Thinking About a Boat

[Papa Foxtrot]

With all this talk about towing, I'm curious what the consensus is on "bearing buddies"? I've heard comments that range from "They're great - they keep water out by keeping the grease in the hub under pressure" to "They're great at blowing out rear axle seals"...

 

[Ted]

With all this talk about towing, I'm curious what the consensus is on "bearing buddies"? I've heard comments that range from "They're great - they keep water out by keeping the grease in the hub under pressure" to "They're great at blowing out rear axle seals"...

My boat trailer has them on there. I wasn't planning on getting rid of them.

 

[dell30rb]

US regulations were the reason, especially emissions. I'd agree a lighter diesel would be nice. I'm actually surprised how well overall the truck does. I put in heavy duty towing brakes when I did them last (because I like brakes) and it has upgraded anti-roll bars, but I was still unsure. I suspect once I do the shocks and get the trailer brakes working right it'll be just fine. However I'm sure it will reduce the life of the transmission, so a bigger cooler might be on the list for next season.

Get a trans temp gauge too. I got a kit from transglow. 60 bucks maybe. The sensor that comes with the kit will fit a 4l60e or 4l80e with no modifications


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[JHW]

With all this talk about towing, I'm curious what the consensus is on "bearing buddies"? I've heard comments that range from "They're great - they keep water out by keeping the grease in the hub under pressure" to "They're great at blowing out rear axle seals"...

love em. It's amazing how much water you pump out no matter how good your seals are. BTW they don't "blow out" the seals, there is a relief hole the grease comes out. I tend to overgrease and live with the mess, it's worth it to be rid of the water.

 

[Dav8or]

I have bearing buddies on both trailers and have never had a problem. I think they are a must.

 

[asechrest]

Will my 2010 Corolla S stick shift tow a jet ski?

 

[JHW]

Will my 2010 Corolla S tow a jet ski?

easily

 

[asechrest]

easily

Thanks. Any concern with FWD on a slick ramp? (Sorry, Ted, for the slight thread hijiack.)

 

[Henning]

When I told my mom about the boat, she asked if our BMW would tow it or if we needed to use the truck. So, if we wanted to get to really unhealthy extremes...

Not even close to extreme, you should see what they tow with here in Europe. Even my cousin tows his sailboat with a 116 BMW.

 

[JHW]

Thanks. Any concern with FWD on a slick ramp? (Sorry, Ted, for the slight thread hijiack.)

it's better. further from the slimy part.

 

[Ted]

Thanks. Any concern with FWD on a slick ramp? (Sorry, Ted, for the slight thread hijiack.)

No problems with your FWD or thread hijack.

Your Corolla would have no issues. However, when on the ramp unloading with a manual transmission, best to turn the car off with it in gear plus use the parking brake. Don't want it falling off the edge.

 

[asechrest]

No problems with your FWD or thread hijack.

Your Corolla would have no issues. However, when on the ramp unloading with a manual transmission, best to turn the car off with it in gear plus use the parking brake. Don't want it falling off the edge.

I've been thinking about buying on Craigslist an older jet ski that doesn't run and tinkering with it as a first engine project. It's either that or a riding mower, but the jet ski sounds more fun.

 

[Henning]

I've been thinking about buying on Craigslist an older jet ski that doesn't run and tinkering with it as a first engine project. It's either that or a riding mower, but the jet ski sounds more fun.

Vaseline Petroleum jelly. When you go sticking your arms down in there to work on things, or whenever you are doing fiberglass grinding or work, coat your exposed skin with Vaseline Petroleum Jelly, it will save you a lot of misery.

 

[Dav8or]

I've been thinking about buying on Craigslist an older jet ski that doesn't run and tinkering with it as a first engine project. It's either that or a riding mower, but the jet ski sounds more fun.

For a first engine project I would recommend getting an older 2 stroke jet ski. The engines are easier to get in and out of the hull and they are cheap and easy to rebuild. There are also tons of mods available for most of them. In addition, the older 2 stroke boats are lighter, so easier to tow with the Corolla. Get either a Kawasaki, or Yamaha and you'll be fine. Tigershark and Polaris may be a bit tougher on parts support and I just have a personal bias against Sea Doo I guess.

 

[asechrest]

Vaseline Petroleum jelly. When you go sticking your arms down in there to work on things, or whenever you are doing fiberglass grinding or work, coat your exposed skin with Vaseline Petroleum Jelly, it will save you a lot of misery.

Heh. Thanks for the tip. I know embarrassingly little about engines (as evidenced by my "help - car!" threads). Been meaning to fix that, and I'm never gonna' start learning this stuff if I don't just dive in. There are roughly 4 billion jetskis on Craigslist here, and it sure looks like I could wait for a good deal on an older one that's not cosmetically destroyed but with a non-functional engine, then just start tearing into it. I'm betting I could get one for $300 - $800 including the trailer. A little two-stroke engine seems a good place to start. Plus, if I manage to fix it, I get a new toy to play with.

 

[Henning]

Heh. Thanks for the tip. I know embarrassingly little about engines (as evidenced by my "help - car!" threads). Been meaning to fix that, and I'm never gonna' start learning this stuff if I don't just dive in. There are roughly 4 billion jetskis on Craigslist here, and it sure looks like I could wait for a good deal on an older one that's not cosmetically destroyed but with a non-functional engine, then just start tearing into it. I'm betting I could get one for $300 - $800 including the trailer. A little two-stroke engine seems a good place to start. Plus, if I manage to fix it, I get a new toy to play with.

Usually they get 'cosmetically challenged' long before the engines crap out. Don't make that too much of a sticking point r you may take a long while to find one. Ft Lauderdale is a good used market because the yachts change out skis every couple of seasons.

 

[jesse]

I've been thinking about buying on Craigslist an older jet ski that doesn't run and tinkering with it as a first engine project. It's either that or a riding mower, but the jet ski sounds more fun.

I did that this year and ended up having to rebuild every system on the jetski. By the time I looked at how much money I spent in parts I could have just bought a nice one, lol.

Ended up having to pull the motor, get a new one, rebuild the jetpump, rebuild the carbs, fix the electrical system, rebuild most of the cooling system, etc. it took me about a month in my spare time but it's really nice now.

 

[Ted]

A project will typically cost more than just buying a good one. However, the project can be fun and educational. If you're looking for education value, go for it. I like jet skis a lot more than lawn mowers.

 

[Henning]

A project will typically cost more than just buying a good one. However, the project can be fun and educational. If you're looking for education value, go for it. I like jet skis a lot more than lawn mowers.

I'd pick a car or motorcycle project, but yeah, a jet ski is more fun than a law mower.

 

[Ted]

I'd pick a car or motorcycle project, but yeah, a jet ski is more fun than a law mower.

Agreed. Car/motorcycle would be my choice as well.

 

[asechrest]

For a first engine project I would recommend getting an older 2 stroke jet ski. The engines are easier to get in and out of the hull and they are cheap and easy to rebuild. There are also tons of mods available for most of them. In addition, the older 2 stroke boats are lighter, so easier to tow with the Corolla. Get either a Kawasaki, or Yamaha and you'll be fine. Tigershark and Polaris may be a bit tougher on parts support and I just have a personal bias against Sea Doo I guess.

Thanks. Was definitely looking at the 2-strokes. Had gathered via some light reading that those were best for tinkering by a beginner. I'll look at the Kawasaki or Yamaha skis.

Usually they get 'cosmetically challenged' long before the engines crap out. Don't make that too much of a sticking point r you may take a long while to find one. Ft Lauderdale is a good used market because the yachts change out skis every couple of seasons.

Yeah, I had been looking in the Tampa Bay area, but I could pretty much look for one in the whole southern half of Florida. I'd love to get lucky with an older model, 2-stroke, not cosmetically destroyed, with an engine that has some minor problems but with an owner who doesn't want to deal with it and is ready to offload it for cheap.

I did that this year and ended up having to rebuild every system on the jetski. By the time I looked at how much money I spent in parts I could have just bought a nice one, lol.

Ended up having to pull the motor, get a new one, rebuild the jetpump, rebuild the carbs, fix the electrical system, rebuild most of the cooling system, etc. it took me about a month in my spare time but it's really nice now.

Ouch. Well, while I'm not looking to spend $10k in parts on a $500, decade+-old jetski, I wouldn't mind the end result being a bit more expensive than if I had bought a working one of the same vintage. The education value is worth it to me.

A project will typically cost more than just buying a good one. However, the project can be fun and educational. If you're looking for education value, go for it. I like jet skis a lot more than lawn mowers.

Exactly. That's my goal. (Thread hijack level: expert )

I'd pick a car or motorcycle project, but yeah, a jet ski is more fun than a law mower.

I've still got the car project on a side-burner. A jet-ski or lawnmower project is more approachable in the near-term.

--

Nice comments. Thanks everyone.

 

[Ted]

Then get an appropriate 2-stroke jetski. You'll enjoy using it and get the pleasure of seeing the fruits of your labor.

Projects get addictive. Jesse can attest to the current state of my garage and driveway. VR4 in a billion pieces, BMW needs new rear shocks (and a running issue I'm still working on), truck needs shocks (and maybe air springs for the boat, we'll see). Oh yeah, and don't forget the boat and 310.

The benefit is that everything does drive quite well, and I like having a bit of wrench time at night.

 

[jesse]

Ouch. Well, while I'm not looking to spend $10k in parts on a $500, decade+-old jetski, I wouldn't mind the end result being a bit more expensive than if I had bought a working one of the same vintage. The education value is worth it to me.

Assuming the inside of the crank case doesn't look like mine did you'll probably have a much easier time.

The Jetski story:

I saw this on Craigslist and was incredibly impressed with the amount of detail in the advertisement. Surely this will be a hell of a deal! How could I go wrong buying this thing?

So I grab my Craigslist warchest cash (piggy bank) and drive to Omaha to buy my new Ski that I'll surely have on the water in a day or two.

This is what I saw in person. Looks really nice. I'll take it!

I get it home and discover quickly the starter is fine but the engine is definitely locked up. I pour a bunch of PB blaster in hte cylinders and let that soak for a day hoping I'd get lucky. No dice. Time to pull the engine

After I removed the intake and reed valves I could see right in the crank case. I was pretty damn tempted to just part it out and sell it on eBay at this point but decided to press forward and fix it.

Next up was tackling the jetpump which was also locked up. I removed all the bolts that hold it to the jetski but could not get the damn thing off for the life of me. Lots of silicon is used on it as well. Finally after hours of ****ing around I told Ted to hold my beer and ripped it off with my truck

The entire jetpump was junk, so I ordered a refurb housing and a new impeller and assembled that while waiting for my refurb motor to show up.

Time to tear into the carbs. They were full of sand and a major PITA to get synced properly. 3 carbs that can't be adjusted unless you remove them from the ski which is about a hour job.

Carbs rebuilt, per the service manual, everything triple checked. I did end up having to tear them apart AGAIN because it ran like total **** and I finally found a service bulletin that said the carb settings in the original factory service manual were incorrect (which is what I was using).

New (refurb) engine ready to drop in. When you receive it you have to move your flywheel, stator, starter, coupler, etc from your old engine over to the new one. I also elected to delete the factory oil injection system. I run premix instead (mix it with the fuel). A lot more reliable this way since a failure of the pump or one of it's many oil lines would cook your engine.

Everything back together:

It's alive!

I stepped through every page in the service manual and if there was a way to check the tolerance of something or test or inspect something I did it. Anything that didn't meet the limits I replaced. I pulled the gas tank and cleaned the **** out of it. Replaced every fuel house, teh fuel filter, etc. Replaced all coolant hoses. Expensive but I ended up with a pretty nice jetski (too bad it's not a faster one, lol).

 

[Ted]

Makes my boat look easy.

Show up, look at boat. Buy first one I look at. Put on water, it works. No beer required, but Jesse was surprised it didn't sink.

 

[Dav8or]

Thanks. Was definitely looking at the 2-strokes. Had gathered via some light reading that those were best for tinkering by a beginner. I'll look at the Kawasaki or Yamaha skis.


Yeah, I had been looking in the Tampa Bay area, but I could pretty much look for one in the whole southern half of Florida. I'd love to get lucky with an older model, 2-stroke, not cosmetically destroyed, with an engine that has some minor problems but with an owner who doesn't want to deal with it and is ready to offload it for cheap.


Ouch. Well, while I'm not looking to spend $10k in parts on a $500, decade+-old jetski, I wouldn't mind the end result being a bit more expensive than if I had bought a working one of the same vintage. The education value is worth it to me.


Exactly. That's my goal. (Thread hijack level: expert )


I've still got the car project on a side-burner. A jet-ski or lawnmower project is more approachable in the near-term.

--

Nice comments. Thanks everyone.

Corrosion is your biggest concern there in Florida. I don't know if it's possible to find a ski there that hasn't been in the ocean or not, but if you can, this is what you want. Ocean boats are usually pretty obvious once you look in the engine compartment. Rarely do owners take the time to treat the compartment with something like Salt Away, so all the metal parts start corroding on the outside. Freshwater boats just don't corrode that much.

 

[docmirror]

Assuming the inside of the crank case doesn't look like mine did you'll probably have a much easier time.

The Jetski story:


I stepped through every page in the service manual and if there was a way to check the tolerance of something or test or inspect something I did it. Anything that didn't meet the limits I replaced. I pulled the gas tank and cleaned the **** out of it. Replaced every fuel house, teh fuel filter, etc. Replaced all coolant hoses. Expensive but I ended up with a pretty nice jetski (too bad it's not a faster one, lol).

Nice work. The 900 STX is one of the fastest under 1000cc boats. It's what I have for myself, and solo wide open I can get upward of 50MPH, which on a small ski, on the water seems more like 100. I know you're still breaking in your engine, but once you get it broke in, it should go near 50. Check your impeller clearance. Not sure if yours has the jet pitch adjustment on the thumb switch but if it does, a lot of people have them running way too high, or way too low. Direct in line with the exit of the pump will get the best performance.

BTW, far, far more engines blow up in jet skis of all kinds than hull damage or wear out. It takes about a second of overspeed when the driver jumps a wake and aeriates the pump at full throttle to toss a rod. Or, as mentioned quite often the oil injection system will get some goo in one line and seize the piston. If the rod was thrown, almost surely it was jumped and oversped. Based on the condition of the rest of the ski, this is consistent with the PO lack of skill in maintaining the ski. Oh they knew it was blowed up when they sold it 'needs a starter'. When the rod lets go, it's really rather loud, and quite abrupt.

 

[asechrest]

Assuming the inside of the crank case doesn't look like mine did you'll probably have a much easier time.

The Jetski story:

Nice! I hope not to have quite that magnitude of a project as my first one.

 

[asechrest]

Corrosion is your biggest concern there in Florida. I don't know if it's possible to find a ski there that hasn't been in the ocean or not, but if you can, this is what you want. Ocean boats are usually pretty obvious once you look in the engine compartment. Rarely do owners take the time to treat the compartment with something like Salt Away, so all the metal parts start corroding on the outside. Freshwater boats just don't corrode that much.

We've got some sizeable lakes but most of what I see for sale is salt-water based. Stuff like this: http://tampa.craigslist.org/psc/boa/4649212737.html

[EDIT] - Or this: http://miami.craigslist.org/brw/boa/4609895485.html

 

[Henning]

I always preferred stand up skis, I started with the old Kawasaki 440 and always thought the sit down ones boring except doing big wave tow ins and rescues for surfers, then they're just right for the job and when you have the 250hp ones, you can have a hoot on big waves, I hit some really insane speeds getting out sometimes, but it's either that or let the wave take you at whatever speed you're already at

I did get to ride one of the new generation stand ups recently. It was a toy on a neighbor's yacht, holy **** what a bucket of fun but man, it's outrageously expensive for the 170hp one, over €100k is what he said.

http://www.swissauto.com/e/fahrzeug/projekt_detail.jsp?ID_Display=20000V

 

[Ted]

Go in and negotiate the price down based on the fact that it probably threw a rod. Then do like Jesse and have some beer.

If I lived by salt water, I'd just accept the increase servicing required on the boat as a consequence of getting to be out in the Ocean/Gulf, which seems like more fun to me anyway.

 

[Henning]

Corrosion is your biggest concern there in Florida. I don't know if it's possible to find a ski there that hasn't been in the ocean or not, but if you can, this is what you want. Ocean boats are usually pretty obvious once you look in the engine compartment. Rarely do owners take the time to treat the compartment with something like Salt Away, so all the metal parts start corroding on the outside. Freshwater boats just don't corrode that much.

That's why you buy the 'yacht disposal' ones, they are well taken care of, we do use Salt X, we do flush, wash and rinse after use, there are people who's job it is and they are paid well so they do their job. We also bring them in for their factory services and any repairs whenever something breaks. You don't find them for $500, but you find them cheap enough that you'll save money over building out a project one.

 

[Ted]

Other option: buy a jetski up here and do a trip of epic proportions.

Ohio River to Mississippi River to Gulf of Mexico to Florida. Yeah, it would be long and slow, but man would it ever be fun!

Jesse, next time you come out here, bring the jetski. Missouri east to Mississippi south to Ohio east should get you here.

 

[Henning]

Other option: buy a jetski up here and do a trip of epic proportions.

Ohio River to Mississippi River to Gulf of Mexico to Florida. Yeah, it would be long and slow, but man would it ever be fun!

Jesse, next time you come out here, bring the jetski. Missouri east to Mississippi south to Ohio east should get you here.

Down stream? Why would it be slow? Unless you're comparing to flying. Probably take a week as an easy run.

 

[dell30rb]

I did that this year and ended up having to rebuild every system on the jetski. By the time I looked at how much money I spent in parts I could have just bought a nice one, lol.

Ended up having to pull the motor, get a new one, rebuild the jetpump, rebuild the carbs, fix the electrical system, rebuild most of the cooling system, etc. it took me about a month in my spare time but it's really nice now.

I had some good luck. I got an old kawasaki stand-up jetski for free. It was locked up. I beat the piston out of the cylinder with a sledge and a block of wood. New oversize piston and had a machine shop bore the cylinder out.

I dumped a bunch of WD 40 in the crankcase, spun it over by hand until the bearings felt smooth and then turned the ski upsiedown and let the WD 40 run out.

Put the motor back together, cleaned the fuel system and I used that thing for 2 years and sold it for $800

 

[Ted]

Down stream? Why would it be slow? Unless you're comparing to flying. Probably take a week as an easy run.

I'm comparing to flying or driving. Otherwise, yeah, about a week. Would also be fun to make the full circle and come back home via Lake Erie.

So I figure my boat gets about 3 MPG. What's a jetski get? 5?

 

[docmirror]

I'm comparing to flying or driving. Otherwise, yeah, about a week. Would also be fun to make the full circle and come back home via Lake Erie.

So I figure my boat gets about 3 MPG. What's a jetski get? 5?

Maybe .8 if a two stroke and run it hard. Yes - may be under 1MPG.

 

[Ted]

Found a SeaDoo chart that seems to estimate around 6 MPG at WOT. So that would make me think 10 would be doable if you went at a slower speed. That actually ends up not being completely awful.

 

[Ted]

Maybe .8 if a two stroke and run it hard. Yes - may be under 1MPG.

Interesting. Here's what I found:

http://www.seadoosource.com/fueleconomy.html

 

[Henning]

I'm comparing to flying or driving. Otherwise, yeah, about a week. Would also be fun to make the full circle and come back home via Lake Erie.

So I figure my boat gets about 3 MPG. What's a jetski get? 5?

Lol, I've never been able to gauge it. I've only done one trip on one that would have allowed for it, and didn't think to do it. I guess more though, at least the light ones. We rode from Newport to Avalon, 44nm, on less than 5 gallons of gas on a pretty flat ocean, we were honking and made it in around an hour. That was on one similar to the one Jesse has. Mostly I only operate them in the surf and such so there's not much way to judge, but even the big 250hp supercharged variants will work well over an hour on a load of fuel, and that is constantly up and down and up and down, and popping up on plane uses the most fuel of any process except towing the rescue rig and bailing the guys out of the danger zone.

 

[dell30rb]

Maybe .8 if a two stroke and run it hard. Yes - may be under 1MPG.

Friend's heavy Phoenix 27' Fishbuster with twin 250 two stroke ox66 yamahas gets 1.25mpg. You must be talking about a boat, not a ski


Some guys rig up the jetski's and take them out 30-60 miles offshore.