Wealth Distribution in America

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Re-phrase that and the answer will become clearer: we have institutions that employee too many voters to allow them to fail.

I've been curious about that with the recent Boeing debacle and their company's future. Boeing is the only US based commercial aircraft manufacturer, and other than Lockheed, the biggest defense aircraft manufacturer. With their stock dropping and the public backlash, what is the future.

Is it time to buy Boeing stock yet?
 
Back when I was working we had new hire training and indcctrination, and I was the one who usually presented and explained what we did in our department and function. At the end, I aways reserved a few minutes to talk to the new engineers about 401k and savings. I advised them to all immediately set their 401k investment at 10%, and then after that for every raise, split it with themselves and the 401k. IE, get a 6% raise, increase your 401k withholdings to 13%, enjoy the other 3% as increased lifestyle. Do this every raise and bouns! I also gave a little info on the tax benefits.

Most of them were agast that I asked them to do this, but I explained that if they followed this process, by the time they were 60 they'd likely be able to pull the ejection handles. Some thanked me, and said that HR didn't explain any of this.

Hopefully this sank in with a few of them, at least I tried.
I work in tech, and our "lower paid" people make 120K/year.

I've talked dozens of them through how to maximize our very generous benefits over the years (401k match, HSA contributions, etc). It's shocking how many bright, highly driven people just don't think about it. I was looking from day 1 of employment how much could I squeeze into those accounts.
 
I don't know that particular persons circumstances, but in fairness, there are a lot of people who objectively make less than it takes to survive. They work for a living. Often in some of the worst jobs out there. But it costs $200 a week to live where they are and the job they can get only pays $150. It's pretty easy for some who fly around in little planes as a hobby to forget that there are people who just flat-out aren't smart enough to get an education and a better gig in the world and they struggle to survive as a result, because in the past 100 years or so, the number of jobs where one can support oneself with just manual labor has gone down by about 90% while the percentage of people who aren't smart enough to do anything more than that has stayed the same.
I understand, but many times it's the broke folks w/the new cell phone, watching pay per view, and what doesn't seem like expensive habits that over a few months adds up to a lot.

Our middle daughter, for a few years did a no-money November. She wouldn't spend any money on anything, except fuel, as she drove about 40 miles one way. Everything was purchased or paid for in advance so she socked away every check for that month. There are always choices.
 
I understand, but many times it's the broke folks w/the new cell phone, watching pay per view, and what doesn't seem like expensive habits that over a few months adds up to a lot.
My only concern is that we create a system/culture/economy that helps those who need help. If we end up helping a few people who otherwise might be ok anyway, I'm good with that.

I greatly resent a system that over corrects and hurts those who need help.

Unfortunately, I fear we have the worst of both worlds right now. We have people who are suffering and needing help that aren't getting it and yet we also have a system that can sometimes be gamed and helps people who don't need it.
 
What specific companies/industries do you think have monopolies/duopolies that are price gouging (at least on a broad scale; I'm not talking as much about very niche industries where those kinds of things tend to happen pretty naturally).
Mobile phone operators - Back when GSM/CDMA were still a thing, we almost ended up with one GSM operator and one CDMA operator, with no interoperability capability and no way of being able to reuse the phone you paid for when switching networks. Now, with LTE and 5G, they're all converging, technology-wise, but still with no decrease in plan costs. You have three operators with similar pricing, for the most part. Even lacking some of the economies of scale associated with the large US networks, look at the monthly plan costs in European countries and you'll see they charge about half what you get charged in the US.
Cable TV service, most of the time you only get one provider in a given city/community, and the prices are eye-watering compared to other countries.

Food producers have merged into a few conglomerates, and it's amazing how some of these competing conglomerates all came up with "shrinkflation" at the same time.
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Re-phrase that and the answer will become clearer: we have institutions that employee too many voters to allow them to fail.
we have institutions that donate too much to political campaigns to allow them to fail. FIFY
 
I don't know that particular persons circumstances, but in fairness, there are a lot of people who objectively make less than it takes to survive. They work for a living. Often in some of the worst jobs out there. But it costs $200 a week to live where they are and the job they can get only pays $150.
You need a critical financial mass to be able to lift yourself from the bottom. When you can barely save 5% of your income every month, no way you can put together enough of a downpayment to buy a house so you're not at the mercy of the landlord. You're not going to feel safe investing that in the stock market, either - you can't afford to lose it if the next recession happens three years from now. And so on.

Absolutely true that there are plenty of examples of people living beyond their means. Easily influenced, they have to be seen sporting the next generation phone every year, with the $150/mo unlimited plan, large cable bill so they can talk about all the new shows, and so on. A large majority of them complain about increasing fuel prices (whatever they believe the reason might be), yet none of them seem willing to give up on the single-digit MPG land yacht they might be driving (by themselves, and with no cargo in the back) in favor of a 60MPG Prius, for example.
 
We have these threads from time to time, and articles and studies pop up around the subject. The title is always something with the phrase "Wealth Distribution..." thus beginning with the false premise that there is a fixed amount of wealth that has to be divided up. It's as though "wealth" is a gas in the air and somehow the "rich" are inhaling more than their fair share.

It's baloney.

When you start out with a fundamentally incorrect assumption, everything that follows must be suspect. Wealth is created, and the wealth in the US has been steadily increasing for two hundred years. It's not a fixed amount to be chopped up and divided. I think that if a study of wealth generation were presented, it would show us that only a very small percentage of the population creates most of the wealth in this country, and they keep much less than they create.

It does not bother me one bit that folks like Bezos and Musk and Gates have extreme amounts of wealth, because they've created far more than they're holding. They didn't steal one dime from me, and nothing prevents me from being as inventive as they are (except my own miniscule intellect and even smaller courage and ambition) and creating vast amounts of wealth myself.

Yes, the percentage of people in the middle class has been shrinking for a few decades. Know what? The percentage of people in the upper middle class has been growing more than the percentage in the lower class! This is net upward movement. Is that a problem? Or is it what we should want?

See the chart below. The middle class has decreased by 11% over the 50 years shown. Of that 11% shrinkage, 4% went into the lower income group but 7% went to the upper income group! And it's another example of bad messaging. The chart title could have read, "Share of adults in upper income class has increased considerable since 1971" and been just as accurate, but the take-away would be different.

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Furthermore, let's bear in mind that this isn't a static situation. People in the US progress through these classes as they work and age and (if they have any sense) accumulate wealth. A new college grad may start off in the lower group, but by retirement age may well be wealthy.

Our real problem is a lack of understanding of money matters and wealth growth among a large part of our population. That's what we should address, not some bogus "unfair distribution" of wealth.
 
The tale of the three dollars:

One is a Weekend Dollar. The holder looks at the value of the dollar as it relates to what can happen 'this weekend'. Apply stereotypes as you see fit.

The next is the Monthly Dollar. The holder looks at this in terms of being responsible and taking care of their obligations.

The last is a Lifetime Dollar. The holder looks at this dollar in terms of what it can generate over the holder's lifetime.

The Weekend Dollar holder HAS to change their mentality to be able to have Monthly Dollars

The Monthly Dollar holder HAS to commit to stashing away Lifetime Dollars to EVER have a chance any form of wealth.

This is a real struggle.
 
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When you look at the trends in income/wealth inequality in USA, you see significant change in divergence between the top 1% and the rest of the population beginning sometime in 1992. This is when SEC first introduced requirements for disclosure of executive pay. Before that, companies could keep secret how much they pay their CxOs. Once this became public knowledge, it created a rapid race to the top, which set executive pay onto a sky-high trajectory, completely disproportionate from the rate of growth for the company itself, as well as of the US economy overall.

When each CEO's contract came up for re-negotiation, the board of directors would look at the other competitors in their industry, and how much they are paying their CEOs, determine the average value (which would almost always include some wild outlier superstar CEO with exorbitant pay package, pulling that average higher, well above the median value), and then set the pay package for their own CEO above that average. How far above? Usually at 120 - 150% above. This would be fairly logical, since no board would ever want to tell their shareholders that their CEO is below average in their industry. This would universally happen both to successful companies with growing revenues, as well as less successful ones, with declining revenues. The idea is, you reward your CEO for good performance, or you stimulate them, hoping that (s)he can turn the declining revenues around.

The obvious problem with this race to the top is that it doesn't have equally growing source of revenue from which to reward those CEOs. A study of the CEO pay compensation since 1992 revealed that the executive pay has grown significantly faster than the overall revenue. Economic data since WWII shows that general worker productivity has been rapidly improving across all decades, but the median income (the point at which half of the workers earn less, the other half more than that much) has stopped growing right after the 1992 decision, despite the fact that the worker productivity (company earnings per worker) has continued its robust growth. Workers have become more efficient, and have been generating more revenues (as well as profits) for their employers, but the employers have been funnelling all that additional profit into executive pay, while the worker pay has been largely stagnant for over three decades now (barely keeping up with inflation).

This rapid rise in inequality has resulted in large percentage of workers increasingly struggling to advance. In 1950s, a manufacturing job was sufficient to feed a family of four, pay mortgage for a comfortable 3-bedroom house, put enough away for annual family vacations and have enough left over for other fun hobbies (including aviation, for some), all this on a single salary. While the manufacturing has largely gone abroad, similarly paid professional jobs of today are mostly inadequate, and dual income is needed for a family to achieve similar standard of living. And this is mostly a consequence of the disproportionate rise in income inequality, accelerated by that SEC decision from 1992.

We can debate the spending habits and financial literacy of various social strata in USA, but those haven't somehow magically changed at any specific point. The greatest catalyst that has exacerbated the income inequality in USA is definitely the out-of-control rise in executive pay packages, sucking away every bit of extra profit from companies, regardless of whether they are successful or not.
 
When you look at the trends in income/wealth inequality in USA, you see significant change in divergence between the tip 1% and the rest of the population beginning sometime in 1992. This is when SEC first introduced requirements for disclosure of executive pay. Before that, companies could keep secret how much they pay their CxOs. Once this became public knowledge, it created a rapid race to the top, which set executive pay onto a sky-high trajectory, completely disproportionate from the rate of growth for the company itself, as well as for the US economy overall.

When each CEO's contract came up for re-negotiation, the board of directors would look at the other competitors in their industry, and how much they are paying their CEOs, determine the average value (which would almost always include some wild outlier superstar CEO with exorbitant pay package, pulling that average higher, well above the median value), and then set the pay package for their own CEO above that average. How far above? Usually at 120 - 150% above. This would be fairly logical, since no board would ever want to tell their shareholders that their CEO is below average in their industry. This would universally happen both to successful companies with growing revenues, as well as less successful ones, with declining revenues. The idea is, you reward your CEO for good performance, or to stimulate them, hoping that (s)he can turn the declining revenues around.
This is only part of the story.

There is also the governance part - Sec 162(m) from the IRS and various SEC requirements. 162(m) mandates that all compensation over $1M for any employee (not just the C-Suite) must be tied to clear, previously defined performance metrics, or it may not be deducted as a business expense by the company. Similarly, SEC governance generally requires that measures be taken to align the execs' compensation packages with shareholders' interests. In practice, this ends up driving two actions that are now standard practice in exec comp:

1) The majority of exec pay is now paid in bonus comp. If your target is, say, $2.5M for a given exec, $1.5 of it must be in performance based bonus pay, or it is not deductible.
2) The majority of exec bonus pay now consists of equity-derived packages, and most of them are deferred for some period of time.

Why? does this matter? Because the STATED income of these execs is now much higher than it was before these practices, even though the REAL income hasn't changed that much.

Let me give an example. 20 years ago, I might have gotten a bonus all paid in cash at the end of the year, and would have taken the after-tax proceeds and invested it. No big deal. Today, let's say that I was awarded a $150K bonus based on my division's performance in 2023. Instead of cash, it's all paid out as RSUs (i.e., shares of stock to be issued at a later date). Today's share price is, say $100, so I get 500 shares to be paid in each of 2024, 2025, and 2026 - $50K per year. Sound fair? Sure. In truth, it's exactly the same as what I would have gotten 20 years ago. It is not recorded as income this year, though, as I haven't yet actually received anything. Now, let's say that the share price goes up significantly. What if it goes from $100 to $200 in the first year? Well, now that $50K portion of the bonus is paid out as $100K - and that's what the SEC requires that that company report. The next year, maybe it goes up to $250/share....and now the bonus is reported as $125K. In the third year, share prices go up even more, to $350....so my bonus gets reported as $175K. In effect, because my bonus is deferred and invested in company stock, my $150K actual bonus gets reported as $400K. 20 years ago, it was reported as $150K and the earnings when I invested it were not part of the company report....but today, the W-2 earnings that are reported for me include the invested earnings on the shares that have deferred vesting.

Now, what's even more obtuse is that when execs are granted these shares, they must pay taxes on them (as regular income shown on the day that the grant vests), but generally cannot sell them for at least 6 months and often a year (depending on how the board approved the shares). So, they have to cover a 40+% tax bill on "income" that they haven't yet actually received, and cannot access.

TL/DR version: The required reports of exec income show artificially inflated numbers due to the required deferral and vesting periods, which effectively force investment income to be reported as W-2 income both in annual reports and for tax purposes.
 
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The tale of the three dollars:

One is a Weekend Dollar. The holder looks that the value of the dollar as it relates to what can happen 'this weekend'. Apply stereotypes as you see fit.

The next is the Monthly Dollar. The holder looks at this in terms of being responsible and taking care of their obligations.

The last if a Lifetime Dollar. The holder looks at this dollar in terms of what it can general over the holder's lifetime.

The Weekend Dollar holder HAS to change the mentality to be able to have Monthly Dollars

The Monthly Dollar holder HAS to commit to stashing away Lifetime Dollars to EVER have a chance any form of wealth.

This is a real struggle.
I agree but I think you forgot about the generational dollar thinker. The ones who think about their families line. I grew up “poor”, my parents struggled to have any money, but we ate food we grew (vegetables and pigs, laying hens, all sorts of poultry, apple trees, sheep, and goats for milk/cheese) I got teased at school for not having the name brand/ the modern style clothes, my family driving an old car, you name it… I was an adult before I really realized how much more “wealth” my parents had than the other kids families. My parents owned land and were struggling through the farm crisis. I never went to daycare, my parents were home teaching me things on the farm. Theirs were working day jobs and paying morgages on their little house in a lot in town. When my father passed when I was 15 he left me 20 acres owned free and clear. When my mom passed when I was 25 she left me a 4 acre acreage( one of two they owned when I was growing up) and another 20 acres. And I was one of 4 kids.
I still live on that that acreage, and I can drive a mile and a half east, and another mile and a half south and every piece of land except for one 2 acre acerage is owned by extended members of my family. From brother, to cousin, to second cousin twice removed, it all has been from my great grandfather who owned 3 square miles of land in the 1890’s and beat it into his kids minds and them to theirs, that they never make more land, money gets spent and losses value everyday you don’t spend it, but every day land gets more precious. That message has held to be true through generations, but after a few generations of multiple kids it gets split into obscurity if it doesn’t continue to grow.
 
We can debate the spending habits and financial literacy of various social strata in USA, but those haven't somehow magically changed at any specific point.

But I would argue they have. If you went back 100 years ago, poverty meant something different than it does for many today. It used to mean one couldn't afford housing, clothing, food, etc. What is the #1 problem facing Americans today, obesity. Find me one home in this country that doesn't have at least one tv. We have moved the bar.

I'm not saying there aren't people that are struggling, and there are always are and unfortunately will be. But the definitions have evolved.
 
I think the entire “retirement investment” culture is another causation to this. 100 or even 70 years ago people would work and save to start out on their own and be their own boss. Nobody thought “I’m going to save so much money from working this job that I can someday quite and live off of it”. Personally I think anybody renting housing but has a retirement savings is a fool unless they really are in an extremely unique circumstance. Rent =money gone forever, morgage=Gaining something but somebody is still earning a profit from your money, Owned out right=pay property tax only, less bills, and set aside more.
I’ve never met a rich person that had gotten rich working for somebody else (some exist, big company CEO’s and stuff) but most are self made buisness owners. Investing all your free money into a market that funds large companies that make it harder for an independent person to start a business is self defeating to growing the middle class but it is the understood “law of the land” now. But think if you retire at 65 then end up living to 95, 30 years of living off of savings isn’t going to pencil out to very much per year no matter how well you put away towards your 401k once inflation is taken into account. Consider your current yearly income minus what you keep back for savings as a base line as what you’ll need to live (ignore inflation devaluation of your savings or health issues increasing your expenses), and how many years will your savings last? I suggest it’s wiser to save but not in a 401k but to buy, build a buisness, find something to gain passive income rather than market returns. (Even then the markets are one correction away/crash from erasing years of savings in week). Just my $0.03 (inflation, $0.02 doesn’t work anymore).
 
…In 1950s, a manufacturing job was sufficient to feed a family of four, pay mortgage for a comfortable 3-bedroom house, put enough away for annual family vacations and have enough left over for other fun hobbies (including aviation, for some), all this on a single salary..
So, does this mean that same manufacturing job must still exist today? Take that part out and, insert job the pays at the median salary rate, and you’ll find that exact same opportunity exists. I should know, because that was exactly what we were able to do while our kids (they came early in life for us) were still in the house (1991-2012).
True, our cars weren’t new, people weren’t paid to wash or service them, we didn’t get cell phones until 2007, our house was a ten year old starter home that was structurally sound but needed sweat equity improvements, and our vacations certainly weren’t high expense trips during peak periods in each season. Nor did we buy $5 cups of coffee or eat out more often than not.
 
It used to mean one couldn't afford housing, clothing, food, etc. What is the #1 problem facing Americans today, obesity.
FWIW, obesity among the poor *IS* an affordability problem. If you can't afford healthy food, you eat snack food, processed food, soda and other cheap calories.
 
So, does this mean that same manufacturing job must still exist today? Take that part out and, insert job the pays at the median salary rate, and you’ll find that exact same opportunity exists.
Yes, they exist.
No, they do not exist in a quantity sufficient to fund and entire generation of families.
No, they do not have the same skills requirements. Specifically, most of the replacement jobs require more smarts and education or other training.
 
FWIW, obesity among the poor *IS* an affordability problem. If you can't afford healthy food, you eat snack food, processed food, soda and other cheap calories.
It's an education problem, not an affordability problem.

"Real" food is not as expensive as junk food. A 5-lb bag of rice or beans goes a LONG way feeding a family and costs about the same as a 12 oz bag of chips. Tap water is healthier than soda and costs far less. A loaf of bread and pack of bologna costs about the same as a single fast food burger.

It's not affordability, it's being thoughtful, deliberate, and willing to put a small amount of effort into your lifestyle choices.
 
Investing all your free money into a market that funds large companies that make it harder for an independent person to start a business is self defeating to growing the middle class but it is the understood “law of the land” now. But think if you retire at 65 then end up living to 95, 30 years of living off of savings isn’t going to pencil out to very much per year no matter how well you put away towards your 401k once inflation is taken into account. Consider your current yearly income minus what you keep back for savings as a base line as what you’ll need to live (ignore inflation devaluation of your savings or health issues increasing your expenses), and how many years will your savings last? I suggest it’s wiser to save but not in a 401k but to buy, build a buisness, find something to gain passive income rather than market returns.
Apply the 4% rule and your retirement investments will last as long as you do. If you think that you cannot afford to live on 4%, then how will you live on 0% when it runs out?

In any case, the retirement savings situation is a result of the longer lifespans that we enjoy as a result of improved medical technology and broad access to sufficient nutrition to survive to an age well beyond the expected working years.
 
Yes, they exist.
No, they do not exist in a quantity sufficient to fund and entire generation of families.
No, they do not have the same skills requirements. Specifically, most of the replacement jobs require more smarts and education or other training.

Several of the highest paid people I know are linemen. They tell me there’s not nearly enough apprentices for the jobs. Skill or will.
 
Several of the highest paid people I know are linemen. They tell me there’s not nearly enough apprentices for the jobs. Skill or will.
That job takes a special kind of person. It requires serious discipline, a willingness to work outdoors in all weather conditions, an ability to learn to operate a wide range of highly technical equipment, and an unwavering focus on safety in a potentially deadly work environment.

Yes, they get paid a lot of money. They earn it.
 
I think the entire “retirement investment” culture is another causation to this. 100 or even 70 years ago people would work and save to start out on their own and be their own boss. Nobody thought “I’m going to save so much money from working this job that I can someday quite and live off of it”. Personally I think anybody renting housing but has a retirement savings is a fool unless they really are in an extremely unique circumstance. Rent =money gone forever, morgage=Gaining something but somebody is still earning a profit from your money, Owned out right=pay property tax only, less bills, and set aside more.
I’ve never met a rich person that had gotten rich working for somebody else (some exist, big company CEO’s and stuff) but most are self made buisness owners. Investing all your free money into a market that funds large companies that make it harder for an independent person to start a business is self defeating to growing the middle class but it is the understood “law of the land” now. But think if you retire at 65 then end up living to 95, 30 years of living off of savings isn’t going to pencil out to very much per year no matter how well you put away towards your 401k once inflation is taken into account. Consider your current yearly income minus what you keep back for savings as a base line as what you’ll need to live (ignore inflation devaluation of your savings or health issues increasing your expenses), and how many years will your savings last? I suggest it’s wiser to save but not in a 401k but to buy, build a buisness, find something to gain passive income rather than market returns. (Even then the markets are one correction away/crash from erasing years of savings in week). Just my $0.03 (inflation, $0.02 doesn’t work anymore).
I think this is generally true, but I know thousands of 401k/housing/RSU millionaires in the coastal areas. There are different ways to get there.

MidwestPA24 - I agree generally, but there are some real scary and traumatic things that happen in poverty that you don't tend to see as much in the middle and upper middle class, particularly children being abused at a much higher rate. IN general, anyone with even basic mental health in the US should be able to feed themselves, and if they really work on it, land a couch/basement to sleep in while they build some work experience up.

Kelvin, to your point, I agree, BUT, as much as I'm a libertarian at heart, I think we have to face that a good % of people (including hard working, good people) just can't get their brains there over decades to make long term financial decisions. It's just not how they live or who they are. I really think a more generous pension system so that someone who worked most of their lives could continue to be at least lower middle class after working. I know people in this camp, very, very well, and they're smart, hardworking, honest people, they just don't have the psychology I do. Possibly the privatization of SS idea would have done some of this (50% of SS would grow with the market, 50% would be the current government formula). As an example, this was 2005.Dow Jones was 16K then, it's 38K now. If we take the average person making it on $1,200/mo of SS, I wonder what that would be if 1/2 since 2005 would have been in a market lock box and the other 1/2 the traditional way? Maybe that plus 4% higher employer contributions would push it to $2k a month. for the people I'm talking about, that would take them from "poverty and need help every month" to "I'm good"
 
Several of the highest paid people I know are linemen. They tell me there’s not nearly enough apprentices for the jobs. Skill or will.
yes. I think one of the biggest things goes back to people at all ages asking themselves. "What do I need to do in life to accumulate the wealth *I* want?" The answer is that there are tons of ways to do it, but if you don't ask yourself that, and BELIEVE that you can do something about it, you'll just do what you're doing and not improve your situation.
 
Several of the highest paid people I know are linemen. They tell me there’s not nearly enough apprentices for the jobs. Skill or will.
That applies to most of the trades, from pipe fitters, electricians, plumbers.. every one of the hands on apprenticeship trained fields are desperate for anybody, atleast in my part of the USA. I have zero formal experience in any of them, but have working connections with quite a few buisnesses in the trades and almost like clockwork for the last few years I get cold called and offered a job usually in the $40/hr range with good benefits to start and scheduled increases as the hours required for journeyman’s then master qualification accrue.
 
I’ve never met a rich person that had gotten rich working for somebody else.....

Don't get out much?

Engineers have the highest probability of becoming millionaires compared to other professions and occupations, yet the great majority of engineers work for corporations. Maybe you've never met one, but if you hang around POA long enough you will, as there are a bunch of us here.

30 years of living off of savings isn’t going to pencil out to very much per year no matter how well you put away towards your 401k once inflation is taken into account.

Sharpen your pencil. Invested at enough return to overcome inflation, every $1M of savings can provide $40k to $50k per year, going up with inflation each year. It's not too hard to build enough in a 401k or an IRA over the course of a career so that a retiree can have a decent income.
 
I absolutely do not get out much, but I also don’t consider those number to be rich, in my rural part of the country that is significantly into the lower 50% of wealth/ yearly retirement income group. Land is currently averaging $15,000/acre and closing on $400/yr/acre cash rent. And very low population, go to local towns coffee shops and most of the “poor” guys are worth 10’s of millions if they decided to cash out, not counting the few million their equipment is worth
 
I absolutely do not get out much, but I also don’t consider those number to be rich, in my rural part of the country that is significantly into the lower 50% of wealth/ yearly retirement income group. Land is currently averaging $15,000/acre and closing on $400/yr/acre cash rent. And very low population, go to local towns coffee shops and most of the “poor” guys are worth 10’s of millions if they decided to cash out, not counting the few million their equipment is worth

I was addressing two completely separate parts of your posting.

1) Can't get rich working for someone else. Untrue.

2) Not worth saving in a 401k. Also untrue. Didn't say it would make you "rich."

BUT, you might want to consider the commonly accepted definition of "rich." Typically, anyone with >$2.2M in net worth is considered rich, and that's roughly the top 2% of the US population.
 
When you look at the trends in income/wealth inequality in USA, you see significant change in divergence between the top 1% and the rest of the population beginning sometime in 1992. This is when SEC first introduced requirements for disclosure of executive pay. Before that, companies could keep secret how much they pay their CxOs. Once this became public knowledge, it created a rapid race to the top, which set executive pay onto a sky-high trajectory, completely disproportionate from the rate of growth for the company itself, as well as of the US economy overall.

When each CEO's contract came up for re-negotiation, the board of directors would look at the other competitors in their industry, and how much they are paying their CEOs, determine the average value (which would almost always include some wild outlier superstar CEO with exorbitant pay package, pulling that average higher, well above the median value), and then set the pay package for their own CEO above that average. How far above? Usually at 120 - 150% above. This would be fairly logical, since no board would ever want to tell their shareholders that their CEO is below average in their industry. This would universally happen both to successful companies with growing revenues, as well as less successful ones, with declining revenues. The idea is, you reward your CEO for good performance, or you stimulate them, hoping that (s)he can turn the declining revenues around.

The obvious problem with this race to the top is that it doesn't have equally growing source of revenue from which to reward those CEOs. A study of the CEO pay compensation since 1992 revealed that the executive pay has grown significantly faster than the overall revenue. Economic data since WWII shows that general worker productivity has been rapidly improving across all decades, but the median income (the point at which half of the workers earn less, the other half more than that much) has stopped growing right after the 1992 decision, despite the fact that the worker productivity (company earnings per worker) has continued its robust growth. Workers have become more efficient, and have been generating more revenues (as well as profits) for their employers, but the employers have been funnelling all that additional profit into executive pay, while the worker pay has been largely stagnant for over three decades now (barely keeping up with inflation).

This rapid rise in inequality has resulted in large percentage of workers increasingly struggling to advance. In 1950s, a manufacturing job was sufficient to feed a family of four, pay mortgage for a comfortable 3-bedroom house, put enough away for annual family vacations and have enough left over for other fun hobbies (including aviation, for some), all this on a single salary. While the manufacturing has largely gone abroad, similarly paid professional jobs of today are mostly inadequate, and dual income is needed for a family to achieve similar standard of living. And this is mostly a consequence of the disproportionate rise in income inequality, accelerated by that SEC decision from 1992.

We can debate the spending habits and financial literacy of various social strata in USA, but those haven't somehow magically changed at any specific point. The greatest catalyst that has exacerbated the income inequality in USA is definitely the out-of-control rise in executive pay packages, sucking away every bit of extra profit from companies, regardless of whether they are successful or not.

So what? Even if accurate (and I'm not sure it is), so what?

If I'm able to work in my chosen profession and earn enough for my needs and even many of my wants, why should I care if someone else is making ten, a hundred, a thousand times what I am? The other person's success does not equate to my failure. In fact, when considering the joy we each receive from life, I might very well be more successful.

Life isn't some sort of game in which we keep score with dollars of income.
 
Save early, save often, live beneath your means.

Sounds easy. But for a lot of people it isn’t. Life choices and sometimes things beyond their control put some people in holes they may never get out of. We make a lot of life choices based on what we learn from others, like parents. Without that experience, generational poverty ends up being a real thing.
 
What specific companies/industries do you think have monopolies/duopolies that are price gouging (at least on a broad scale; I'm not talking as much about very niche industries where those kinds of things tend to happen pretty naturally).
Check the latest news about Boeing being named a duopoly.


 
I think part of the growth of the top .1% is tech billionaires. Generations prior you had to be a manufacturer or oil company tycoon. Grind out your growth through manual labor and product manufacturing. Now you can invent something digitally and boom, welcome to the zillionaire club.
Invert something digitally and boom people in the lower income groups make you a zillionare by buying your invention.
 
Save early, save often, live beneath your means.

Sounds easy. But for a lot of people it isn’t. Life choices and sometimes things beyond their control put some people in holes they may never get out of. We make a lot of life choices based on what we learn from others, like parents. Without that experience, generational poverty ends up being a real thing.
My parents were both in sales. Sucks being on a commissions income stream at times. But they taught me to pay cash (except for house and maybe the car). If I didn't have the cash to buy something, I probably didn't need it. Kept me out of trouble when the oil industry tanked in the late70s/early 80s then aerospace in the mid-80s.

I don't have as much as I'd like in my retirement fund, (but not complaining about what I do have)

It's partly my fault for not paying attention to a couple retirement funds I was invested in. Had I noticed, I would have moved out really fast but they came highly recommended so I stayed. Got screwed over by Prudential - inherited my Dad's fund but Prudential made me leave it for 5 years. Wish I had called an attorney but it was paying middlin' dividends but I hated not having the control. Day after the 5 years were up - outta there!
 
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