What Am I Getting Into?

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Hello everyone. I am currently still in high school planning to graduate in a year. I want to pursue a career in avionics/aviation (pilot) and I want to know some basic information on the career, what is expected from me, requirements, where to study etc. I want to get a better knowledge about what I am getting into. Thanks.

 

[denverpilot]

Stand by, you'll get lots of answers...

First though, the word "avionics" is a mixture of "aviation" and "electronics".

Seeing avionics and pilot together as your career path, makes me think you might not know what the term avionics means.

Avionics technicians usually work installing and removing the electronics from aircraft and repairing and/or testing them on an electronics workbench.

 

[Jim Logajan]

Do you want to be involved in the design of avionics? If so, you really need to get a degree in electronics with plenty of computer science thrown in. A typical college EE course should also provide enough physics background to get the grounding in basic aerodynamics you'd need, since modern avionics is a broad field that includes all sorts gadgets.

 

[bigblockz8]

Well I see pilot in there so one teen to another, prepare to lose all of the money you have. What you're getting into needs to be labeled as a drug. Akin to meth you will beg,borrow, and steal to get your fix. Avionics? I'm confused but best of luck to you.

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

I guess what I meant to say was a career in being a pilot. I guess not avionics. Excuse my ignorance I just want to know what I'm in for if I follow that career path.

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Greg, why do you label it as a drug? I don't really understand the comparison. Is it a wrong decision?

 

[Rigged4Flight]

I guess what I meant to say was a career in being a pilot. I guess not avionics. Excuse my ignorance I just want to know what I'm in for if I follow that career path.

Everyone had to start somewhere, and I'm sure before any of us knew what aviation/avionics meant we would have been just as apt to use them incorrectly as well. Welcome to the forum. I'm sure you'll get lots of feedback, some of it may conflict with others, and in the end you'll plot your course and be just fine.

Greg, why do you label it as a drug? I don't really understand the comparison. Is it a wrong decision?

It's an expensive habit, hard to put down, and will consume your life if you let it.

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Yeah I'm kinda new to all of this. Just thought I should start getting serious about finding a career in life. Motivation is what I need. Thanks.

 

[Henning]

Yeah I'm kinda new to all of this. Just thought I should start getting serious about finding a career in life. Motivation is what I need. Thanks.

Run the **** away from aviation and piloting as fast as you can, that's aviation career advice. Avionics techs make good steady money though.

 

[Velocity173]

Yeah I'm kinda new to all of this. Just thought I should start getting serious about finding a career in life. Motivation is what I need. Thanks.

Andrew it would be easier to answer your question if you gave us more information. There are many sectors of aviation that you can go into. Something must have influenced you to want to become a pilot. Are you looking at being an airline pilot, helicopter pilot, flight instructor, possibly the military?

 

[jnmeade]

At the macro level, you can compare job outlooks by reference to the Occupational Outlook Handbook, which you may already know from high school counselors. If not, here's a page that addresses some aviation related topics.

It gives training requirements, salary range, working conditions, prospects for job growth of time, etc. It's most helpful at the "big picture" level and doesn't help very much in a specific, local situation. It's a place to start and doesn't take long, so it's worth a look.

http://www.bls.gov/ooh/transportation-and-material-moving/home.htm

 

[Henning]

I'll bet it even tells about the upcoming pilot shortage.

Your chances of having a good solid career as a pilot are slim anymore, very slim. The only people I know happy with their flying career are all either Pt91 or retired A scale airline pilots.

 

[gismo]

Greg, why do you label it as a drug? I don't really understand the comparison. Is it a wrong decision?

What Greg was implying is that for many of us, flying (almost any flying) is psychologically addicting. IOW, if you have a serious passion to fly, you may find that said passion impacts your life in many ways (some good some bad).

 

[ja_user]

Are you a cheap (thrifty) no-it-all yet? If not, work on that first

 

[MAKG1]

There are many, many things one can get passionate about. If you aren't already there with piloting, pick something else. There are quite a number of aviation careers that don't involve sitting in the front seats, if it really does have to be aviation (including the avionics tech mentioned -- I'll add aerospace engineering). Find a good day job and pilot for fun.

 

[RV10flyer]

Andrew,

I wanted to be a military pilot at your age. Joined the Army as a UH-60A mechanic to learn the bird. Within a year was accepted to helicopter flight training. Turned it down because I could not see spending 6 more yrs after a year at Ft. Rucker. I then thought I'd do my remaining time and get my A&P. They were needing 44,000 A&P's- what a joke that turned out to be. I sent out 120 resumes and got one call. Overhauled jet engines for 4 years and used my GI Bill for HVAC schooling. Worked in that industry for 4 yrs then started my own business. Obtained my pp certificate. Built our own 4 place experimental and now traveling the country with the family. Pilot/A&P jobs are glamourized too much and qualified individuals are a dime a dozen due to the military. Pick something you love doing that nobody else wants to do...dirty jobs. You will always have work. Get a good education, get a job, work hard, set goals, save and find someone to achieve those goals with you when you are ready. You can be or do nearly anything you want to do in life. You don't have to be rich or be Einstein. Good Luck!

 

[david0tey]

My advice would be to take a discovery flight and you should have your answer by the time you land. If you decide it is what you want, don't let anybody on this message board tell you otherwise. You will have to make sacrifices if you are serious about pursuing this, but in my limited experience, it is all worth it. You can make it work if you really want to but this has to be a job that you will do in the long run because you love it, not because you want to be rich. I have made my peace with that, and I won't let anybody else decide my career path for me.

 

[Henning]

Are you a cheap (thrifty) know-it-all yet? If not, work on that first

FTFY

 

[Threefingeredjack]

Andrew, flying is something you have to totally commit to. 100% Nothing halfway will serve you well in aviation. If you have a burning desire to fly and are committed to letting nothing stand in your way then you might make it. I took a very difficult route, sacrificed all I had to give and even then depended on a little luck to get selected for a military flight track.

All that being said I had a singularly rewarding career serving my country and helping bring people in distress to safety, and in many cases being the difference between life and death for them. I got to fly some of the best machines out there and work and fly with some of the finest people on the planet. Good Luck.

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Andrew it would be easier to answer your question if you gave us more information. There are many sectors of aviation that you can go into. Something must have influenced you to want to become a pilot. Are you looking at being an airline pilot, helicopter pilot, flight instructor, possibly the military?

Well what I had in mind was to join like the Air Guard, get my training and hours there and then go to flight school. I've always been interested in flight and I really do want to be an airline pilot. I know I have to work my way up but from what I am hearing, it seems like there's a slim chance of achieving this...

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

There are many, many things one can get passionate about. If you aren't already there with piloting, pick something else. There are quite a number of aviation careers that don't involve sitting in the front seats, if it really does have to be aviation (including the avionics tech mentioned -- I'll add aerospace engineering). Find a good day job and pilot for fun.

Why can't "a good day job" be a pilot? Is there too much competition for that?

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

My advice would be to take a discovery flight and you should have your answer by the time you land. If you decide it is what you want, don't let anybody on this message board tell you otherwise. You will have to make sacrifices if you are serious about pursuing this, but in my limited experience, it is all worth it. You can make it work if you really want to but this has to be a job that you will do in the long run because you love it, not because you want to be rich. I have made my peace with that, and I won't let anybody else decide my career path for me.

Thanks for the advice but is there really a slim chance of actually becoming an airline pilot? I want to stay positive but I want to be real too.

 

[PBristolJr]

Well what I had in mind was to join like the Air Guard, get my training and hours there and then go to flight school. I've always been interested in flight and I really do want to be an airline pilot. I know I have to work my way up but from what I am hearing, it seems like there's a slim chance of achieving this...

Not sure what you want to fly in the ANG, but chances are if you're going to apply you will have already had your private, instrument, etc. You don't join, then get flight hours, then go to pilot training.

Have you been up in a plane while you were at the controls? If not, take a discovery flight and that will be an instant go/no go indication of whether or not you will pursue this career field.

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Andrew, flying is something you have to totally commit to. 100% Nothing halfway will serve you well in aviation. If you have a burning desire to fly and are committed to letting nothing stand in your way then you might make it. I took a very difficult route, sacrificed all I had to give and even then depended on a little luck to get selected for a military flight track.

All that being said I had a singularly rewarding career serving my country and helping bring people in distress to safety, and in many cases being the difference between life and death for them. I got to fly some of the best machines out there and work and fly with some of the finest people on the planet. Good Luck.

I appreciate the advice but when you say "might" it sounds like there is not much opportunity in becoming a pilot. Is that true? If I really put my mind and heart to it, I know I will try my 100% best. But is the effort going to pay off in the end?

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Not sure what you want to fly in the ANG, but chances are if you're going to apply you will have already had your private, instrument, etc. You don't join, then get flight hours, then go to pilot training.

Have you been up in a plane while you were at the controls? If not, take a discovery flight and that will be an instant go/no go indication of whether or not you will pursue this career field.

Well I just thought I could get my training, hours and education in the ANG. I've flown many times as a passenger but never been in the controls. This career field seems harder than I thought to be successful in. Am I up against too much competition?

 

[denverpilot]

Why can't "a good day job" be a pilot? Is there too much competition for that?

At the "lower rungs", yes. Google "crash pad" for a little insight into how young First Officers survive Airline life these days. Also look up starting salaries. You're broke. Real broke, for a number of years.

There's jobs out there. You just have to be so interested in the job for the job's sake that you don't start truly earning a living until your 30s.

It takes significant work and planning to hit everything just right to fly for a living. It can be done.

If you love the job, you usually get somewhere after a while. There's a few young pros on the board here who can relate their experiences, and probably can explain why young Flight Instructors always look so skinny.

The upside is that in this economy, many other jobs are the same way. Law school grads aren't exactly enjoying themselves with 20 years of student loans to pay back either...

Aviation has always been this way, but We The People have mortgaged away the earning potential of so many industries, it's really tough for you young guys.

Some people here overstate it. They say it's "impossible". I don't say that, but you'd better be very flexible and willing to move to the jobs. Aviation is a mobile business and the businesses come and go.

Hard work and lots of personal sacrifice, you can make it, usually.

There's also lots of schools with flashy ads that will promise the world out there. Keep in mind that their primary goal is to get your money or the government's student loan money in their pockets.

If you apply yourself you can also be a good pilot when you leave one of them, but if you try to skate through using only their curriculum, you'll just be where every other student is when you complete the program.

Your logbook more than anything determines your fate in aviation. Fly your butt off, above all else...

 

[DavidWhite]

It's not too bad. I already have a couple job offers as a flight instructor, and I'm not a flight instructor yet. If you want to fly there are ways to make it work.

 

[denverpilot]

It's not too bad. I already have a couple job offers as a flight instructor, and I'm not a flight instructor yet. If you want to fly there are ways to make it work.

You do have to admit that you have a unique experience though, Sir David. Very few folks your age have the funding to operate a privately owned 172.

You wouldn't be getting those offers if you had only minimum standards hours in your logbook. Ya know?

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

At the "lower rungs", yes. Google "crash pad" for a little insight into how young First Officers survive Airline life these days. Also look up starting salaries. You're broke. Real broke, for a number of years.

There's jobs out there. You just have to be so interested in the job for the job's sake that you don't start truly earning a living until your 30s.

It takes significant work and planning to hit everything just right to fly for a living. It can be done.

If you love the job, you usually get somewhere after a while. There's a few young pros on the board here who can relate their experiences, and probably can explain why young Flight Instructors always look so skinny.

The upside is that in this economy, many other jobs are the same way. Law school grads aren't exactly enjoying themselves with 20 years of student loans to pay back either...

Aviation has always been this way, but We The People have mortgaged away the earning potential of so many industries, it's really tough for you young guys.

Some people here overstate it. They say it's "impossible". I don't say that, but you'd better be very flexible and willing to move to the jobs. Aviation is a mobile business and the businesses come and go.

Hard work and lots of personal sacrifice, you can make it, usually.

There's also lots of schools with flashy ads that will promise the world out there. Keep in mind that their primary goal is to get your money or the government's student loan money in their pockets.

If you apply yourself you can also be a good pilot when you leave one of them, but if you try to skate through using only their curriculum, you'll just be where every other student is when you complete the program.

Your logbook more than anything determines your fate in aviation. Fly your butt off, above all else...

So while working my way up to the job I want as a pilot, what are some of the jobs I should look at while I'm in my 20s? You say I won't start earning a living until my 30's so what should I do until I get to that age?

 

[DavidWhite]

You do have to admit that you have a unique experience though, Sir David. Very few folks your age have the funding to operate a privately owned 172.

You wouldn't be getting those offers if you had only minimum standards hours in your logbook. Ya know?

The job offers came from landing the stricken 210

 

[denverpilot]

So while working my way up to the job I want as a pilot, what are some of the jobs I should look at while I'm in my 20s? You say I won't start earning a living until my 30's so what should I do until I get to that age?

Everything.

That's the thing. The two most common options are lots of jobs and pay-as-you go, or really big student loans.

Both have pluses and minuses.

One piece of wisdom I see regularly from the pros is to pursue a degree that isn't aviation-related.

Something you could enjoy doing for a living if aviation doesn't work out.

I think that's sound advice, but an Aviation Minor or Double-Major isn't bad either.

It's going to be really expensive, not matter how you slice it, fuel prices being what they are...

A positive attitude really seems to be critical, too. Both because you need to be able to handle your own fears and disappointments, as well as because once you hit that first job, no Captain enjoys flying with a crabby FO.

Networking and social skills also are important. You're already here doing that, do it in person too.

Sometimes "right place, right time" makes all the difference. Jobs at and around airports get you where you can hear about things going on and take advantage of anything going on around the airport that can further a career.

 

[DavidWhite]

Sometimes "right place, right time" makes all the difference. Jobs at and around airports get you where you can hear about things going on and take advantage of anything going on around the airport that can further a career.

 

[Threefingeredjack]

I appreciate the advice but when you say "might" it sounds like there is not much opportunity in becoming a pilot. Is that true? If I really put my mind and heart to it, I know I will try my 100% best. But is the effort going to pay off in the end?

No the opportunity is there, No doubt. But you have to make everything else in life, (relationships, having a great income, having regular hours etc) aside while you train and gain the hours required to make a living at it. Will it pay off? Who can say? But I firmly believe that as long as you drive yourself, (assuming you have the basic abilities required), there is very little one cannot accomplish, no matter what the goal.

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Everything.

That's the thing. The two most common options are lots of jobs and pay-as-you go, or really big student loans.

Both have pluses and minuses.

One piece of wisdom I see regularly from the pros is to pursue a degree that isn't aviation-related.

Something you could enjoy doing for a living if aviation doesn't work out.

I think that's sound advice, but an Aviation Minor or Double-Major isn't bad either.

It's going to be really expensive, not matter how you slice it, fuel prices being what they are...

A positive attitude really seems to be critical, too. Both because you need to be able to handle your own fears and disappointments, as well as because once you hit that first job, no Captain enjoys flying with a crabby FO.

Networking and social skills also are important. You're already here doing that, do it in person too.

Sometimes "right place, right time" makes all the difference. Jobs at and around airports get you where you can hear about things going on and take advantage of anything going on around the airport that can further a career.

Would joining the ANG be a good idea? I hear they provide education & a part-time job as well. Could I get what is required of me in the military? Pursuing this seems harder than I thought...

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

No the opportunity is there, No doubt. But you have to make everything else in life, (relationships, having a great income, having regular hours etc) aside while you train and gain the hours required to make a living at it. Will it pay off? Who can say? But I firmly believe that as long as you drive yourself, (assuming you have the basic abilities required), there is very little one cannot accomplish, no matter what the goal.

Thanks for the encouraging words. I am willing to put any distractions aside and focus on my main goal. I'm just wondering if it will all pay off in the end. I want to stay positive but this seems like a tough industry to 'make it' in life...

 

[gprellwitz]

Also keep in mind that, as a pilot, you will be forever at the mercy of the almighty Medical. A heart attack, sleep apnea, a DUI, a bad accident. Any of these and more can pull you from the cockpit for months, years, or even forever. That's another reason that the advice is often given to have a degree beyond flying that will allow you to draw a paycheck. Some of these you have control over (i.e., eat healthy, don't drink to excess, get regular checkups), while with others you're powerless. We can't choose our parents!

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

Also keep in mind that, as a pilot, you will be forever at the mercy of the almighty Medical. A heart attack, sleep apnea, a DUI, a bad accident. Any of these and more can pull you from the cockpit for months, years, or even forever. That's another reason that the advice is often given to have a degree beyond flying that will allow you to draw a paycheck. Some of these you have control over (i.e., eat healthy, don't drink to excess, get regular checkups), while with others you're powerless. We can't choose our parents!

If I were to have a degree beyond flying, what should I consider? I still want to be in the aviation/avionics category. Anything that involves airplanes or airports is what interests me

 

[gprellwitz]

If I were to have a degree beyond flying, what should I consider? I still want to be in the aviation/avionics category. Anything that involves airplanes or airports is what interests me

Well, some non-pilot career choices in aviation have already been mentioned, such as aeronautical engineer, avionics technician, and A&P (mechanic). Others would include IT (someone needs to write the algorithms for the new unmanned aerial systems!), logistics, management, law, etc. There is a lot involved in maintaining the complex infrastructure that is the national airspace system.

All of these can be intimately associated with aviation.

 

[denverpilot]

Thanks for the encouraging words. I am willing to put any distractions aside and focus on my main goal. I'm just wondering if it will all pay off in the end. I want to stay positive but this seems like a tough industry to 'make it' in life...

It's cliche', but when the going gets tough, the tough get going...

I bailed. I'll admit I wasn't tough enough. Or as some say, "it wasn't meant to be". (I don't like that phrase, I had choices and I made them.)

I hit a point in life where pushing on into aviation as a job wasn't as rewarding for me personally as pursuing better decisions for my relationship with my wife, my finances, and my career. The industry was in rotten shape back then, and I felt I couldn't avoid a five year pause if I stayed.

Never lost the passion to fly, and after a few years "out" (almost eight) and the right circumstances, I jumped back into aviation as recreation with great aircraft LLC co-owners and a smart little 182 that I truly enjoy and appreciate.

It's rewarding and fun and I don't have to pull a standing overnight in some god-forsaken crew hotel and show up to fire up an airplane at 5AM for a 5:30 push time in -20F for an airline, or cater to every whim of someone riding in the back who's used to everyone jumping when they say jump. Or dump their latrine cartridges.

It's not like my life is perfect, that's exceedingly rare in life for anyone. Life isn't TV. Pick a course, commit and go. If things change, reassess and recommit and go again.

That's pretty much the path to your own success, along with the ability to say "life is good" even when things don't always go your way.

I'm no airline pilot, but I fly just about every weekend, and have a supportive spouse who gets why I need to. The money sacrificed means a significant difference in her life too, so I'm eternally grateful for her support. I wouldn't trade her for any airplane. I've watched people do that. To me, not worth it.

No regrets here.

 

[AndrewFuturePilot]

It's cliche', but when the going gets tough, the tough get going...

I bailed. I'll admit I wasn't tough enough. Or as some say, "it wasn't meant to be". (I don't like that phrase, I had choices and I made them.)

I hit a point in life where pushing on into aviation as a job wasn't as rewarding for me personally as pursuing better decisions for my relationship with my wife, my finances, and my career. The industry was in rotten shape back then, and I felt I couldn't avoid a five year pause if I stayed.

Never lost the passion to fly, and after a few years "out" (almost eight) and the right circumstances, I jumped back into aviation as recreation with great aircraft LLC co-owners and a smart little 182 that I truly enjoy and appreciate.

It's rewarding and fun and I don't have to pull a standing overnight in some god-forsaken crew hotel and show up to fire up an airplane at 5AM for a 5:30 push time in -20F for an airline, or cater to every whim of someone riding in the back who's used to everyone jumping when they say jump. Or dump their latrine cartridges.

It's not like my life is perfect, that's exceedingly rare in life for anyone. Life isn't TV. Pick a course, commit and go. If things change, reassess and recommit and go again.

That's pretty much the path to your own success, along with the ability to say "life is good" even when things don't always go your way.

I'm no airline pilot, but I fly just about every weekend, and have a supportive spouse who gets why I need to. The money sacrificed means a significant difference in her life too, so I'm eternally grateful for her support. I wouldn't trade her for any airplane. I've watched people do that. To me, not worth it.

No regrets here.

Well at least in the end you still fly. I think that someone like me, fresh out of high school with no real commitments or distractions would have slightly a better chance...maybe that's just me. I feel like I am willing to commit everything I got (which isn't much) to successfully achieving my goal as a pilot. I just sometimes think, is it all worth in the end? I don't want to give it my all and still come out without a job. I also just want to know what I'm up against and if I can handle it.