Super Vikings? East Coast?
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Tommar98
Pre-takeoff checklist
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Tommar98
The most knowledgeable BSV guy on east coast is Dave Pasquale in Pottstown, PA. He’s one of four gurus in the country on these planes. He’s great guy to talk too.
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Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
Don”t
Alternate opinion: Try it, look into it, you like it, do.
jimhorner
Line Up and Wait
Might want to also ask here: http://www.vikingpilots.com/
MBDiagMan
Final Approach
Some yeas ago my hangar neighbor had one and it was his baby. Never been a fan myself, but he really loved it. There are different planes for different people. My number one criteria for selecting one would be confirming that it had ALWAYS been hangared.
steingar
Taxi to Parking
When I bought my Mooney I had a hard time finding a CFI conversant with it. Not all mechanics are that up on the breed. And that’s for an airframe of which thousands were made. I’d hate going through all that for something as rare as a SV. How many of these things are there?
Tommar98
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I love the BSV. Amazing plane with lots of performance. I couldn’t buy one because I had no hanger space available anywhere near me to house it. They are a bit snug. But they are fast and handle great. You ABSOLUTELY need a prebuy done by one of the 4 BSV experts. I ended up with Comanche 250 which I love as well
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genna
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ТУ-104
I suppose I could have said in the OP that I’m not interested in general opinions about the plane. And I don’t want to start yet another Viking vs whatever argument. Not that it would make any difference
I’m well aware of opinions on Vikings. I’ve read them all on many POA threads about the subject. My post’s intention was only gain some first hand specific info
I’m well aware of opinions on Vikings. I’ve read them all on many POA threads about the subject. My post’s intention was only gain some first hand specific info
Hiperbiper
Line Up and Wait
Second Dave Pasquale. He can put you in touch with someone local to you...
Love the Super Viking.
Hiperbiper
Love the Super Viking.
Hiperbiper
edo2000
Pre-takeoff checklist
According to Wikipedia, 1356 Super Vikings were built.
I owned an IO540 powered one for a few years. Trained for my instrument rating in it. Flew it from the lower 48 to Alaska and back twice. I thought it handled well but was not as roomy, comfortable or load-capable as the C185 I also flew at the time, and not much faster. I wouldn't buy another one, but they do offer quite a bit of capability for a fairly low price, which is why I chose the Viking originally.
I owned an IO540 powered one for a few years. Trained for my instrument rating in it. Flew it from the lower 48 to Alaska and back twice. I thought it handled well but was not as roomy, comfortable or load-capable as the C185 I also flew at the time, and not much faster. I wouldn't buy another one, but they do offer quite a bit of capability for a fairly low price, which is why I chose the Viking originally.
jimhorner
Line Up and Wait
From the FAA database, there are currently 662 registered Vikings. There are another 306 registered model 14-* models.
I wouldn’t call that exactly rare.
Not all that hard to find an instructor. It’s a easy plane to fly with straight forward systems and honest flying characteristics.
It does take a mechanic familar with tube, wood, and fabric planes. There are four well known shops specializing in these planes located around the country within fairly easy reach.
Of course, likely any mechanic who’s comfortable working on classics like the J-3, Great Lakes, Citabria, et. al. would likely do a good job. Someone who is familiar only with the metal spam cans, on the other hand, might not be the best choice.
The point is valid. If you want a great flying plane at a great price and are willing to travel a bit for maintainence, the Viking can be a great plane. If not, then sure, buy something else.
What I don’t understand is all the negative stuff that comes up whenever Vikings are mentioned. You got a Mooney? Great. Nice planes. Bonanza? ditto. Cessna 150? Lot’s of fun. You rarely see Viking pilots/owners disparaging other planes.
But boy, mention a Viking, and folks seem to just crawl out of the woodwork to bad mouth them. I really don’t get it. Jealousy?
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jimhorner
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Then definitely go over to Viking Pilots (http://www.vikingpilots.com/ . You’ll get better information there from people who own and maintain them. Much easier to filter out the noise.
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I can't imagine anyone who's flown one not liking it, except perhaps that it is a little tight; but handles like a dream, and you can't (with a straight face) claim they're ugly. Built hell for stout, too.
jimhorner
Line Up and Wait
Agreed. Although, there was one guy on here several years ago who would always pitch in whenever the subject of Vikings came up, and say how ugly they are. Just don’t get it.
Just got mine back a couple of days ago from getting a new factory reman engine. Took it for its annual at the end of May, and the mechanic found a crack in the crankcase. Continental didn’t deliver the new engine till just before Christmas. Sure is nice to have it back home in its own hangar.
And yeah, don’t see how anybody could call this ugly.
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Hiperbiper
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In addition to my above post I'd like to state that any good mechanic with a working knowledge of tube and fabric construction as well as a knowledge of wood in aircraft structures can work on and inspect Bellanca aircraft. The is not to demean the true experts in these aircraft (the Big Four) but to put forth that there many many A&P's out there that are quite capable of inspecting, repairing and maintaining these aircraft. I get so tired of hearing and reading (especially on the Viking site) that these airplanes are SO different and SO special that only Joe the Super Mechanic has a chance in hell of keeping one in the air...
Yes they have differences from aluminum birds. But armed with AC43.13, an Aircraft Parts Manual and a Maintenance manual there is nothing that cannot be fixed on a Super Viking!
I have a Viking, a Champ and a Hiperbipe. All are rag and tube fuselage. The 'bipe and the Viking are all wood wings, the Champ has wood spars. Inspection methods are different as they are for all types but in wood wings we look for "rot" where in a Bonanza we inspect for "corrosion". Different methods for same end, a sound structure.
The above being said; I will still ask questions on the Viking website (or the Aeronca website) or call on a Type Guru to answer a question or maybe ask if there is an easier way to do a task. That's how you continue to learn.
JMPO
Hiperbiper
Yes they have differences from aluminum birds. But armed with AC43.13, an Aircraft Parts Manual and a Maintenance manual there is nothing that cannot be fixed on a Super Viking!
I have a Viking, a Champ and a Hiperbipe. All are rag and tube fuselage. The 'bipe and the Viking are all wood wings, the Champ has wood spars. Inspection methods are different as they are for all types but in wood wings we look for "rot" where in a Bonanza we inspect for "corrosion". Different methods for same end, a sound structure.
The above being said; I will still ask questions on the Viking website (or the Aeronca website) or call on a Type Guru to answer a question or maybe ask if there is an easier way to do a task. That's how you continue to learn.
JMPO
Hiperbiper
Hiperbiper
Line Up and Wait
Jim that is one Beautiful aeroplane!
You just need more junk...uh...patina in your hangar.
Hiperbiper
You just need more junk...uh...patina in your hangar.
Hiperbiper
MBDiagMan
Final Approach
Agreed. Although, there was one guy on here several years ago who would always pitch in whenever the subject of Vikings came up, and say how ugly they are. Just don’t get it.
Just got mine back a couple of days ago from getting a new factory reman engine. Took it for its annual at the end of May, and the mechanic found a crack in the crankcase. Continental didn’t deliver the new engine till just before Christmas. Sure is nice to have it back home in its own hangar.
And yeah, don’t see how anybody could call this ugly.
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Beauty is not something that is up for debate. That is something that is simply a matter of taste.
jimhorner
Line Up and Wait
Thanks! I’m pretty proud of the plane. Lots of fun; it’s really a magic carpet.
You should have seen the hangar the first few years. Junk everywhere, oil soaked floor, one dim, 45 Watt blub.
Then my wife “suggested” I clean it up. Painted the hangar, put in an epoxy floor, LED lights, and lots of storage and organization. Much better. Pretty proud of that also. Although, since it’s a rental, one day someone else will enjoy the fruits of my labor (except for the lights, and storage; I’ll take those with me)
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jimhorner
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I like your plane choices.
I got my license in 1989, but didn’t fly for the next 23 years. Once I got back into it in 2012, I’ve put 888 hours in the logbook in my Viking, rented Citabrias, Decathlons, and a Great Lakes biplane. All fabric, tube, and wood. In the same time period, I put 125 in all metal planes. Clearly, I share the interest in the fabric planes.
106 of those hours are tailwheel also.
Did you build or buy your Hiperbipe? If you built it, I’m curious as to how long it took?
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Hiperbiper
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I bought it...I'm afraid I lack the time, temperament and talent to build from almost scratch. 7HT was sold to an individual and built by the Sorrells in exchange for the use of the plane for factory demos. One of the pictures on the old Sorrell website was of Mark (with parachute) in the plane just prior to doing the test flight in 1982. Quoted built time was 2500-3000 hrs. A few years later Frank Christensen put out the Eagle with a 1000 or less build time and similar performance. Needless to say, that put a damper on Hiperbipe kit sales. This has it's upsides...at fly ins and airshows I'm never asked to park along side all the other Hiperbipes...
Hiperbiper
Hiperbiper
steingar
Taxi to Parking
I would. A pal was telling me about a friend of his that just bought one of these things. He hasn't a hangar, can't say how a wooden aircraft is going to far in a Northern winter. There isn't anyone local at all to teach him to fly the thing, and from the sounds of it he isn't a good enough stick to just pick it up. There are some old-time mechanics here who can easily do the rag and wood thing, but if there's anything special about taking care of a BSV, I promise they don't know it.
Didn't mean to disparage the breed, I'm certain they're fine airplanes. I don't think they're likely to make a good ownership experience for just anyone.
Matthew Rogers
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As a woodworker, I would rather have one than a metal airplane. I just made spars for a Tiger Moth and they were complicated, but most wooden spars are simple straight boards for the most part with a few angles and bevels. The tiger moth ones were I Beam shaped with multiple interrupted dados cut with special shaper knives and had to be hand fed through the shaper. I imagine the BSV stuff is easier to make if necessary. All the other work is time consuming, but airplane Woodworks can be done in a garage shop with very few tools if required. Just a lot of time.
Let'sgoflying!
Touchdown! Greaser!
Wow!
Matthew Rogers
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One guy at my club has two tiger moths, two gypsy moths, a moth major, chipmunk, plus some others, in various states from silver medal at Oshkosh to broken in pieces after crashing them. He gets me to make new pieces from time to time. Always a challenge because accurate drawings are hard to find and I am often given a pile of broken pieces from a crash to reconstruct.
Let'sgoflying!
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Is it getting difficult to get good quality wood, especially spars?
Matthew Rogers
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I am close to Nyc and ML Condon has Sitka spruce in stock for the boat building industry. They are a pain to work with (only care about large customers from the city who have deep pockets), expensive, and you do have to pick through the pile to find pieces that are the right quality based on aircraft specs, but it is available. And just a few hours to get the wood back to my shop round trip.
What makes it aircraft quality? Hardness, grain structure? dryness?
jimhorner
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I don’t think so. At least, I hope not. I just started construction of the spar building jig to build three spars for a Ron Sands designed Fokker triplane replica. I’m planning to purchase the spar material from Aircraft Spruce: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/wppages/sprucesparstock.php.
I’m pretty sure they’ll have the wood I need for the project.
Not cheap though. Six 3/4”x8 3/4” x 9’ boards for the flanges will run me $918 plus tax and shipping. I’ll also need some 1/16”, 1/8”, and 1/4” aircraft grade plywood, some triangular stock, and some 5/16” spruce for webbing. The three box spars will probably take several months to build. I figure the total cost for the spars will be in the $1,500 range, $500 per spar.
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SoonerAviator
I'd imagine that's not much of an issue, but you can't just go to Lowe's or HD to get quality wood. Most major cities have a supplier or two which specialize in quality lumber/hardwoods/exotics.
Matthew Rogers
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The Tiger Moth drawings had specs listed, but it relates to minimum number of rings per inch (more is better in spruce), maximum grain runout (deviation from straight line down the spar), maximum size of tight knots and defects, etc. It is still a crapshoot as wood is not a uniform material so it could contain completely invisible defects and one piece that meets the specs could be twice as strong as another that also meets the specs. But that must all be engineered into the design so that the specs relate to a minimum requirement and often the wood is stronger than required.
If anyone needs spars in the NY/New England area, let me know and I may be able to make them for you (no PMA/TSO). Parts would have to be approved by you and your AP/IA as owner produced replacements for old parts no longer under production.
If anyone needs spars in the NY/New England area, let me know and I may be able to make them for you (no PMA/TSO). Parts would have to be approved by you and your AP/IA as owner produced replacements for old parts no longer under production.
jimhorner
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Was the plane for sale, or were you just getting a ride? Left seat or right seat?
They do fly nice, don’t they?
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genna
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Not for sale. Nor am I ready to buy anything. A very nice gentleman from Viking Pilots was kind enough to show me his plane.
Right seat, but I got to pilot it for about 30-40 min
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