The AIM recommends the pronoun "to" before your target altitude.
The 7 Deadly Sins of Radio Communications
- Thread starter Mooney Fan
- Start date
Mooney Fan
Cleared for Takeoff
Times change. Now when leaving one frequency to the next some say 'See ya' while we used to say 'So long'...
I still say so long
I still say so long
StevieTimes
Line Up and Wait
Yah, the AIM says:
2. (Name) CENTER, (aircraft identification), LEAVING
(exact altitude or flight level), CLIMBING TO OR
DESCENDING TO (altitude of flight level)
* I personally leave the "to" out myself, even though the AIM says it... "leaving 5,000 climbing 6,000" seems to work just as well.
Hank S
En-Route
Talking to Center or Approacn, when they give me anither frequency, i generally say Thanks or Thanks for your help.
wilkersk
Pattern Altitude
Heard a new one the other day: "Im, uh..., breaking off the approach" apparently means, "I'm on the 45, and either didn't hear you call your crosswind, or I just thought I'd make your life interesting for a few seconds." This was the first clearly understood radio call I'd heard from this guy, just as I spot him coming right at me, less than 200 yds. Since I had no idea what exactly he was going to do and we were on a direct collision course, I turned to the right and pointed the nose down just a little, trying to keep him in sight. ---Fun times!
Juliet Hotel
En-Route
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Juliet Hotel
8 pages of discussion about things that can all be solved by simply flying with your radio set to my preferred configuration.
And don’t repeat yourself in a redundant fashion.
What if ATC says "words twice"?
Rex Kramer
Line Up and Wait
I was broken from the "with you" long ago by my MEI (who was also my boss as I was a CFI at the school). He hated the phrase and would fail an engine whenever he heard you say it.
First time in the plane. On climb out switching over to departure I said with you.. boom there goes the engine. No mercy. Last time I ever said it was on a single engine NDB approach. Said it checking in with the tower and the SOB* failed my one good engine! Like I said, no mercy. He did give it back to me pretty quickly, though..
*he was actually a great instructor and knew his stuff cold. He demanded radio discipline and professionalism along with flying skills, knowledge and teaching ability.
First time in the plane. On climb out switching over to departure I said with you.. boom there goes the engine. No mercy. Last time I ever said it was on a single engine NDB approach. Said it checking in with the tower and the SOB* failed my one good engine! Like I said, no mercy. He did give it back to me pretty quickly, though..
*he was actually a great instructor and knew his stuff cold. He demanded radio discipline and professionalism along with flying skills, knowledge and teaching ability.
I usually say "have a good (day/afternoon/evening/night). Thanks for the help."
I learned to fly with instructors who seemed radio adverse. Still regularly fly with instructors who are radio adverse. I was broken of my limited radio contact when I was out in California. Cant really get anywhere in SoCal safely without talking to SoCal. Had a great instructor out there though who taught me well how to have balance to my calls. Now I miss the sound of having ATC talking to me.
LongRoadBob
Cleared for Takeoff
Wouldn’t inserting “up” clarify it? “Climbing up to 6,000” ? Because even though one uses FL for 26000, there is the thing that you can’t be sure the caller is following that convention, and if one meant that, it would still be clear, “climbing up to two-six thousand” (nobody is thinking “oh he meant 226000”)
And the reciprocal, adding then down when descending would be even more clear about vertical direction.
Here's one that doesn't use flight levels and is an example of a misheard clearance using the word "to"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Tiger_Line_Flight_66
Pilot was "cleared two four zero zero"
Pilot heard "cleared to four zero zero"
Presumably ATC heard readback "cleared two four zero zero"
Of course as a pilot of a large jet (747), the pilot probably should have had some better situational awareness regarding local terrain, not ignored the low altitude warning and/or questioned the controller for clarification but "to" can be dangerous.
It wasn't a video but a website that had the original advice I was looking for...
N12345 passing 6,000 descending 2,400
Still leaves some room for that error but certainly seems less.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Tiger_Line_Flight_66
Pilot was "cleared two four zero zero"
Pilot heard "cleared to four zero zero"
Presumably ATC heard readback "cleared two four zero zero"
Of course as a pilot of a large jet (747), the pilot probably should have had some better situational awareness regarding local terrain, not ignored the low altitude warning and/or questioned the controller for clarification but "to" can be dangerous.
It wasn't a video but a website that had the original advice I was looking for...
N12345 passing 6,000 descending 2,400
Still leaves some room for that error but certainly seems less.
Last edited:
Hank S
En-Route
I just use the simple "N23J, three thousand climbing seven thousand five hundred" or "N23J, six thousand three hundred descending 4000" for brevity and clarity.
A lot of things went wrong on that flight, but if the current AIM-recommended terminology is contributing to safety issues, shouldn't an effort be made to convince the FAA to change it, rather than just ignoring it?