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GroundLoopArtiste
Hi guys,
Figured I'd run this one by the group for opinions regarding post-run-up taxi technique. The three pictures below are from 16L/34R at Manassas, a class delta airport. I'm new to the airport and trying to figure out how things are done. I thought this was an interesting one.
The 16L run-up area (picture #1) has a solid line and a dashed line, which we all know indicates that you can cross from the dashed side to the solid side without permission, but the reverse isn't true. The 34R run-up area (picture #2) has a simple dashed line, indicating transit in and out of that area without further permission. The taxiway running parallel to the runway is Bravo. Part of the East ramp and the various taxiway options to 16L are shown in picture #3. All of the following would start on the East ramp.
Scenario #1
"Taxi to runway 34R via Bravo" -- Non-event. Routine practice would be to taxi via Bravo to the run-up area, complete the run-up, and then taxi to the hold-short of 34R to contact tower for take-off.
Scenario #2
"Taxi to runway 16L via Bravo" -- Now trickier. Permission is given to the runway but technically you leave the movement area if you taxi across the line into the run-up area and presumably (based on a strict reading of the regs) would require explicit permission to cross it again into the movement area.
Scenario #3
Use the circuitous route (visible in picture #3) to taxi to the run-up area and perform your run-up, *then* call Ground for permission to taxi the twenty feet to the hold-short line. As you never actually cross into the movement area, until you cross a dash-solid line, there's no requirement to talk to ATC prior to that moment.
Here's the twist: I actually called ATC prior to start-up to ask them if they wanted me to call Ground again after my run-up since I was crossing that solid-dash line. He sounded non-plussed for a moment, and then said "No, you can just proceed directly to the runway and call ready for take-off after your run-up is done."
As PIC, it's obviously my rear-end if I violate a reg. So I put this question to the group: do you think that exiting and then reentering the movement area over that line is within the bounds of the original "taxi to" instruction, or do you think that exiting the movement area requires renewed permission to reenter it again?
For this flight, I made the decision that ATC was aware of my intentions and had explicitly instructed me to taxi to the hold-short after my run-up, so the safety intent was met. But it still raised the hairs on the back of my neck a bit. It also occurred to me that standard practice isn't necessarily legal practice, and potentially this might be a normalization of deviance for the sake of convenience. This time, I had made a phone call to the recorded tower line, so I could prove that I had permission to taxi back across that line, what if next time I get a "taxi to" instruction, cross that line again, and someone calls me out on it? I wouldn't have a leg to stand on.
So what say you? What would your practice be given the above?
Figured I'd run this one by the group for opinions regarding post-run-up taxi technique. The three pictures below are from 16L/34R at Manassas, a class delta airport. I'm new to the airport and trying to figure out how things are done. I thought this was an interesting one.
The 16L run-up area (picture #1) has a solid line and a dashed line, which we all know indicates that you can cross from the dashed side to the solid side without permission, but the reverse isn't true. The 34R run-up area (picture #2) has a simple dashed line, indicating transit in and out of that area without further permission. The taxiway running parallel to the runway is Bravo. Part of the East ramp and the various taxiway options to 16L are shown in picture #3. All of the following would start on the East ramp.
Scenario #1
"Taxi to runway 34R via Bravo" -- Non-event. Routine practice would be to taxi via Bravo to the run-up area, complete the run-up, and then taxi to the hold-short of 34R to contact tower for take-off.
Scenario #2
"Taxi to runway 16L via Bravo" -- Now trickier. Permission is given to the runway but technically you leave the movement area if you taxi across the line into the run-up area and presumably (based on a strict reading of the regs) would require explicit permission to cross it again into the movement area.
Scenario #3
Use the circuitous route (visible in picture #3) to taxi to the run-up area and perform your run-up, *then* call Ground for permission to taxi the twenty feet to the hold-short line. As you never actually cross into the movement area, until you cross a dash-solid line, there's no requirement to talk to ATC prior to that moment.
Here's the twist: I actually called ATC prior to start-up to ask them if they wanted me to call Ground again after my run-up since I was crossing that solid-dash line. He sounded non-plussed for a moment, and then said "No, you can just proceed directly to the runway and call ready for take-off after your run-up is done."
As PIC, it's obviously my rear-end if I violate a reg. So I put this question to the group: do you think that exiting and then reentering the movement area over that line is within the bounds of the original "taxi to" instruction, or do you think that exiting the movement area requires renewed permission to reenter it again?
For this flight, I made the decision that ATC was aware of my intentions and had explicitly instructed me to taxi to the hold-short after my run-up, so the safety intent was met. But it still raised the hairs on the back of my neck a bit. It also occurred to me that standard practice isn't necessarily legal practice, and potentially this might be a normalization of deviance for the sake of convenience. This time, I had made a phone call to the recorded tower line, so I could prove that I had permission to taxi back across that line, what if next time I get a "taxi to" instruction, cross that line again, and someone calls me out on it? I wouldn't have a leg to stand on.
So what say you? What would your practice be given the above?
