Times to Blow Off the DH

I'll add another one - an electrical emergency*. Of course, I'd have to be having a really bad day to be down to the batteries, and an even worse one if every runway in the vicinity was below mins! :)


*I suppose the severity of this depends upon the airplane, though.
 
Henning said:
But does the pilot needing to take a dump count as a crew medical emergency? How about if they have hemmoroids too?:dunno:
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There was a Beech 1900 crew diverted a 121 flight because the Captain had to do just that. The FAA was not impressed and pulled the guys medical.
 
Captain said:
There was a Beech 1900 crew diverted a 121 flight because the Captain had to do just that. The FAA was not impressed and pulled the guys medical.
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Did he really have a GI issue that he'd been hiding or was this just cruel and unusually strange retaliation?
 
Jaybird180 said:
Did he really have a GI issue that he'd been hiding or was this just cruel and unusually strange retaliation?
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My guess is it was the FAA sending a message to 121 pilots to better manage their bowels. Delayed flight...fine. Diverted flight...no beuno. I never did hear what he had to do to get his medical back. That'd be an interesting 709 ride!
 
Captain said:
So it looks like we all agree that except for the olden days or chit operators, a passenger medical issue is NOT a reason to blow off regs and operate under emergency authority. Have to say I'm sorta glad to see it finally trend that way...
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Not really... I think we have just come to a conclusion that its not an excuse to bust minimums on an approach. Some of the other regs could safely be ignored at the pilot's discretion.
 
dell30rb said:
Not really... I think we have just come to a conclusion that its not an excuse to bust minimums on an approach. Some of the other regs could safely be ignored at the pilot's discretion.
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Not where I work. Air ambulance operators are not all cowboys.
 
Captain said:
My guess is it was the FAA sending a message to 121 pilots to better manage their bowels. Delayed flight...fine. Diverted flight...no beuno. I never did hear what he had to do to get his medical back. That'd be an interesting 709 ride!
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Sounds like the FAA would be liable for a lawsuit for arbitrary, capricious and malicious behavior.
 
Captain said:
The other thread got me thinking...when is it appropriate to ride the GS to the runway and blow off the DH? For me the list is short.

  • Less than 10 minutes of fuel onboard
  • On Fire
  • Last leg with a REALLY tight commute!
Okay, that last one is a joke...
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1) The New England Patriots are playing in an hour!

2) Meeting a hot date
 
Airport at minimums...picked up ice on ILS ...no flaps buzzing down the glide slope 30 KT faster than normal to keep from tail stalling and go around is not an option....yep...not fun


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Same experience here. No pushing regs to make a transport. Just tell atc to get priority handling so you can cut in line for the approach.
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Isn't that built into using the medevac call sign, and with filing using STS/special handling medevac on your flight plan?
 
Dead Stick said:
It's even less of an issue with 3 or 4 engine jets. Loosing an engine in one of those is considered an abnormal and not an emergency situation.
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Not true, in my experience. In the 3 and 4 engine aircraft I flown, losing an engine is still an emergency. Now, the FARs give us a little more latitude on where we have to land, but we're still going to declare an emergency when we get to our destination. I don't know anyone who would fly from LAX to LHR with an engine out, a la British Airways.
 
Sluggo63 said:
Not true, in my experience. In the 3 and 4 engine aircraft I flown, losing an engine is still an emergency. Now, the FARs give us a little more latitude on where we have to land, but we're still going to declare an emergency when we get to our destination. I don't know anyone who would fly from LAX to LHR with an engine out, a la British Airways.
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I'd agree with this. I don't know of any airliners that aren't gonna declare an emergency when they lose an engine, even in a 3-4 engine plane. I think the B-52 is the only exception I have seen to this line of thinking.

For me there are precautionary engine shutdown procedures in the ABNORMAL section but then they all drive you to the TWO ENGINE OPERATION checklist which is in the EMERGENCY section, so to me, every engine failure or shutdown is an emergency. If it makes your sphincter tighten up, it's an emergency.
 
You've heard the joke right. Six engined bomber calls in an emergency. One engine out. Tower gives him priority. Suddenly a frantic call from a fighter jet. His single engine is misfiring and he needs to land pronto. "Sorry, can't give you priority, the bomber has an engine that is OUT" Reply back from the fighter jockey "Oh yeah, the dreaded 5 engine landing".....

Ha ha
 
coloradobluesky said:
You've heard the joke right. Six engined bomber calls in an emergency. One engine out. Tower gives him priority. Suddenly a frantic call from a fighter jet. His single engine is misfiring and he needs to land pronto. "Sorry, can't give you priority, the bomber has an engine that is OUT" Reply back from the fighter jockey "Oh yeah, the dreaded 5 engine landing".....

Ha ha
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Two turning, two burning, two smoking, two choking, and two more unaccounted for!
 
Gucci Pilot said:
I'd agree with this. I don't know of any airliners that aren't gonna declare an emergency when they lose an engine, even in a 3-4 engine plane. I think the B-52 is the only exception I have seen to this line of thinking.

For me there are precautionary engine shutdown procedures in the ABNORMAL section but then they all drive you to the TWO ENGINE OPERATION checklist which is in the EMERGENCY section, so to me, every engine failure or shutdown is an emergency. If it makes your sphincter tighten up, it's an emergency.
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What if you're on the ramp?
 
Gucci Pilot said:
You know what I mean...while airborne.
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Holy smokes...a 5 day turn around on my smart alleck post. I'd forgotten all about that. Don't know what to say. Er, that's what SHE said.
 
Henning said:
Again we run into the "legal does not mean safe". The Doc verifies there was an emergency on board, this gives the pilot legal Emergency Authority to do whatever he damned well pleases, so the FAA cannot violate the pilot for his actions... unless he crashes. The stipulation in the authority is, "to assure the safe completion of his flight." You mess that up, and the hounds of Hell are available to chew your ass.
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Quite honestly, our mindset is not to put 200 people at risk to possibly save one person.
 
Kritchlow said:
Quite honestly, our mindset is not to put 200 people at risk to possibly save one person.
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That is correct, which is why company OP's instructions don't go that way. Again, there is a mix of issues involved.
 
Dead Stick said:
I agree. With exception of the last one.

It's pretty easy to come up with scenarios where the potential hazards of missing a particular approach are greater than the potential hazards of busting minimums and going for it. That's why we have made it a point to occasionally hand fly an approach to touchdown in the sim. I've done it several times (ILS to touchdown) in MU-2s back in the day. Our check airman required it on our 6-month checks. It's pretty good practice for the day when everything has gone south on you.
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Hand flying the ILS Single Engine to minimums in a transport category Jet. Part of the type rating. Good times!
 
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