Snow

silver-eagle said:
4 wheel drive just gets you stuck in worse places.
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That can be true but AWD/4WD vehicles have a big traction advantage on slippery surfaces. There is a certain amount of torque that will result in wheel slippage. When the force is spread over 4 rather than 2 wheels you can be moving when the 2WD vehicle is just spinning it's wheels.
 
nddons said:
We used to go to Vermont for 10 days every Christmas from 2001-2005, and I thought the roads were very good back then. I didn't know about the studded tires rule.
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Studded tires are illegal in Michigan. The place where I bought my snows here in Vermont advertised that my tires were studdable, so I'm pretty sure VT allows them.

I could be wrong. I'm a recent transplant to this state, so I still have a lot to learn about it.

FWIW, if studded tires had an appreciable effect on roads I would think VT of all states would outlaw them. They do limit when you can drive with winter tires, I think it's November through April (again, don't quote me on the dates as that is just what I recall being told).
 
A friend of mine just bought a ford taurus sho 4 wheel drive he was asking about snow tires and if they made that big of sufferance. I told him yes and to get some narrow steel rim that would fit or his brakes. At least find the narrowest rims that would fit.
Taking none of my advise he bought another set of stock wide aluminum rims and some blizzaks
He was amazed with the improvement. I told him just think how much better they would be if he didn't get the wide ones. Plus they would have been cheaper.
I was kind of shocked because normally research thing. But I betting he like the "cool" look of the big wife tires.
 
Gary F said:
That can be true but AWD/4WD vehicles have a big traction advantage on slippery surfaces. There is a certain amount of torque that will result in wheel slippage. When the force is spread over 4 rather than 2 wheels you can be moving when the 2WD vehicle is just spinning it's wheels.
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And 4WD is the only thing that keeps my dually going the right direction. Four tires spreading the already light tear end load is great for pulling trailers, not so good in snow.

Is it technically a 6x6? ;)
 
RJM62 said:
When I started driving, snow tires were only recommended on the driven wheels. Now we know that they should be on all four for maximum effectiveness.
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I used to live about 100mi north of NYC and used to drive to VT every weekend to ski. I had an old beater Jetta and I found some old steel rims and mounted up four Nokian Hakkapeliitta studded snow tires. That car would go anywhere, anytime, even up hills that had 4wd trucks spinning.

The Finns know a thing or two about how to make a good snow tire.
 
I run fat all season tires on my sports car. The tires don't really matter its the low clearance that gets me.

High Sierra snow is easy to drive in, we tend to have dry snow and seldom see ice.

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They're predicting up to 10 inches of wet snow for my neck of the woods and most of the surrounding region this Wednesday and into Thursday. That wouldn't normally be a problem, but with most of the state's snow-removal resources in Buffalo, it might be.

Of course, the very worst thing that could possibly happen would be if Andy Cuomo were to don his cape and take charge of the snow-removal efforts on I-87 and NY17 / I-86. That would guarantee that nothing in the Northeastern United States moved until some time in mid-December.

Rich
 
ClimbnSink said:
Studs do not harm roads, that is an old wives tale.
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Um, no it's not.

When Wisconsin allowed metal studded snow tires in the 1970s, all of the Milwaukee-area freeways ended up with visible damage. Driving on them you could feel an actual "groove" where your tires rode.

You simply can't have millions of metal stone chippers eating away at your roadways without the cost exceeding the benefit. I don't remember what resurfacing cost, but it wasn't cheap.
 
During a snow storm last year Deval here in MA put us all under house arrest. Declared travel(including pedestrian) off limits for all non essential people. Truly amazing, but since no one blinked it will migrate from the birthplace(and death) of liberty to the rest of the country.
RJM62 said:
They're predicting up to 10 inches of wet snow for my neck of the woods and most of the surrounding region this Wednesday and into Thursday. That wouldn't normally be a problem, but with most of the state's snow-removal resources in Buffalo, it might be.

Of course, the very worst thing that could possibly happen would be if Andy Cuomo were to don his cape and take charge of the snow-removal efforts on I-87 and NY17 / I-86. That would guarantee that nothing in the Northeastern United States moved until some time in mid-December.

Rich
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Jay Honeck said:
Um, no it's not.

When Wisconsin allowed metal studded snow tires in the 1970s, all of the Milwaukee-area freeways ended up with visible damage. Driving on them you could feel an actual "groove" where your tires rode.

You simply can't have millions of metal stone chippers eating away at your roadways without the cost exceeding the benefit. I don't remember what resurfacing cost, but it wasn't cheap.
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Some of those grooves still exist!
 
Speaking of snow, here in the Northeast we're really getting hit. 6-12 inches across VT. The snow is heavy and wet, so there is some concern about power outages.

How is everyone else over this way doing?
 
azure said:
Speaking of snow, here in the Northeast we're really getting hit. 6-12 inches across VT. The snow is heavy and wet, so there is some concern about power outages.

How is everyone else over this way doing?
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We have between 6" and 8" here. Apparently Commandant Cuomo has kept his nose out of the snow-removal efforts, as evidenced by the fact that traffic hasn't ground to a halt throughout the region.

I was doing some snow-tire tests today for another forum I belong to, so I took some pictures. I won't bore you with the test results other than to say that General Altimax Arctic studded snow tires get a hearty thumbs-up from me as an excellent winter tire and an excellent match for the Kia Soul.

Rich
 

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Rain/slush with a little accumulation in near coastal MA. I postponed my drive to VT until tomorrow, such good ADM. Or is it being a sissy?
 
Looks a lot like it does here, Rich. I climbed up the local defunct ski hill this afternoon as it started to come down -- wish I'd snapped some pictures now.

Greg, I'd call your decision a wise one. All the highways up here are congested and slow. You might not arrive before tomorrow anyway.
 
azure said:
Speaking of snow, here in the Northeast we're really getting hit. 6-12 inches across VT. The snow is heavy and wet, so there is some concern about power outages.



How is everyone else over this way doing?
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http://youtu.be/uFN_tBT-xZE

Lucky! We were in Manchester, VT on Christmas Day 2002 or 2003 when they had 26" of snow. They had it cleared by the following morning, because we were heading up into the Green Mountains to snowmobile. Impressive work!
 
New York actually does a very good job with snow removal when the suits stay out of it and let the highway guys do their thing. Our illustrious governor, unfortunately, has a hard time doing that. He loves jumping in and managing the snow-removal efforts, which would be fine except that he sucks at it.

This time, however, it looks like he left it to the experts, and traffic kept moving. I had three brothers and a cousin (along with wives and kids) all make their way north today. They did so against my advice (I suggested they come tomorrow), but nonetheless completed the trip almost without incident.

The exception was one cousin from Florida who slipped off the road on the last leg -- the hill to my parents' place -- because he was too macho to accept multiple offers of a ride in better-equipped vehicles with experienced winter drivers. That was the only incident. The highway parts of their trips all went fine despite snowfall rates of 2 to 3 inches / hour.

As for where I live, we have the crews from the village, the township, and the county out there plowing snow 24/7 for as long as it comes down. They really do a great job. That's high praise coming from a Libertarian.

Now if only I could say the same for the guy I pay to plow my driveway. He never showed up at all today. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt for now. He may plan to arrive closer to the end of the storm. But if he neither shows up, calls, nor has a reasonable explanation, I'll have to consider either replacing him or buying a snow blower.

Rich
 
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