Tough call...

Captain said:
It's the losing a brother thing that pulled my heart string. If he is legit I stand by my offer to help out. I know we can't help every single vet out there...but Jesse has spoken on this guys behalf here and I'd say that's worth something.

Maybe a match of some sort? He gets his PPL at half price (sorta fitting given the story) and the GI Bill can pick up the rest?

Just spit ballin here.
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Yes, it is sad that his brother didn't come home... I'm still torn. On one hand, I'd like to think we help our heroes. On the other hand, that doesn't mean "I'm a vet so my every desire is free." (Hyperbole just to make the point.) I'm still not sure what I'd do in Jesse's situation. The first thing, of course, would be to verify the story. If the guy lied, he gets nothing. Period. Beyond that, I'm not sure...
 
Sac Arrow said:
Personally, I think if you took every case like that to heart you would go nuts. I'm also a veteran, and I had a desire to fly too, and I made it happen on my own. So can he and other vets.
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Not a veteran, but I agree. I would however, take him up for free and give him any advice I could. But I'd do that for anyone. If he can't afford his PPL how is he going to be able to afford to fly after that?

If he really wants to be a pilot, tell him he can get the PPL in 6mo-1yr working a job and setting a budget. If he can't handle that, he either does not want it bad enough or does not have the self-discipline. Then point him to the nearest 141 and make sure he goes somewhere that he can put his GI benefits to work. You can help him a ton just by mentoring him, and making sure his flying dollars are spent wisely.

Losing a sibling must be extremely difficult but the guy is in good health, he is capable of making his dreams come true on his own.
 
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I plan on touching base with the guy again today to see what I can really verify and to try and determine how serious he is.
 
Captain said:
It's the losing a brother thing that pulled my heart string. If he is legit I stand by my offer to help out. I know we can't help every single vet out there...but Jesse has spoken on this guys behalf here and I'd say that's worth something.

Maybe a match of some sort? He gets his PPL at half price (sorta fitting given the story) and the GI Bill can pick up the rest?

Just spit ballin here.
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Yeah, im with you. I know you cant help everyone, but every once in a while its good to help someone. If his story checks out, I could get behind it.
 
i guess if he wants it bad enough and understands the risks of financing and those risks are out-weighed by the benefits then he should go for financing.
 
Captain said:
It's the losing a brother thing that pulled my heart string. If he is legit I stand by my offer to help out. I know we can't help every single vet out there...but Jesse has spoken on this guys behalf here and I'd say that's worth something.

Maybe a match of some sort? He gets his PPL at half price (sorta fitting given the story) and the GI Bill can pick up the rest?

Just spit ballin here.
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If his story is true, I would be more than willing to help as well.
 
Sac Arrow said:
Personally, I think if you took every case like that to heart you would go nuts.
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Absolutely correct. And this is from someone whose non-profit organization saves puppies. We can't save all the puppies, and there are a lot who die because we simply don't have the funding to save them.

I could drive myself nuts (and broke) saving every puppy I possibly could. Ultimately, I'd save fewer because I'd then end up in a position where I couldn't afford to save any.
 
Jesse, all, be very skeptical of people claiming they have been in the war, or a war, or any war. I have found dozens if not hundreds of people claiming to be Viet Nam combat vets, Gulf war vets, Afghanistan war vets, and a lot of them are lying.
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I don't believe the original poster indicated that either the young man making the inquiry or his brother were service members. Given that there are more civilians prosecuting the war effort(s) than service members, there's a strong possibility that neither one was in the military. Given that more civilian contractors have died there than military personnel, and given that those deaths often go unreported or don't factor into statistics, it's very possible for the brother to have been a contractor who died. This won't show up in record checks.
 
TMetzinger said:
Interesting - when I used mine (in the '90s) I paid for the training up front, the school submitted a monthly report, and I got 60% ( I think, perhaps it was 80%) of it back in a check from the VA - which I then rolled back into training.

That's how the schools around here do it now - nobody "advances" any money.
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I could have that wrong, Tim. My experience was back in the 1970s. Maybe they did pay up front...still, the guy took off with a check he was supposed to endorse over to the flight school.

Bob
 
bobmrg said:
I could have that wrong, Tim. My experience was back in the 1970s. Maybe they did pay up front...still, the guy took off with a check he was supposed to endorse over to the flight school.

Bob
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You're probably right for that era of GI-Bill. I believe the benefits were a lot "better" back then. It's a shame that someone would walk out with the money like that though.
 
I'd be in for an hour of two instruction paid for, once it is given the go-ahead nod.
 
Sac Arrow said:
Personally, I think if you took every case like that to heart you would go nuts. I'm also a veteran, and I had a desire to fly too, and I made it happen on my own. So can he and other vets.
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IMO that is the kind of people we want behind the controls. That is ones that make stuff happen. I tell my students up front I will help them learn to fly but they are responsible for make sure they are progressing. I will try to schedule the next lesson each time we fly, but if they don't schedule or cancel and don't call me back I won't be calling them, they will need to call me.

I delivered pizza's to pay for my private flight training.

I used the Montgomery GI Bill in the 90's to get my instrument rating. As mentioned by others I paid for it and they reimbursed 60% of what I paid.

I helped (a little anyway) to get a 141 school going here to so we get take advantage of the GI benefits. At the time at seemed you had to be an active 141 school for 1 or 2 years before one could qualify to train under the GI Bill. And yes we trained both part 61 and part 141. Often we would train under part 141 and once the part 61 requirements were met the student would just pay to take the check ride under part 61. This was actually what I did for my instrument rating.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
I received my GI Bill benefits in the '90's. If that loophole existed it'd been closed by then. I had to pay for my training upfront. THEN the GI Bill reimbursed me at 60%. The school was paid. No way for me to scam them.

Except I took a cash under the table job so at the time I was getting unemployment, GI Bill money, the cash under the table, plus a stipend from my family because they put my brother through college and felt bad... ($600/month).
 
If you're wondering, that 'stipend' lasted about 8 months. My brother got a four year degree. He had a partial scholarship...but quit the golf team...so there goes the scholarship.

Parents paid for his whole deal while I served in the Navy.
 
Captain said:
Except I took a cash under the table job so at the time I was getting unemployment, GI Bill money, the cash under the table, plus a stipend from my family because they put my brother through college and felt bad... ($600/month).
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So how exactly did you draw unemployment while employed?

(those of us who paid unemployment tax really hate to hear those stories - there is a cost you know)
 
Clark1961 said:
So how exactly did you draw unemployment while employed?

(those of us who paid unemployment tax really hate to hear those stories - there is a cost you know)
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Same way everyone else does it, who does it... get paid cash, unreported, and lie about not having a job.
 
Clark1961 said:
So how exactly did you draw unemployment while employed?

(those of us who paid unemployment tax really hate to hear those stories - there is a cost you know)
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Those of us with a conscience are always shocked to find out that a large portion of the rest of the world got their "breaks" by cheating or being sociopathic.

Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Larry Ellison, every President since I've been born, name a famous "leader"... almost all sociopaths. Famous war heroes, definitely sociopaths, but their bad behavior is focused at an "enemy" we all agree with them on.

If only our parents had raised us to be good little sociopaths, we'd be "successful", Clark. :)

We console ourselves many ways.

Religion: "He'll have to answer to God for that someday."

Mysticism: "Karma will get him back for that someday."

Realism not based in reality: "He'll tick the wrong person off someday or get caught doing that."

Reality is... many people can justify anything to themselves, given enough time and perceived need. They'll just say they're sorry for it later when the Statute of Limitations has run out.
 
The recreational (which has been a crashing failure, how many have their ever been issued...less than 200 I believe). It omits the cross-country work to get the time down.
Of course, if people are going to go over the regulatory minimums it most likely is in the air work and landings. By the time you get to flying your XCs off, that's just gravy.
 
The 'employment' was only 2 shifts a week for around $60 / shift. Technically wrong I guess, but it's not like I was raping the taxpayer either.
 
DaleB said:
:dunno: Youthful indiscretion. We live and learn.
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I don't think it has much of anything to do with age. I know people of all ages that scam the unemployment system. At the end of the day people do what they need to do to get by.
 
flyingron said:
The recreational (which has been a crashing failure, how many have their ever been issued...less than 200 I believe).
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More than that - Last I saw, there were nearly 400 active, but that doesn't mean that's the number that were *issued*. Sporty's used to (maybe still does) have all their PP candidates take the RP checkride when they have those requirements down - That lets them take a family member or friend for a fun flight and gives them more motivation to finish off the Private. However, as soon as they upgrade to the Private, they're no longer listed as a Recreational pilot, so it's tough to say how many have been issued.

Still, for the most part, a big failure as you said. They were trying to get a certificate that didn't require a medical, which finally came in the form of Sport Pilot years later. The medical exemption they're applying for now is farther-reaching, too.
 
Geico266 said:
Jesse, all, be very skeptical of people claiming they have been in the war, or a war, or any war. I have found dozens if not hundreds of people claiming to be Viet Nam combat vets, Gulf war vets, Afghanistan war vets, and a lot of them are lying.

There are alot of people claiming to be something them are not. ;)
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Yes, at the very least it wouldn't be asking too much to see his DD214.
 
jesse said:
I don't think it has much of anything to do with age. I know people of all ages that scam the unemployment system. At the end of the day people do what they need to do to get by.
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Eating and sleeping indoors can be powerful motivators.
 
hopmedic said:
I agree. I'm a veteran who wants to fly, and someday I will. But for now, I can't, and I don't expect someone to give it to me for nothing.
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I already like you sir!

When I got out of the Army in July 1971 I was offered a disability for hearing loss. I politely declined and came home. I told them I would make it on my own.

At the time several people I knew planned outright to just go home and live on unemployment for a few months. I got home on a Thursday night, went to the unemployment office the next day and looked at their available jobs printout. I saw a job that looked interesting, got an interview that afternoon and started to work Monday.

I went to college at night that Fall, then quit work and went to school full time on the GI bill after that.

The ONLY money I've EVER taken from the gubmint was that GI bill education assistance and I felt like I had earned it.

All that said, if this vet is for real and is in a situation that absolutely prevents him from paying for his training, I'll gladly kick in to help.
 
hopmedic said:
Yes, it is sad that his brother didn't come home... I'm still torn. On one hand, I'd like to think we help our heroes. On the other hand, that doesn't mean "I'm a vet so my every desire is free." (Hyperbole just to make the point.) I'm still not sure what I'd do in Jesse's situation. The first thing, of course, would be to verify the story. If the guy lied, he gets nothing. Period. Beyond that, I'm not sure...
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If he lied about something like this he might get nothing, but he deserves a kick in the... well, you know where he deserves the kick. I don't put up with Stolen Valor.
 
MBDiagMan said:
I already like you sir!

When I got out of the Army in July 1971 I was offered a disability for hearing loss. I politely declined and came home. I told them I would make it on my own.

At the time several people I knew planned outright to just go home and live on unemployment for a few months. I got home on a Thursday night, went to the unemployment office the next day and looked at their available jobs printout. I saw a job that looked interesting, got an interview that afternoon and started to work Monday.

I went to college at night that Fall, then quit work and went to school full time on the GI bill after that.

The ONLY money I've EVER taken from the gubmint was that GI bill education assistance and I felt like I had earned it.

All that said, if this vet is for real and is in a situation that absolutely prevents him from paying for his training, I'll gladly kick in to help.
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I got out in '90, and didn't even know there was any such thing as unemployment. It took me three months to find a job, and because of that, I got behind on my bike payments ('86 Gold Wing). I sold it. Fool that I was, I didn't start looking at going to college until after the ten years was up, and my GI Bill was no longer any good. But at age 39, I did graduate with an AAS in Computer Programming, and did so with a 3.98 GPA. I haven't always done the best things, but I'm working on it.

Currently, I'm not in any position to help out, as I'm still getting back on my feet from 17 months of unemployment, but if I could, I probably would.
 
Count me in. I'm not normally known for contributing to any cause. But I managed to catch the 60 Minutes segment on Gary Sinise.
 
jesse said:
I plan on touching base with the guy again today to see what I can really verify and to try and determine how serious he is.
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That was Monday. Today is Friday. Have you heard anything?
 
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