Thinking about a dual sport/adventure Motorcycle

As much as it pains me to say that Michael might have a point, Michael might have a point. Looks like the 2023 Goldwings have 125 HP, and the 2018-2022s were only 90 HP. Pretty sure @jesse 's GL1800 is 125 or more, and probably has more sporty gearing and weight shouldn't be any worse with the older one I'd figure. That's enough to get out of its own way but not enough to really be sporty on that size of a bike if the gearing is on the taller side.

My Harley Ultra Classic with the 110 cubic inch engine upgrade made 115 HP on the dyne. That got it to the amount of horsepower a bike of that size should have, but it still was nothing that really woke you up.

By comparison, a BMW K1600 makes 160 HP for a similar size/weight/type bike. My R1250GSA makes 135 HP for significantly less weight.
 
Ted said:
As much as it pains me to say that Michael might have a point, Michael might have a point. Looks like the 2023 Goldwings have 125 HP, and the 2018-2022s were only 90 HP. Pretty sure @jesse 's GL1800 is 125 or more, and probably has more sporty gearing and weight shouldn't be any worse with the older one I'd figure. That's enough to get out of its own way but not enough to really be sporty on that size of a bike if the gearing is on the taller side.
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Yeah, I think Honda screwed the new ones up, I guess they must have realized that given they brought the power back up on the 2023. I've noticed that there have been tons of 2018-2022s for sale with very low mileage. The folks who owned the previous generation were pretty ****ed off at Honda's new design.

Mine is a 2004, I think, which the internet says gives it 120 HP. It looks and works like brand new. People that aren't motorcycle experts assume it is brand new.

Anyhow, at 120 HP, it's not the fastest thing on the street. But...it is fast enough for most anything you should be doing on the street. A skilled Wing rider can make the big couches do a lot more than anyone would expect. And man, it sure is comfortable.
 
Ted said:
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By comparison, a BMW K1600 makes 160 HP for a similar size/weight/type bike. My R1250GSA makes 135 HP for significantly less weight.
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My MultiStrada makes 150hp for a sub-500lb bike. It’s not as useful offroad though, even when mapped to the 100-hp “enduro” setting. Gears are just too tall, but you knew that from testing the DesertX or whatever it was last year.

Otherwise, it’s a great bike that needs a better seat.
 
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Bill said:
The current Goldwing is not about high strung horsepower, it is all about torque. Down low torque, exactly what’s needed to get 1300 pounds of bike, people, and stuff moving. I love the character of the current Wing flat six and the DCT.

https://www.cycleworld.com/story/bikes/2020-honda-gold-wing-tour-dct-dyno-test-review/
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The Goldwing was always been about torque, but my old Gl1100 could have easily given the 1800 DCT a run for its money. Godlwings have big engines, they're supposed to haul. One of these days I'll demo a non DCT Goldwing to confirm my suspicions, though demos where I live are a little scarce.
 
An old noodle frame 1100 will get dropped like a hot rock at the first sight of a corner. There’s a lot more to it than just the engine. The newest Wing moves right along.
 
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Bill said:
An old noodle frame 1100 will get dropped like a hot rock at the first sight of a corner. There’s a lot more to it than just the engine. The newest Wing moves right along.
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I've got a couple hundred miles on a GL1100. For a bike with a flat 4 I couldn't believe how top heavy the thing was and how poorly it handled at low speeds as a result. Once I got going it was ok, but it was not what we've come to expect from Honda.

I'd imagine it felt faster if nothing else because of how poorly it handled. A highly competent suspension really makes even a fast car feel slow. Good example was when I was given the opportunity to test drive a C8 Corvette. That was the slowest 0-60 in 2.9 seconds I've ever observed - the suspension was just so good it would need another 150-200 HP to feel like it was really being taxed. GM seems to have fixed that issue I believe.
 
Ted said:
I've got a couple hundred miles on a GL1100. For a bike with a flat 4 I couldn't believe how top heavy the thing was and how poorly it handled at low speeds as a result. Once I got going it was ok, but it was not what we've come to expect from Honda.
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Either you weren't riding a Goldwing or all that altitude has addled your memory. The GL1100 was an amazing bike, very heavy, but the center of gravity was really low. I used to haul mine out of my little garage pst the cars, and I'm 5 foot 7 inches of pipsqueak. I might remind the Ted that it ain't the bike, it's the rider.
 
It's always funny when Michael tries to insult me.
 
Ted said:
It's always funny when Michael tries to insult me.
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Wasn't trying to be insulting (this time) and apologies if it seemed that way. I disagree vehemently. I expected to dislike the Goldwing and liked it immensely. If my mission ever skews that way I'd happily buy another, its a very well-thought-out machine.
 
steingar said:
Wasn't trying to be insulting (this time) and apologies if it seemed that way. I disagree vehemently. I expected to dislike the Goldwing and liked it immensely. If my mission ever skews that way I'd happily buy another, its a very well-thought-out machine.
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I've ridden GL1800s, and liked them quite a bit. Not what I'd consider personally, but it also doesn't fit my mission.

That doesn't change the fact that my recollection of riding the GL1100 is top heavy and handles poorly at low speeds. I rode it both solo and with a passenger (the daughter of my friend who owned that Goldwing, no less, he and his wife weren't concerned about the rider). Didn't drop it, or even close. Got it through the twisties just fine on the group ride, others weren't keeping up. I rode another friend's GL1800 that very same day, and the difference was night and day. It's orders of magnitude better in every respect.

None of my comments have anything to do with the rider, it's bike design. Sure, like with any poor design a good operator can work around it, but physics is physics.
 
Ted said:
I've ridden GL1800s, and liked them quite a bit. Not what I'd consider personally, but it also doesn't fit my mission.

That doesn't change the fact that my recollection of riding the GL1100 is top heavy and handles poorly at low speeds. I rode it both solo and with a passenger (the daughter of my friend who owned that Goldwing, no less, he and his wife weren't concerned about the rider). Didn't drop it, or even close. Got it through the twisties just fine on the group ride, others weren't keeping up. I rode another friend's GL1800 that very same day, and the difference was night and day. It's orders of magnitude better in every respect.

None of my comments have anything to do with the rider, it's bike design. Sure, like with any poor design a good operator can work around it, but physics is physics.
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Makes no sense. The Gl1800 is nearly identical to the Gl1100 except for the addition of a couple cylinders. Other than that they're the same bike.
 
Michael, that is simply not true.

However, I do need to make a correction in my above statements. The older Goldwing I rode was a 1200, not an 1100. So my statements above reflect the 1200 and I can't speak to the 1100 specifically as I haven't ridden one.
 
Ted said:
That doesn't change the fact that my recollection of riding the GL1100 is top heavy and handles poorly at low speeds.
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Are you sure you rode an 1100 and aren't thinking of a 1000? The CG was much lower on the 1100 and while it has been a while since I've been on one I wouldn't consider it to be high. What you write sounds more like what I'd write about a 1000.
 
mondtster said:
Are you sure you rode an 1100 and aren't thinking of a 1000? The CG was much lower on the 1100 and while it has been a while since I've been on one I wouldn't consider it to be high. What you write sounds more like what I'd write about a 1000.
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See above - I was mistaken, it was a 1200. And it was not a bike I enjoyed. :)
 
mondtster said:
Are you sure you rode an 1100 and aren't thinking of a 1000? The CG was much lower on the 1100 and while it has been a while since I've been on one I wouldn't consider it to be high. What you write sounds more like what I'd write about a 1000.
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I don't recall the CG to be a whit different between my GL1100 and the DCT GL1800 I demoed. The Gl1800 was certainly heavier, but had no bad manners at all. I just thought it lacked for a bike with a nearly 2 liter engine. Damn thing had an engine meter that that in either of my cars. Should've boogied hard.

That said, I'll never ride a GSA like Ted does. The bike is way too tall for me.
 
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steingar said:
That said, I'll never die a GSA like Ted does. The bike is way too tall for me.
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One of my best friends is about your height and rides a GSA, 2-up no less. I might remind the Steingar that it's not the bike, it's the rider.
 
Ted said:
One of my best friends is about your height and rides a GSA, 2-up no less. I might remind the Steingar that it's not the bike, it's the rider.
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My friend Melissa (who is 5’4”) just traded her F750GS for a nice used 1250GS. She intends to train for the GS trophy. Micheal should also check out the slim and slight little girls that teach at the BMW performance center. They can ride rings around me!
 
Bill said:
My friend Melissa (who is 5’4”) just traded her F750GS for a nice used 1250GS. She intends to train for the GS trophy. Micheal should also check out the slim and slight little girls that teach at the BMW performance center. They can ride rings around me!
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Jocelyn Snow is all anyone needs for evidence that a small and lightweight person (male or female) can handle a GSA with proper technique.

I make my GS Trophy training part of my normal riding (rode the GSA in to work this morning) and every time I'm riding around the property with the kids. The 2024 trophy will be held in Namibia. I don't expect I am good enough to qualify for the US team, but simply trying will be fun.
 
TCABM said:
Is she taller than the windscreen is high?
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Probably depends on whether you have the windscreen in the high or low position.
 
Ted said:
One of my best friends is about your height and rides a GSA, 2-up no less. I might remind the Steingar that it's not the bike, it's the rider.
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My inseam is 29 inches. Seat height on the GSA is 35". No how, no way.
 
steingar said:
My inseam is 29 inches. Seat height on the GSA is 35". No how, no way.
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Get you a set of these and you're set, Steiny. lol.

tempo-08.jpg
 
Melissa’s inseam is 30, and she rides the big GS like a boss!

Edit: My friend Alan is 29”, has no problems on a GS.
 
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Checked with my friend whose GSA I borrow. 28” inseam, 5’5”.
 
Bill said:
Melissa’s inseam is 30, and she rides the big GS like a boss!

Edit: My friend Alan is 29”, has no problems on a GS.
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Riding perhaps, stopping not so much. Sorry, I've sat on the things. They are not safe for someone my size, and if someone my size is riding one they've either a) had the thing lowered, which rather defeats the purpose to my thinking, or b) are an accident waiting to happen when they stop on a loose surface. I'll stick with Il Negrini, I can reach the ground when I sit on it, it's pretty, fast, and is a Honda, so it won't break this decade. And it's Italian.

I really don't feel the need to ride on dirt. It's everywhere, indeed the world is made out of it. That's why another word for it is earth.

IMG_0894.jpeg
 
steingar said:
Riding perhaps, stopping not so much. Sorry, I've sat on the things. They are not safe for someone my size, and if someone my size is riding one they've either a) had the thing lowered, which rather defeats the purpose to my thinking, or b) are an accident waiting to happen when they stop on a loose surface. I'll stick with Il Negrini, I can reach the ground when I sit on it, it's pretty, fast, and is a Honda, so it won't break this decade. And it's Italian.

I really don't feel the need to ride on dirt. It's everywhere, indeed the world is made out of it. That's why another word for it is earth.

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Well dude. We do agree on one thing. It is the rider not the ride.

At least you know your limitations and are safely within them but it’s comical watching your hubris.

This young lady offers coaching if you’re interested. She’s quite a bit shorter than you and has no issues being “safe” as you put it…


 
Perfectly safe until she has to unexpectedly stop and can't quickly get herself the right way, those big heavy bikes hurt when they fall on you. Perhaps I'm an arrogant SOB, but I'm not a professional rider, no one has ever taken a youtube video of me on a bike. I'm never riding something from which I can't quickly and easily get my feet to the ground to balance it. What's safe on a dirt track and safe on a city street are different things. When that girl has ridden the streets as long as I have on bikes she can't even tiptoe we'll see who's the better rider. By the way, my own personal definition of the better rider is the one who rides the most with the fewest accidents, not the one who can do the most tricks.
 
steingar said:
…Perhaps I'm an arrogant SOB….
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No perhaps about it. You have a way of very clearly communicating this is your world and everyone else needs to live in it.
 
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Motoz Tractionator Rallz for the 1150s. These ought to do well for my uses.

30E85533-80E6-41D5-A7AD-3F9AFB355A80.jpeg
 
Video (with sound clips) of my new exhaust:

 
Ted said:
Motoz Tractionator Rallz for the 1150s. These ought to do well for my uses.

View attachment 115142
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Nice, want! After my wallet recovers from the road bicycle upgrade (Zipp 303 Firecrest wheels and full new SRAM Etap AXS Force drivetrain and brake set), I’ll be doing some upgrades to get the GS more dirt worthy. Adding full crash bars, a second set of wheels, and these very tires. The BMW class bikes had the RallZ tires, I liked them.

Tarheelpilot said:
This thread seems to be missing something …

lol
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The posts do seem to be coming up a bit short lately.
 
Bill said:
Nice, want! After my wallet recovers from the road bicycle upgrade (Zipp 303 Firecrest wheels and full new SRAM Etap AXS Force drivetrain and brake set), I’ll be doing some upgrades to get the GS more dirt worthy. Adding full crash bars, a second set of wheels, and these very tires. The BMW class bikes had the RallZ tires, I liked them.
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That's interesting on the BMW bikes having RallZ tires now. When Laurie and I went last year they had TKC80s and I thought Continental was the official tire sponsor of the Performance Center. I wonder if that changed or if they went away from TKC80s because of the short life and/or less performance than the RallZ?

I think these tires were around $450 for the pair. I installed them myself so that part was "free".
 
I think I want to try the MABDR late summer early fall, so need the GS dirt worthy by then.
 
Ahh, I'd forgotten (or maybe missed entirely) the TKC80 recall. That makes sense.

I would really like to do, well, any of the BDRs. The TAT is the closest to me, but I think I have to accept that I won't be able to do those in the near future.
 
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