use three of them.
 
I think 200-250 is a very fair price. I hope you don't have to invest a lot of money for an accurate readout. It ties up a shop and takes time. I'm all for paying a good airplane mechanic a decent wage. They have saved me several times.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
I think 200-250 is a very fair price. I hope you don't have to invest a lot of money for an accurate readout. It ties up a shop and takes time. I'm all for paying a good airplane mechanic a decent wage. They have saved me several times.
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Depends what neighborhood you're in, but if you charge $200-250 you might not make anything.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
I think 200-250 is a very fair price. I hope you don't have to invest a lot of money for an accurate readout. It ties up a shop and takes time. I'm all for paying a good airplane mechanic a decent wage. They have saved me several times.
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400 for a load cell
750 for a reader
35 for a hook up cable
1400.
 
Tom-D said:
400 for a load cell
750 for a reader
35 for a hook up cable
1400.
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So after 10 you start making a profit on the gear. What about calibration costs/weights? You gonna do enough weighing to make it worthwhile?
 
Henning said:
So after 10 you start making a profit on the gear. What about calibration costs/weights? You gonna do enough weighing to make it worthwhile?
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The new era electronic load cells are self calibrating.

We'll see
 
3 hours at your labor rate. Lots of labor can go into prepping. You made need to deflate and re service a strut to achieve level etc.
 
$100 +$0.10 a pound +$50 for the envelope graph.
 
Henning said:
I'm going to pay $400+ to get my plane weighed? Not a chance when another guy will do it for $150.
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But you were the one that said:
Depends what neighborhood you're in, but if you charge $200-250 you might not make anything.
 
JOhnH said:
But you were the one that said:
Depends what neighborhood you're in, but if you charge $200-250 you might not make anything.
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Exactly, if you charge $200-250, you likely won't get any business because someone will probably be cheaper.
 
I don't think there's a business model that justifies the purchase of scales to be in the weighing business. However to have on hand like any other expensive shop tool is another matter. How many times have you been brought an airplane with undocumented radio removals, installations, interior, etc. that would take forever to research and calculate the CG mathematically? In those cases, you save yourself time, have some idea that the numbers are correct.. And probably still save your customer money while getting shop rate for the actual time you spend.
 
ScottH said:
I don't think there's a business model that justifies the purchase of scales to be in the weighing business. However to have on hand like any other expensive shop tool is another matter. How many times have you been brought an airplane with undocumented radio removals, installations, interior, etc. that would take forever to research and calculate the CG mathematically? In those cases, you save yourself time, have some idea that the numbers are correct.. And probably still save your customer money while getting shop rate for the actual time you spend.
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Yep, they're a great CYA for shops that do mods.
 
ScottH said:
I don't think there's a business model that justifies the purchase of scales to be in the weighing business. However to have on hand like any other expensive shop tool is another matter...
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Exactly, if it's a tool you think you could make use of like any other tool you shouldn't have to be dreaming up what kind of premium you are going to charge to get it to pay for itself. I mean really, one of those fancy Champion spark plug cleaner/testers would cost you more than a decent set of scales and nobody scratches their chin trying to figure out how they can make a living cleaning spark plugs. If you want to do a weight and balance do it based on time at the shop rate.
 
I paid a something like $200 to have the Navion weighed after it's restoration.
Make sure you do it indoors. Any breeze at all is going to change the readings (you know....wings generate lift).
 
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