Spin training

WannFly

WannFly

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Is there a good or bad time to do a spin training? I am pre-solo and wondering if it makes any difference if I take the training now or later? The school is 3 hrs drive, and there is a nice resturant there, so plenty of reasons to go there and since they teach spin... might as well... thoughts?

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I almost didn't initially take flight lessons when I saw a spin training video. After talking to a CFI, my mind was set at ease and he didn't make me go through that as it is not required to actually do the training (just know the procedures). However, later in my training I did ask him to do the training and it was great. I thought it was so much fun. So for me, doing it too early may have caused me to chicken out of flying - but that was because I had other fears of flying in general. Ultimately, I am glad I did the training because it gave me more confidence. Knowing all I know, I would have the CFI do some training with you (real world) so that is you are up and working on stalls, etc, should you accidentally get in a spin, you will know exactly what to do.
 
I thought this thread had something to do with Sac and Asian girls.
 
steviedeviant said:
I almost didn't initially take flight lessons when I saw a spin training video. After talking to a CFI, my mind was set at ease and he didn't make me go through that as it is not required to actually do the training (just know the procedures). However, later in my training I did ask him to do the training and it was great. I thought it was so much fun. So for me, doing it too early may have caused me to chicken out of flying - but that was because I had other fears of flying in general. Ultimately, I am glad I did the training because it gave me more confidence. Knowing all I know, I would have the CFI do some training with you (real world) so that is you are up and working on stalls, etc, should you accidentally get in a spin, you will know exactly what to do.
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Yepp and that's precisely why I want to do this training. Power on stall bothers me quite a bit, and the reason is what if I go into spin, so I thought, we'll if I see the extreme it won't bother me anymore since I would know how to recover from it.

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OP said he's pre-solo. How about NO.

There's a time tested and true system of training pilots. Stick with that.
 
Sean Spicer is available most days after the press briefing. I say go for it! :D
 
Ravioli said:
OP said he's pre-solo. How about NO.

There's a time tested and true system of training pilots. Stick with that.
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true but not too long ago it was a part of PTS and canada still requires it from what i know and spin is a real possibility so i dont understand why they dont teach it anymore. its like, ok this move someday can kill you, so we dont want you to know what to do if u get into one and have time to recover
 
If the plane is capable I'm a big fan of doing it pre solo.



WannFly said:
true but not too long ago it was a part of PTS and canada still requires it from what i know and spin is a real possibility so i dont understand why they dont teach it anymore. its like, ok this move someday can kill you, so we dont want you to know what to do if u get into one and have time to recover
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Well that's because we've dumbed down flying and removed anything that requires much stick and rudder in favor of EFBs and stabilized everything, add to the industry cheapening itself down so CFIs often make crap money, you end up enough people in the CFI who really don't have the skills to safely demonstrate spins, let alone pull a student out of screwed up spin recovery.

I mean during my initial CFI ride we did a simulated engine failure (or a short field, I forget) anyways, without even thinking I slipped a little bit to burn a little altitude and airspeed, the ASI mentioned he liked seeing that and that he wished he saw it more...WTF? Learning to fly in a 7AC slips were not some boutique maneuver, it was as common place as trimming the plane. Point is, in a world where slips are becoming a lost art, wondering why we don't teach spins to student pilots is asking a bit much
 
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Doesn't matter - if you feel like doing now, go for it. With repetetion, they become comfortable/routine. There is no special reason to wait, or not wait. . .
 
Just curious, what are you flying now?

Can you do spin training in that?

I'd recommend, if possible, doing the spin training in a plane which most resembles what you're going to be doing the most flying in
 
James331 said:
Just curious, what are you flying now?

Can you do spin training in that?

I'd recommend, if possible, doing the spin training in a plane which most resembles what you're going to be doing the most flying in
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i am flying 172 SP, checked with my CFI, its not approved for spin and they dont do spin training here. i dont know yet what airplane i will be flying on the other flight school, have an email out to them to find that out.
 
I'd just call folks who have C150/2s, I hear about folks spending big bucks to go to "upset training" schools to learn basic spins in crazy expensive planes like a Extra or a Pitts, which won't even translate, in control force, break, sight picture etc, as well into the 172 they'll be flying all the time when compared to a cheap little Cessna 150.
 
@dmspilot yeah my flight school doesnt do spin training.
@James331 - their school only has 172 and 152 from what i can gather from their website. i will wait to hear back from them. actually i can check with my CFI tomorrow, he goes there when his CFI ticket is due for the endorsement or whatever requirement they have
 
Hmm, just found this

"This aircraft is not designed purely for aerobatic flight. However, in the acquisition of various certificates such as commercial pilot and flight instructor, certain maneuvers are required by the FAA. All of these maneuvers are permitted in this airplane when operated in the utility category."

"In the utility category, the rear seat must not be occupied and the baggage compartment must be empty."

"Utility category maneuvers and recommended entry speed:"
Chandelles- 105 knots
Lazy eights - 105 knots
Steep turns - 95 knots
Spins - slow deceleration
Stalls (except whip stalls) - slow deceleration

"Abrupt use of the controls is prohibited above 98 knots."




Did they tell you the plane wasn't able to do spins?

I'd take issue if they didn't know the limitations of their own fleet, I'd also be concerned if they didn't hire a caliber of CFIs, or rather pay for a caliber of CFIs, where they wouldn't have a issue giving you some spin training.

If you're still early on in your training, I might shop around a little for a different school.
 
Is it fair to ask why verifying the capability of a 172SP was a SGOTI question instead of the students thorough reading of the POH?
 
James331 said:
Hmm, just found this

"This aircraft is not designed purely for aerobatic flight. However, in the acquisition of various certificates such as commercial pilot and flight instructor, certain maneuvers are required by the FAA. All of these maneuvers are permitted in this airplane when operated in the utility category."

"In the utility category, the rear seat must not be occupied and the baggage compartment must be empty."

"Utility category maneuvers and recommended entry speed:"
Chandelles- 105 knots
Lazy eights - 105 knots
Steep turns - 95 knots
Spins - slow deceleration
Stalls (except whip stalls) - slow deceleration

"Abrupt use of the controls is prohibited above 98 knots."




Did they tell you the plane wasn't able to do spins?

I'd take issue if they didn't know the limitations of their own fleet, I'd also be concerned if they didn't hire a caliber of CFIs, or rather pay for a caliber of CFIs, where they wouldn't have a issue giving you some spin training.

If you're still early on in your training, I might shop around a little for a different school.
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They said they don't do spin training and something about the gyros not playing very well with aerobatic maneuvers. Either ways, they don't teach spin here and this is the only flight school here. Other one is an hour away, and where I am going for spin is 3 hrs away. Got a fantastic CFI gets me and is working with me, have very good experience and is a great teacher....

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WannFly said:
They said they don't do spin training and something about the gyros not playing very well with aerobatic maneuvers. Either ways, they don't teach spin here and this is the only flight school here. Other one is an hour away, and where I am going for spin is 3 hrs away. Got a fantastic CFI gets me and is working with me, have very good experience and is a great teacher....

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Is the 172SP a G1000?
 
James331 said:
Is the 172SP a G1000?
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Still has a mechanical gyro standby AI. That said you could argue that the gyro argument is an old wive's tale but I am not knowledgable enough to participate in such an argument.
 
dmspilot said:
Still has a mechanical gyro standby AI. That said you could argue that the gyro argument is an old wive's tale but I am not knowledgable enough to participate in such an argument.
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I guess we can open a whole new thread on that... or it might already exist on this forum somewhere buried deep

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WannFly said:
Yes. All glass in every one of them and I don't like them a bit

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Then the gyro excuse is BS

That system is solid state, you ain't going to hurt Jack spinning it, minus maybe the backup steam AI, but you could even pull the breaker for that.

I'm glad you like your CFI, but as a guys who's had good instruction and not so good instruction, these things would toss a major red flag for me, also the G1000 172 is a very expensive and less than ideal plane for a student (VFR) pilot.
 
One thing that a lot of people do not seem to understand is that spinning is the absolute lowest form of energy for a plane still in the air (not counting hammerheads of course). If you ever get completely wadded up in IMC, the stall spin allows you to descend without hitting anything provided you stop before dirt level. Remember, you're unintentionally in IMC or otherwise disoriented so an upright spin is a known condition and, if you are used to it because you practice it all the time, an easy and simple condition to exit once you can see again.

I do three turns to the left and three to the right several times a week :)
 
lolachampcar said:
One thing that a lot of people do not seem to understand is that spinning is the absolute lowest form of energy for a plane still in the air (not counting hammerheads of course). If you ever get completely wadded up in IMC, the stall spin allows you to descend without hitting anything provided you stop before dirt level. Remember, you're unintentionally in IMC or otherwise disoriented so an upright spin is a known condition and, if you are used to it because you practice it all the time, an easy and simple condition to exit once you can see again.

I do three turns to the left and three to the right several times a week :)
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Or, --->relax<---and trust in your instruments and training.
 
Really? Are you really suggesting that a VFR pilot finding himself in IMC should spin out of the clouds? OMG! Yea, that's a great idea!
 
Go one better, find an intro to aerobatics course after you get your PPL. I did an eight lesson intro in a Citabria between my PPL and IR, it was a blast!
 
FlySince9 said:
Really? Are you really suggesting that a VFR pilot finding himself in IMC should spin out of the clouds? OMG! Yea, that's a great idea!
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And once VMC turn his smoke on and do a snap roll lol
 
Notice the suggestion came after one finds themselves completely out of control. What's your suggestion?; rip the tail or wings off or simply auger in and make a big hole?

Come on folks, I'm not suggesting you get in this situation for fun. I'm only suggesting you keep trying to solve it until you hit the ground versus going along for the ride.

That said, I'm new around here so I will leave it to the resident experts to determine what is and is not useful discussion.
 
lolachampcar said:
That said, I'm new around here so I will leave it to the resident experts to determine what is and is not useful discussion.
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Whoa, hang around for a bit. I've never heard the strategy of spinning down out of IMC, but it's something to think about. Stick around and offer up ideas. If you could keep the shiny side up, a leaf stall might work as well.
 
lolachampcar said:
Notice the suggestion came after one finds themselves completely out of control. What's your suggestion?; rip the tail or wings off or simply auger in and make a big hole?

Come on folks, I'm not suggesting you get in this situation for fun. I'm only suggesting you keep trying to solve it until you hit the ground versus going along for the ride.

That said, I'm new around here so I will leave it to the resident experts to determine what is and is not useful discussion.
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Well the flaw in the logic is this, if you can't even handle straight and level, yet you're going to preform an aerobatic maneuver in IMC, hold that spin till VMC, potentially low level AGL, and recover before hitting the ground?
 
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