Valium or Halcion

MBDiagMan

MBDiagMan

Final Approach
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Doc
A friend of mine is going to the dentist where they are going to give her Valium or Halcion(sp?.) She is asking how long does she have to wait after taking these medicines before she is legal to fly as a student pilot?

Thanks for your help,
Doc
 
(I am "the friend" LOL)

Thanks, Doc. I was advised to call my AME regarding these sorts of things, and so I did - as mentioned I have not taken any medications yet but my dentist office does offer this sort of thing for patients who are undergoing things like extractions or oral surgery. I was unsure as a new student pilot what to do or what was legal but this has all been resolved now. My flight tonight was cancelled and I may or may not fly this weekend, I'm attending an FAA WINGS credit seminar with the 99s.

PS - Not sure if I am supposed to introduce myself somewhere on this forum, but hello, I'm new here. I belong to another pilot forum and thought I'd branch out a bit - !!!
 
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Thanks, Mike, so you're on more than one board too.... felt like I was cheating for a minute. Now I feel better. We shall see - "big forums" can get interesting....
 
MBDiagMan said:
A friend of mine is going to the dentist where they are going to give her Valium or Halcion(sp?.) She is asking how long does she have to wait after taking these medicines before she is legal to fly as a student pilot?

Thanks for your help,
Doc
Click to expand...

If it was purely for procedural sedation, then once she is considered recovered enough to drive I would expect she is good enough to fly. 24 hours after a simple outpatient procedures should be adequate.

If she is taking pain meds (vicodin, norco, narcotics) after the procedure though, this could complicate things.

This is an opinion, and is not certification advice (which Doc Bruce gives)
 
Doggtyred said:
If it was purely for procedural sedation, then once she is considered recovered enough to drive I would expect she is good enough to fly. 24 hours after a simple outpatient procedures should be adequate.

If she is taking pain meds (vicodin, norco, narcotics) after the procedure though, this could complicate things.

This is an opinion, and is not certification advice (which Doc Bruce gives)
Click to expand...


Hello,

"She" is me (Kimberly). She (me) has not taken anything and was seeking advice. There will be no anti-biotics or pain medication, this was purely a question about giving the dental patient something in the dentist office to relax them . . . but the problem is the dentist might have to prescribe it to a pharmacy and then it becomes a prescribed medication which was what caused me to ask the question. I do not want to do anything that I am not allowed to do but at the same time I am not looking forward to oral surgery or crowns or extractions or root canals.... so I wanted to understand the consequences of my actions if I choose sedation.

This is not something I ever had to think about before I became a student pilot so please excuse my lack of knowledge here.
 
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The first step in curing a lack of knowledge is asking the questions.

I'm sure that you are allowed to have an antianxiety drug for a dental procedure. If the dentist prescribes it and you pick it up (rather than just giving it to you in the office), just note it on your next medical form, note the reason, and your AME will do the rest.

As for acting as a student pilot, as soon as you're not under the influence of the med and are recovered from the procedure, you'll be fine to fly again.

Welcome to the community.
 
To be honest, in five years, when I fill out another medical form, I doubt I will remember whether or not I took a medication at a dentist office for a minor procedure that lasted an hour or less. I suppose I should write these things down somewhere like my log book (I have an inside pocket where I can store paperwork). A lot of people have made comments that sort of cause me to "fear the AME" but when I actualy met one and had my first class issued to me for five years it was not scary at all.... in fact he is a great guy and picked up the phone himself when I called him today to ask about the dentist visit coming up!
 
Hi Kimberly,

I am not sure if I missed it in your follow up posts but if you dont mind could you post what the AME said in regard to the medications..

Thanks ...
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
To be honest, in five years, when I fill out another medical form, I doubt I will remember.... I suppose I should write these things down somewhere...
Click to expand...

I keep a folder in a firesafe with all my AME notes. If you carry a day-planner or phone with a good calendar app, make a note and update a page every time you see a doc. Print it out every year and keep a copy in your folder. Makes it simple to look back for all doc visits in the last 3 years.

Welcome aboard!
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
To be honest, in five years, when I fill out another medical form...but when I actualy met one and had my first class issued to me for five years it was not scary at all
Click to expand...

Wow, I'd pay big bux to get a first class medical that lasted for five years...any tips for us mere mortals to pull that off?

Hugz...
 
Trapper John said:
Wow, I'd pay big bux to get a first class medical that lasted for five years...any tips for us mere mortals to pull that off?

Hugz...
Click to expand...


Here is the FAR (yes five years):

Here is the FAR:

Sec. 61.23

If you hold

(i) A first-class medical certificate.

And on the date of examination for your most recent medical certificate you were

(D) Under age 40 .......

And you are conducting an operation requiring

a recreational pilot certificate, a private pilot certificate, a flight instructor certificate (when acting as pilot in command or a required pilot flight crewmember in operations other than glider or balloon), a student pilot certificate, or a sport pilot certificate (when not using a U.S. driver’s license as medical qualification).

Then your medical certificate expires, for that operation, at the end of the last day of the

60th month after the month of the date of examination shown on the medical certificate.
 
My understanding is that my medical certificate is good for five years (I am 32). Please let me know if my AME, CFI, and myself are incorrect in our interpretation of the current FAR.
 
What are you talking about? I am not special and why am I being compared to a six year old? I am not allowed to have passengers, don't have my cert yet and haven't asked anyone to fly with me.... why is this relevant? I was asking a dental question.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
What are you talking about? I am not special and why am I being compared to a six year old? I am not allowed to have passengers, don't have my cert yet and haven't asked anyone to fly with me.... why is this relevant? I was asking a dental question.
Click to expand...
Welcome, Kimberly.
Sorry you received an inappropriate response to a question about learning.
 
pilot_dude said:
Welcome, Kimberly.
Sorry you received an inappropriate response to a question about learning.
Click to expand...


Thanks but seriously doubt I'll stick around if pilots on here will treat me this way. I need a tooth pulled or possibly other work, just asking, what gives?
 
iflyatiger said:
Hi Kimberly,

I am not sure if I missed it in your follow up posts but if you dont mind could you post what the AME said in regard to the medications..

Thanks ...
Click to expand...


Hi iflyatiger,

To be honest, not to sound old fashioned, but I don't really think it is OK to post what he said to me over the phone - I'll PM you since others have warned me about posting medical info on a public forum.... it was nothing but a positive response but I am feeling not very welcomed here.

Kimberly
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Thanks but seriously doubt I'll stick around if pilots on here will treat me this way. I need a tooth pulled or possibly other work, just asking, what gives?
Click to expand...

I encourage you stick around and get to know folks here. Most are lurkers, some post but there's always "that one". Unfortunately you encountered "that one" early. Hang in there and good luck with the procedure.
 
Kimberly,
I am a physician but not an AME. The half life of valium is 6 to 8 hours. I would not fly for at least 5 half lives or 40 hours after the last dose. Halcion has a half life of only about 2 hours but I would still wait for a couple of days. See if Dr. Bruce weighs in on this one.
 
Trapper John said:
Wow, so you're worried about losing a ticket you don't have yet over some med a dentist might prescribe?

What happens when the stick pusher fires and your barrette falls out?
Click to expand...


What ticket am I worried about losing? Here is an FAA report (see conclusions) on the medications in question, stating I should check with my AME first, which I did. I think you mean my certificate, and until I cross the line from being a student to a private pilot your question has no relevance to this discussion.

http://www.faa.gov/library/reports/medical/oamtechreports/2010s/media/201102.pdf


PS - I don't wear barrettes, the headset holds my hair back just fine.... like a giant headband. Six year olds wear barrettes.
 
Kimberlyanne, there are always one or two in every crowd. Dont let it get to you. Btw, i really enjoy reading your post on the other site, bring em on over here.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
Seriously?

Not quite sure it is worth the harassment.
Click to expand...
I can understand why you might question staying here. There is much to be learned, but like in life, sometimes you just need to ignore the jackleg and enjoy the knowledge others are willing to share.
 
mikeinbama said:
Kimberlyanne, there are always one or two in every crowd. Dont let it get to you. Btw, i really enjoy reading your post on the other site, bring em on over here.
Click to expand...


Thanks, Mike, it is people like you who might convince me to stay - um, are there other girls on here or is this the "standard" treatment?

I mean..... barrettes????
 
haha, there are several other ladies, but they would tell the aformentioned poster to "kma". stand your ground!!! I think you did a fine job of that already.
 
pilot_dude said:
I can understand why you might question staying here. There is much to be learned, but like in life, sometimes you just need to ignore the jackleg and enjoy the knowledge others are willing to share.
Click to expand...


Don't worry, in my professional line of work I'm used to ignoring the jacklegs(?)

However, flying / aviation is purely for pleasure and I have just now confirmed my medical is indeed good for five years (acting as a third class in this case even though it says first class on the top).....still a silly argument considering I'm facing oral surgery or dental work......

So I am on here to learn, and no I do not think I know more than any student, pilot, CFI, or otherwise, this is a "pilot training" site and therefore I am treating it as such.......

Just not really into the negative vibes. I get enough in my personal life, work life, and family life, aviation is for my enjoyment, I never even said I'd have any passengers, and God who knows if I will ever complete my training!!!

I am not here to brag, impress, attract, or repel anyone. Just here because I enjoy piloting an airplane. Period. No reason to hang around if that is not what is the norm in a pilot forum....

Kimberly
 
Wow, I'll have to say I've not seen that kind of barrage towards a new person on the boards here - what gives?

Welcome, Kimberly. I hope you stick around.
 
Thank you - everyone! Seriously. I don't know what, if anything, I can bring to the table here on this website but I am sooooo sorry for posting my bad teeth online.... it has certainly not done any good thus far.

I had a GREAT experience on another aviation forum and in reality flying is "for me" - not for a man, a boyfriend, or a husband, or a friend, it is for me. It is what I do / what I look forward to after all the stresses of life, family, friends, relationships, and work take their toll..... it is a great hobby.....not an affordable hobby but a fun one.

Until now, I have made friends with pilots online and in person and I have never flown with anyone other than my CFI (he is very protective and reminds me I would not hitch hike on the side of the freeway so why fly with someone I don't know?!)

It amazes me that even if I fly my whole life I will always have more to learn. This challenge is what attracts me most to aviation..... and NO I do not plan to have any passengers until I think I am ready to.... I want to fly a plane, then a glider, then a tail dragger, and some other fun stuff.... just to learn.

I am sorry that some person in some other timezone does not want to see me in the cockpit. I fly out of an untowered airport and hear things on the CTAF that prove to me people are not checking the AWOS or overflying the airport or looking at their sectional chart or AFD or planning for their flight... yet I don't yell at them for being an idiot.....

Peace!!!

Kimberly
 
Kimberly, welcome. Some people try to be funny in their responses.. Don't take everything at face value.

Simple extraction for the dental work, you'll be fine in a couple of days as long as you are no longer taking pain meds or have pain.

As for the 5 yr medical, yes.. The medical is good for 5 yrs because of the age, but it is not always a class I. The activity described, as "private/student pilot" only require a class III which is what the class I reverts to after after 1 yr.

A class I is good for 6 months, then it is good for class II for the next 6 months, and then it is good for a class III. Each level of pilot qualification requires a different class medical. An airline pilot needs a class I, and gets a physical every 6 months to maintain it. A commercial pilot needs a class II, good for a year, a student or private pilot needs a class III, good for 2 yrs or 5 yrs, depending on the pilots age.

Hope that helps... And again. Welcome.
 
BillTIZ said:
Kimberly, welcome. Some people try to be funny in their responses.. Don't take everything at face value.

Simple extraction for the dental work, you'll be fine in a couple of days as long as you are no longer taking pain meds or have pain.

As for the 5 yr medical, yes.. The medical is good for 5 yrs because of the age, but it is not always a class I. The activity described, as "private/student pilot" only require a class III which is what the class I reverts to after after 1 yr.

A class I is good for 6 months, then it is good for class II for the next 6 months, and then it is good for a class III. Each level of pilot qualification requires a different class medical. An airline pilot needs a class I, and gets a physical every 6 months to maintain it. A commercial pilot needs a class II, good for a year, a student or private pilot needs a class III, good for 2 yrs or 5 yrs, depending on the pilots age.

Hope that helps... And again. Welcome.
Click to expand...


Right. For what I intend to do I can get a pass for 5 years. This is what the original argument was about.... that I should not be allowed to get away with 5 years. I don't make the rules, but as mentioned the FAA says I can be a private pilot or student pilot for 5 years.

I apologize if I posted in a confusing manner, but have always stated I am a student. I got a first class medical IN THE BEGINNING after my intro flight because I was healthy enough to do so, it cost the same as a third class, and I did not know the salaries of aviators starting out so I wanted to keep my options open wide. Once I realized they need more certifications, flying hours, money, time, and experience, and even then don't pay more than I make now, I thought OK this is just a hobby.... I met or talked to pilots who had spent tens of thousands of dollars and over a thousand flying hours only to make $125 per day in the right seat in a hopper plane during their first pilot job......not even PIC yet.....

Kimberly
 
Please disregard the ridiculous posts in this thread by a certain individual. The MC is handling it.
 
Matthew said:
I keep a folder in a firesafe with all my AME notes. If you carry a day-planner or phone with a good calendar app, make a note and update a page every time you see a doc. Print it out every year and keep a copy in your folder. Makes it simple to look back for all doc visits in the last 3 years.

Welcome aboard!
Click to expand...


Hi Matthew, and thanks for the ideas. I honestly hope to have nothing out of the ordinary except for dentist visits to report.

Kimberly
 
gkainz said:
Wow, I'll have to say I've not seen that kind of barrage towards a new person on the boards here - what gives?

Welcome, Kimberly. I hope you stick around.
Click to expand...


Thanks, Greg - the posts are missing (deleted?) now so anyone reading this thread later might wonder what on earth all the fuss was about.

No matter, thanks for letting me know this situation was unusual - I will maybe stick around then....


Kimberly
 
jesse said:
Please disregard the ridiculous posts in this thread by a certain individual. The MC is handling it.
Click to expand...


Thanks - the "ridiculous" posts along with many of the (more awful) PMs from the same poster to me have seemed to disappear now thank goodness. This kind of stuff doesn't usually bother me, but a tooth pull? Seems silly to be bothered / argued with by how many years my medical is good for and how I wear my hair and if I see a dentist or not.... all very personal (pertaining to me) and by no means a measure of how I fly an airplane.... gosh I've never met the guy..... I get it, he has thousands more posts than me and I am a "nobody" on this forum, just joined. I really do get it but to compare me to a six year old child is just plain uncalled for and to joke about my hair falling out of place if the airplane moves unexpectedly.....

WTF.

Kimberly
 
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Welcome to POA. It's a great aviation site. This is a great group of folks who will go out of their way to help people.
 
Kim,

I was away from the computer from the time I started the thread until I came in this morning. I was amazed at the life that the thread took and almost feel that I should apologize for recommending this as a quick answer to your question.

That said, I don't think that there is a need to apologize because; first of all, you handled the attack extremely well and second, there are some great people here on this site that make it worth enduring the heckler(I'm trying to be nice and leave out the dirty names.)

Everyone,

I have read Kim's posts on another forum and can promise you that she is a great addition to this one! I hope that she continues posting in both. She's an open, honest, introspective and determined woman and aviation is lucky to have her. This forum will be lucky should she decide to continue posting here. Although she is a beginner, as am I, she is very clearly a savvy, competent pilot in the making.

Thanks to everyone for answering her question.

Doc
 
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